Having answered a query on MPEG4 and an Archos earlier I was wondering to what use (other than for playing on may Archos) could I put MPEG4 compression.
I am currently archiving my 8mm tapes to mini-DV tape and also making DVD's for the family to watch conveniently.
Given the source is pretty low-band 8mm (not Hi-8) I was wondering if I could make use of MPEG4 compression for DVD's without a noticable loss of quality when played back from a disc on TV.
My DVD player will play MPEG4 (DivX) discs (it plays files formatted for the Archos and transferred to a data DVD).
My understanding is that DVD is MPEG2 so with that thought in mind I was wondering if one could have a disc that had a DVD structure but with MPEG4 instead of MPEG2 data?
If so I could create normal DVD menus but link the menu entires to MPEG4 fles and get quite a bit more onto a single disc.
Or should I just lower the bit rate of normal MPEG2 and be happy with two hours per disc?
Dave
Can DVD's have MPEG4 content?
Moderator: Ken Berry
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jchunter
You asked if you could have a: "disc that had a DVD structure but with MPEG4 instead of MPEG2 data."
AFAIK, the DVD structure is different. A Divx DVD has a structure that is like a computer file. Divx certified DVD players can read the highly compressed Divx or Mpeg4 file and decompress it into a high frequency bitstream in real time. You can convert your Mpeg2 video file to Divx or Mpeg4 using Video Studio 9 with the HDV plugin. The files that I have converted are 1/4 to 1/3 of the size of the original Mpeg2 file. Thus, you can put 3 - 4 times as much video (more, actually) on a DVD.
I can select Divx compressed AVI files into the SHARE/Create Disk/ Add Video file but have never let VS9 continue the burn. I have suspicions that VS9 would try to convert the file back to mpeg2 before the burn... Converting videos in the Burn module usually turns out badly.
You can use programs such as Roxio's DVD Creator to write the Divx file to a DVD. But there is no facility to add menus (on my version).
The downside of a data DVD is that the only DVD players that will play it are Divx certified, which is a very small percentage of installed DVD players.
John
AFAIK, the DVD structure is different. A Divx DVD has a structure that is like a computer file. Divx certified DVD players can read the highly compressed Divx or Mpeg4 file and decompress it into a high frequency bitstream in real time. You can convert your Mpeg2 video file to Divx or Mpeg4 using Video Studio 9 with the HDV plugin. The files that I have converted are 1/4 to 1/3 of the size of the original Mpeg2 file. Thus, you can put 3 - 4 times as much video (more, actually) on a DVD.
I can select Divx compressed AVI files into the SHARE/Create Disk/ Add Video file but have never let VS9 continue the burn. I have suspicions that VS9 would try to convert the file back to mpeg2 before the burn... Converting videos in the Burn module usually turns out badly.
You can use programs such as Roxio's DVD Creator to write the Divx file to a DVD. But there is no facility to add menus (on my version).
The downside of a data DVD is that the only DVD players that will play it are Divx certified, which is a very small percentage of installed DVD players.
John
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DaveO
Yes, I know the structure is different. I have several DivX DVD's I have made and they present as a list of files when I put them in my Pioneer 575 DVD player that is DicX capable.jchunter wrote:You asked if you could have a: "disc that had a DVD structure but with MPEG4 instead of MPEG2 data."
AFAIK, the DVD structure is different. A Divx DVD has a structure that is like a computer file. Divx certified DVD players can read the highly compressed Divx or Mpeg4 file and decompress it into a high frequency bitstream in real time. You can convert your Mpeg2 video file to Divx or Mpeg4 using Video Studio 9 with the HDV plugin. The files that I have converted are 1/4 to 1/3 of the size of the original Mpeg2 file. Thus, you can put 3 - 4 times as much video (more, actually) on a DVD.
What I was wondering was that given MPEG2 and MPEG4 are just different compression techmologies was there any reason why the MPEG2 content of a DVD could not be replaced by content compressed using MPEG4.
So, when you load the DVD you get a DVD menu (created as normal) but when you select from the menu the content that is actually played is compressed as MPEG4 not MPEG2.
