VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by Pepi »

snowstorm wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:00 pm Mercalli Pro tells me to press the Analyze Button.....
Unless I am totally blind I can't find this button.....
A dummy question: did you selected the customize filter?
VS-Forum-Mercalli.png
The button is on next screen.
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by lata »

snowstorm wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:00 pm For me none of the Mercalli features are working.;Picture Enhanz;Mercalli Pro;Mercalli RT
Mercalli Pro tells me to press the Analyze Button.....
Unless I am totally blind I can't find this button.....

Any ideas...

snowstorm
Double click your clip to open the options panels, effects tab -- customise to open Mercalli to allow Analyse

When you first add the mercalli effect you should see the above panel
Regards Trevor
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by Ken Berry »

Getting back to Snake11's problem for a moment, there has been a lot of discussion in the past of Mercalli in its much earlier version 2. We're going back several years now. But at that time it seemed that the Project Properties had to be set to produce progressive i.e. non-interlaced video, for Mercalli to work properly. My second experiment above, where I had to repeat once but not after that, happened to be set to progressive, which may have been a factor in Mercalli eventually working.

In other words, you can have interlaced video in a project, but the project itself, and the eventual render, has to be set to progressive. Otherwise, Mercalli will cause problems.

So I am wondering what your Project Properties are set to, Trevor and Snake11...?
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by lata »

First all my Project Settings matched my video files Properties for every test I ran.

I am aware of problems regarding Mercalli and having to analyse again.
Personally I have not had problems provided I control the project settings and my render properties, in the past I worked extensively with MTS 25fps Upper Field first and had no issues using Mercalli.
Of course we recommend matching our Project Settings to our video files Properties, then to render using same settings, frame rate is essential to match.

After applying Mercalli it is important to retain the project properties especially the frame rate although the frame size may have some influence, of course mixing video types may also be a problem when working with Mercalli.

I have just used 2021 with MTS video using 25fps Interlaced upper field, applied Mercalli, rendered to Project Settings and Same as Clip, no issues
I then rendered using avchd but selecting the 50P option, this rendered showing the Mercalli banner requesting to Analyse again, clearly a bit late in the day as the timeline was clear, but rendering using a different frame rate as to when Mercalli was applied causes problems
There are so many variables in identifying the problems but for me one thing is certain it appears to work better when all settings match.

As for the problem I experience using 2021, this is a problem with the program itself and not related to my settings or video type, the same can be said for Snake11 work
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by Davidk »

On my testing, it appears to also be dependent on the format of the video clips used.
using SD (720x576) mpg clips, once set on multiple clips: no problems.
using FHD (1920x1080) using mp4 clips, the first clip would analyse Ok, but after the 2nd clip had been analysed, the 1st clip is reporting it needs re-analysis. Again.
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by lata »

Davidk wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:29 pm On my testing, it appears to also be dependent on the format of the video clips used.
using SD (720x576) mpg clips, once set on multiple clips: no problems.
using FHD (1920x1080) using mp4 clips, the first clip would analyse Ok, but after the 2nd clip had been analysed, the 1st clip is reporting it needs re-analysis. Again.
Thanks David, that prompts me to test Mpeg2 720 x 576 interlaced, lower field first
Same issue, applied to first clip, then applied to another clip, first clip requires analysing again.
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by Davidk »

Trevor,
My SD clips were upper field first. Just how they appeared in the TL - no special action to set that. See screenshot
mercalli SD project.jpg
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by Pepi »

Davidk wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:29 pm using FHD (1920x1080) using mp4 clips, the first clip would analyse Ok, but after the 2nd clip had been analysed, the 1st clip is reporting it needs re-analysis. Again.
I actually had four clips, but have you tested, if you click between the clips, do you get different results? For me it behaves so, that once analyze was required, then later (even I did not analyzed) the same clip was not required to be analyzed. And then few clicks between clips, and again analyze was required.
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by snowstorm »

Many thanks pepi and lata

Can now use Mercalli.
Strange on my first few attemps to use Mercalli VS was automatically shutting down.....
Now every thing is back to normal...

