Overlay

Moderator: Ken Berry

chris_h

Overlay

Post by chris_h »

Hey,

I'm new to Ulead - I used to use Pinnacle but found this and its so much better!
One thing I'm having problems with is that I don't seem to be able to add transitions to overlays, is this possible? Also are you able to add transitions to the beginning of a movie (ie so the first clip on a movie can fade in)?

Cheers
Chris
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Post by sjj1805 »

No to use transitions on overlay tracks you need MediaStudio.

I have written an article about the use of transitions in VideoStudio.
Click Here
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Post by Ken Berry »

For a fade-in at the beginning of a movie, simply insert a colour matte image, say black, before your first video. Adjust its duration. Then insert a Cross Fade transition between the matte image and the video with the duration you want.
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Overlay Transitions

Post by Ken Veal »

Hi
Try adding transitions inbetween your clips in the video track of a new project then render that to a new file, then add that new file in your original project as an overlay
regards Ken V
meshuken

Post by meshuken »

Kenneth, would your suggestion "lose a generation"?

This generation thing in a digital medium has always made me curious. I know that when shooting in VHS or film every copy you made lost a "generation" or caused the product to be slightly degraded. With digital, because it is all "O"s and "1"s I thought the losing a generation was a thing of the past. I though a digital copy was an *exact* copy of teh original.

But I have noticed that on this board losing a generation is reffered to when making a copy.

Why would digital copies lose generations when they are really just "0"s and "1"s? Shouldn't all successive generations and exports be the same as the original?

Curiously,

ME
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Post by Ken Berry »

I don't pretend to understand it, but it certainly can happen when you transcode or re-render. It all has to do with codecs and compression, and more to the point, the algorithms used in the compression. DV/AVI, for example, is a compressed format, but the way in which it encodes causes no discernible loss of quality over multiple 'generations'. And there are other codecs out there which are similarly non "lossy".

But there are also a lot of other formats which apply different compression algorithms and which are quite lossy. Unfortunately, mpeg-2 -- the format for standard video DVDs -- is one of them. It is much more compressed than DV, and will lose quality from generation to generation. In applying the compression, quite a lot of the 0s and 1s that you mention are removed, and this happens each time video in that format is re-coded or rendered. The first re-render may not produce any quality loss which is visible to the naked eye, but the effect will become worse the more that re-rendering or recoding occurs. And it *will* become noticeable.

Some of our colleagues on this Board have been running experiments to see how many times rendering can occur on the same video before loss of quality is visible. And the results tend to be encouraging. But when using 'Smart Render' in Video Studio, for instance, which is supposed to only re-render those parts of your video which you have specifically edited, the trick seems to be to un-check the box for non-square pixel rendering. And you only check the box again when you reach the burning stage.

This is a long way of getting back to Kenneth's suggestion. If your project is in DV format, and you make the overlay video suggested by Kenneth in that format too, then when you rendered the overlay and main video track into a single file, while the overlay track would be re-rendered, the generational loss of quality would simply not be noticeable at all because it is DV. But the same might not be the case if you used mpeg-2 or one of the even more compressed formats like mpeg-4 or DivX/Xvid.
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Post by heinz-oz »

I would beg to differ a wee bit here Ken, based on my own experiences.

Whilst DV-AVI is virtually lossless in its virgin state the recoding of a new DV-AVI file from an existing clip will degenerate slightly. Even playing an edited clip back to tape from the time line will not be the same clarity. You will notice this particularly in the areas where you added transitions and/or titles.

That's why I decided to go the full monty and upgraded to MSP from VS5. I found that, whilst it was possible to work around shortcomings of VS, I wasn't prepared to take the quality hit associated with it. If you only do it once, no problem really. If you do it repeatedly, like when you create one video file to use on the overlay track the next time, you will notice it.

That is exactly the reason why I don't suggest to people to render short clips back to DV-AVI after adding filters, transitions, etc. to be used in another project later, just to avoid having to get a larger HDD.

Still, if I had to take such an approach to overcome a shortcoming of my program, I would much rather do that in DV-AVI than any other format.
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Post by blplhp »

When I want to add transitions between overlay clips, I open a new project file and add the DV_AVI video clips I want to use for the overlays to my "video track" on the timeline. I add the transitions I want, then I save the project file as a .vsp file, I don't render it as an mpeg file in the Share|Create Video Disc step.