I have just made data DVD's in the past with Nero and they seem to play in my Pioneer OK so I guess that is doing the same as you.You can use programs such as Roxio's DVD Creator to write the Divx file to a DVD. But there is no facility to add menus (on my version).
Yes I know but the discs would be for my own use and I just thought if you could have a nice traditional DVD menu menu that lead to MPEG4 content it would make the user interface more acceptable to the family.The downside of a data DVD is that the only DVD players that will play it are Divx certified, which is a very small percentage of installed DVD players.
Dave
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jchunter
Dave,
This whole subject seems murky - especially when you mix in the clear possibility that mpeg4 and Divx are able to compress high definition video enough to pack it into a standard DVD platter. It seems to make high definition DVD disks (Blu Ray, etc.) unnecessary. Probably a good thing because they don't seem to work yet anyway.
In any case, replacing Mpeg2 with mpeg4 in a DVD is probably a lot harder than it seems. AFAIK, there are no video DVD burning software apps that will do what you suggest.
BTW, DirectTV plans to use mpeg4 to encode its high definition channels for transmission from their satellites.
John
This whole subject seems murky - especially when you mix in the clear possibility that mpeg4 and Divx are able to compress high definition video enough to pack it into a standard DVD platter. It seems to make high definition DVD disks (Blu Ray, etc.) unnecessary. Probably a good thing because they don't seem to work yet anyway.
In any case, replacing Mpeg2 with mpeg4 in a DVD is probably a lot harder than it seems. AFAIK, there are no video DVD burning software apps that will do what you suggest.
BTW, DirectTV plans to use mpeg4 to encode its high definition channels for transmission from their satellites.
John
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heinz-oz
I may be way out of my depth here but, AFAIK, DVD standard is based on mpeg2 compression. It will not work with mpeg1, only as a VCD or SVCD, not DVD and not mpeg4. mpeg4 is meant for HD and nobody is yet willing to bet on which format is going to be adopted in the end, blue ray being one of them.
DivX also uses mpeg4 but adifferent flavour. thats why people are having so many issues when they try to include DivX clips into VS9 projects. The rendering times are horribly long, because VS is recoding the mpeg4/DivX coded clips back to mpeg2.
I'm afraid, you can't have your cake and eat it. If your DVD player can play DivX, fine, but don't expect to be able to use normal DVD structure.
DivX also uses mpeg4 but adifferent flavour. thats why people are having so many issues when they try to include DivX clips into VS9 projects. The rendering times are horribly long, because VS is recoding the mpeg4/DivX coded clips back to mpeg2.
I'm afraid, you can't have your cake and eat it. If your DVD player can play DivX, fine, but don't expect to be able to use normal DVD structure.
OK Dave... I see you're getting in touch with your "inner hacker"....What I was wondering was that given MPEG2 and MPEG4 are just different compression techmologies was there any reason why the MPEG2 content of a DVD could not be replaced by content compressed using MPEG4.
I really wouldn't expect your player to play the resulting DVD, but you could try replacing the MPEG-2 VOB files with MPEG-4 VOB files.
- Author the DVD as usual. Create the DVD "image" on your hard drive by checking Create DVD Folders in the Advanced Settings window. This will create the AUDIO_TS and VIDEO_TS folders on your hard drive. (I don't know if you can do that without also burning an actual DVD... You can with Movie Factory or DVD Workshop.)
- Open the VOB files one-by-one and save them as MPEG-4. (You might have to change the filenames to .MPG before opening tham... and back to .VOB after saving them.)
- Use your "data" burning software to copy the (empty) AUDIO_TS and (new) VIDEO_TS folders to a DVD.
A couple of DVD "hacking" programs you might find useful:.
IFOedit (FREE!!!)
VOBedit (FREE!!!)
DVD ReBuilder (FREE!!!)
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heinz-oz
I'm afraid it will take a lot more than renaming an mpeg2 to mpeg4. It's a completely different compression algorithmn. When you create your DVD folders, the required VOB's are created using the mpeg2 compression. Do you see a possibility to select mpeg4 there in lieu of mpeg2? I don't have VS9 and therefore can't check this. I daubt it very much though. If you can select mpeg4 as output, go for it and let us know how it went.