Thanks again...

snowstorm :shock: :wink:
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by Davidk »

Trevor,
something that slipped my mind last nite about properties on that 1st of 2 clips: when importing I got the message about setting properties to match the 1st clip; yes to that.

Pepi,
No, didn't test by clicking between the clips. Altho I've not ever seen any functional spec/description of Mercalli before, on past experience, the length of the clip is what matters. If you add a transition, for example, that changes the length of the clip and you get a re-analyze message. Often in the final render if you are not aware of this and do the scan before changing things like transitions, trims etc that modify clip length. So as a good work practice, apply mercalli to anything that needs it last.

So on this test, I simply checked that mercalli worked as expected on mpg clips (yes: upper field 1st) and on mp4 clips (no) - as reported here. If mercalli is not working without any change to clip length, fault report it. Even tho Corel has an abysmal record of responding to bug reports, if you don't report it nothing will change.
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by tletter »

Davidk wrote:If you add a transition, for example, that changes the length of the clip and you get a re-analyze message.
Fortunately, I've never experienced this with adding/removing a transition using either Mercalli 2 or 4, as it would make editing a nightmare. Adding/removing a transition doesn't change the actual chosen duration of a clip, rather it changes the apparent duration. Hence Mercalli, which works on the actual chosen duration, doesn't need to be rerun if a transition is either added or deleted.
Davidk wrote: So as a good work practice, apply mercalli to anything that needs it last.
The problem with this approach is that if you use track/custom motion, and apply Mercalli last, then the track will not shift to reflect the changes made by Mercalli. Hence, I'd suggest applying Mercalli first.

Perhaps in VS2021, there is a Mercalli implementation issue, but I've not seen it in prior versions of VS.

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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by Snake11 »

Davidk wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:29 pm using FHD (1920x1080) using mp4 clips, the first clip would analyse Ok, but after the 2nd clip had been analysed, the 1st clip is reporting it needs re-analysis. Again.
I have the same issue.
Tried to change Project Properties, but nothing changed about Mercalli. Still the same problem. Maybe the only way is to reinstall software?
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by lata »

As for changing clip length by trimming the clip will cause Analyse again.
I have never had a problem in adding a transition as the length of the clip does not change, and agree with tletter

Changing the project properties, changing the frame rate will affect the number of frames in the clip, then Mercalli will be required again.
Set the project properties to 25fps, then render to 50P, although timelines will show as ok, Mercalli will show on the rendered video.

Basically set the project properties correctly, do not change the length of the clip after applying Mercalli, render to same properties and Mercalli should be ok.

The issue now is that with all settings correct we still see the Analyse option re-appearing

Post Updated

I did suggest to Corel that they make Save Trimmed Video available after applying Mercalli, then the clip could be replaced, the option could be made automatic.
That would also avoid any extra analyse and fix any issues using Smart Packages
Regards Trevor
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by glus »

Snake11 wrote: Fri Feb 19, 2021 9:41 pm ...when I add Mercalli to one clip, click "Analase" and accept it - everything is okay in this clip, but another clip needs "analyse" again. So, I click "analyse" for second clip and I have the same situation for clip one which I stabilized before.
Reproducible also here, thank you for the details. Bug posted and under investigation.
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Re: VS 2021 Ultimate Mercalli

Post by lata »

glus wrote: Mon Feb 22, 2021 6:51 pm
Snake11 wrote: Fri Feb 19, 2021 9:41 pm ...when I add Mercalli to one clip, click "Analase" and accept it - everything is okay in this clip, but another clip needs "analyse" again. So, I click "analyse" for second clip and I have the same situation for clip one which I stabilized before.
Reproducible also here, thank you for the details. Bug posted and under investigation.
Thanks Nick
Regards Trevor