Next, I open up my original project file (.vsp), and import the overlay .vsp project file onto the overlay track of the timeline.

The result is an overlay track that has transitions, but still keeps the same quality level with no "generation" loss.

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Post by Black Lab »

Bryan, this is the second or third time I have read your tip, and I always say "what a great idea", but I never remember to do it! :oops:
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Post by blplhp »

Thanks Jeff,

But I have to give the credit to Charlie Hills. I read his entire book called "Getting Results with Video Studio 9", and it has a wealth of information in it. He has one long comprehensive chapter dedicated to nothing but "work arounds" for the short comings of VS9 (VS10+ similar). I learned so much from this book, that it has not only given me the confidence to perform these tasks in my own video productions, but to confidently respond to questions in this forum, even though I am still relatively new to video editing. And if I over step my bounds or provide inaccurate information, I hope the more experienced users of this forum will kindly let me know. I would highly recommend Charlie Hills' book (it comes as a CD ROM that has a printable .pdf file of the entire CD) even to some of the experienced video editors out there just for this chapter alone (of course only for those that don't know most of the work-arounds available).

But thanks again for the pat on the back. It's nice to know that I can offer some value to this highly esteemed forum group.

Bryan P.
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Post by Black Lab »

Thanks for the tip. I actually have the electronic version of Charlie's book, but just have never had the chance to go through the whole thing. Probably should have just bought the physical book - would have been much easier to read that way. So when I have some free time maybe I'll read the whole thing...and remember to use your tip. :roll:
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Post by blplhp »

Jeff,

It sounds like time is a precious commodity for you, as it is for me, I would suggest reading only Chapter 6 of Charlie Hills CD book. Just print out that chapter using Adobe Reader and go thru Chapter 6 only. That's where all of the "work-arounds" are described in detail, step-by-step. You don't need to use the sample files Charlie references in this chapter, I just used my own video clips on my hard drive to follow along.

Cheers,

Bryan P.
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Post by sjj1805 »

Black Lab wrote:Bryan, this is the second or third time I have read your tip, and I always say "what a great idea", but I never remember to do it! :oops:
I must admit I've read this before and keep forgetting it.
I've now inserted a link to this post in the Tutorials sections:

Useful Tips - All Ulead Products.

Frequently Asked Questions
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Post by Black Lab »

blplhp wrote:Jeff,

It sounds like time is a precious commodity for you, as it is for me, I would suggest reading only Chapter 6 of Charlie Hills CD book. Just print out that chapter using Adobe Reader and go thru Chapter 6 only. That's where all of the "work-arounds" are described in detail, step-by-step. You don't need to use the sample files Charlie references in this chapter, I just used my own video clips on my hard drive to follow along.
Thanks for this tip too! :wink:
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Post by lakewud »

More fine reading from this forum...but once again..at a loss to make head or tail of proceedings.

To keep my query simple, and I know Ive asked it before, and been referred back to various threads time and again...

This generation loss thang, my method of creating a video, effects and all..then going into create video file, do your menu titles and render onto a disk....this works fine. To make another 10 for example disks..i..perhaps do it the long way...but, once again start afresh so to speak, loading my finished projected warts n all, create video file, messing around with the menu settings and saving to a disk..Happy to bungle along this road, as for me, only means messing around with the dvd menu options time and again...

But, of course...im curious as to this other way, my way, I dont lose any noticable quality ( as - im guessing here - it is only rendered the once, just have to go through the same long process each time i want a copy ).

So, what if, i have two or more saved projects..both totally different but wanting them on the same disk..how can i ensure the best possible quality in this case, i can create video file for one...automatically goes onto the timeline..but how do i bring in the other project - unless ive rendered it first ( and to my mind..this loses the quality ).

Only ask, because find it fustrating..everyone wants the best possible quality after they have spent many days and weeks on a project. I have tried before doing it the way thats mentioned on here, this is rendering it first and then making my copies from there..but the quality i really noticed deteriated...because it must be rendering twice?