Re-creating smart proxy files

[Davidk]

I have an old (?!) vsp using HD clips. The preferences have smart proxy enabled, resolution for 'files above' set to 720x576, and auto template on. It's my understanding that these settings will auto create the smart proxy files if they don't exist, and that's what was done for the past usage of the vsp.

For reasons of storage and backup management I deleted the old proxy files some time ago (after the project time was over), but I retained the actual project components. Now that I want to re-use the old vsp, X10 opens it Ok, but won't auto re-create the proxy files despite the proxy settings. When I noticed this was happening, I had to manually do that for each one (rt click the clip, choose create proxy file from the list), and repeat as needed, with the pauses needed to allow the work.

Is there a way to automatically set proxy manager to do this (re-create proxy files if the old ones are not there any more)?

[lata]

Proxy Files are automatically created when adding video clips to the project.
If you have deleted the proxy files then no auto creation can take place.

The option is to right click and choose Create Proxy files this can be done on the timeline or library.
Pressing Shift + Click first and last clip or Keyboard Ctrl+ A will select all clips
Then right click selection for Create Proxy Files, files will be created for all appropriate clips.

[Davidk]

hi Trevor,
Thanks for that. It's still manual, but at least doing all at once is better than one at a time.

I thought a bit about it, and there must be something in the vsp that 'says proxy files are available', and once found/loaded that overlaid film icon is inserted to the clip thumbnail; But if not found, VS does nothing further: no alert, no clip icon and no new proxy files. Ideally, at least the latter should happen automatically, and if not then an alert that says "proxy files not found".

[Davidk]

Re-creating proxy files . . .
Decided to do this in a new project, to avoid complications. So, opened a new project, inserted the relevant source clips (3) total size 1,111,416kb, and noted the total duration of them in a project with no other material: 3 mins 47 sec. It took about 10 minutes to create the proxy files and display the overlaid film icon on the clip thumbnails. Total .upx proxy file size: 338,701kb. Which is a 70% size reduction.

Result 1.
During this process, there was NO indication of anything happening - no message, timer icon, nothing. But if you tried to do something in X10, it seemed sluggish, very slow to to respond. Until the proxy file creation was finished.

Result 2 - unplanned discovery
The manual statements on proxy files are that any project file can use the same proxy files if the same source clip is in it. Untrue. After re-creating the proxy files from one source (a hdd copy of all the clips), I opened a new project file using the original clips - now on an SD card. Effectively, each vsp had the same files in it, just from a different location in the computer. Seemed to take a long time to get going, and when I checked the proxy file folder there were now two proxy copies of the source clips - see this screen shot:

[lata]

For part 1
yes there could be an indication that proxy files are being created, but then we should be aware of that as we activated the Smart Proxy option. But yes maybe an indication.

As for part 2
You are using two separate files, each file does have a similar name but are different files.
They could of course be completely different sizes with the same name, the folder location segregating them. Quote (a hdd copy of all the clips)

When we use a clip from the library having Smart Proxy we can use that in different projects without needing to create smart proxy files. And as far as I know using the original files from the original folder can be added to a project Having the Smart Proxy in tact.

[Davidk]

Hi Trevor,
Re proxy files, the user guide says
"Proxy files are source-dependent rather than project-dependent. In other words, proxy files can be shared among different projects."

I can't think of a more source dependant case than the same file, regardless of where it's stored. If there was or is a restriction on that, eg the library or the same folder/file, it doesn't say that in the guide.

I thought the sense of the statement in the guide was commendable - if its' same file, VS would use the same proxy if one existed. The same file is easily checked - windows does it all the time. And a check on an existing proxy file is easy - VS knows where those proxy files will be. The results indicate otherwise. But at this stage the easy solution would be to change the user guide, and if so there are specific things that ought to be included:
- just what is meant by source dependent. If that means the same file name in the same folder location, then say it.
- an estimate of just how long it takes to create a proxy file. Knowing that proxy will be done doesn't mean you know how long it takes or what the impact on VS is. On my observation, about 3x the duration of the clip (if a clip being proxied is 30 sec long, creating the proxy will take about 90 sec), and the impact is substantial - VS becomes a slug.
- provide a user display (message or icon) when the proxy creation activity is occurring, and remove it when finished.

[lata]

David
But you are using two files saved to different locations on your pc having the same name.
User Guide page 56
Proxy files are source-dependent rather than project-dependent. In other words, proxy files can be shared among different projects.

The relevant word being source-dependent

If you create proxy files for all clips in a particular folder then subsequently move or re-name that folder, source dependency has been lost, in addition to any re-link the proxy files will be removed from the proxy folder.

Windows Explorer
If you copy and paste a file windows explore may prompt us to copy / paste or replace a file if the name is the same, That has no bearing on the files content, just a duplicate name, choosing the wrong option could overwrite the original file.

We cannot compare render times as that is dependant on individual computer specs.

I have started using MPEG4 1280 x 720 proxy templates, seem to work for the tests I have done, they do seem to be faster to create
My new pc is a little faster and my MTS 1920 x 1080 don’t need proxies, will know more for the next larger project.
4K yes needs proxies., so I have set the size limit to 1920 x 1080 and created my own template.

But “source dependant” is what it says dependant on the location of the files.
Smart Packages come to mind, but that’s a different discussion.

[Davidk]

Trevor,
The of re-using proxy files is as I said, commendable, I just have/had a different view of what was a source file. And the doco made no mention of the limits as you outline them even in simple form (same folder/file).

The steady increase in computing grunt needed by VS is indicated by the basic system requirements on the box/online file. And whilst my main PC doesn't need proxies for HD files up to 1920x1080, my class laptop didn't for X9 at 1280x720, but it sure does for X10. I appreciate that times will vary based on the platform, but more than once in the last week or so I've wondered where the month of wet sundays came from trying to use VS, and proxy generation turned out to be the answer. It certainly took much longer than I expected

[lata]

Hi David
You should try creating your own proxy template, the recommended does take a while to render
As I said I am trying mpeg4 at 1280 x720 x 4000kbps which seem faster to create.
I can appreciate render taking a long time during a lesson is a problem

I tried a few template settings to compare quality and render speeds
I can give details once I get my pc booted up

[tletter]

Result 1.
During this process, there was NO indication of anything happening - no message, timer icon, nothing. But if you tried to do something in X10, it seemed sluggish, very slow to to respond. Until the proxy file creation was finished.

The status of proxy file creation can be checked using the Smart Proxy Queue Manager (see image below).

Result 2 - unplanned discovery
The manual statements on proxy files are that any project file can use the same proxy files if the same source clip is in it. Untrue.

VS does not handle reuse of proxy files very well. In fact some crashes of VS result in the need to manually recreate proxy files even though the original proxy files still exist in the Proxy Folder.

[tletter]

Result 1.
During this process, there was NO indication of anything happening - no message, timer icon, nothing. But if you tried to do something in X10, it seemed sluggish, very slow to to respond. Until the proxy file creation was finished.

The status of proxy file creation can be checked using the Smart Proxy Queue Manager (see image below).

proxy.jpg

Result 2 - unplanned discovery
The manual statements on proxy files are that any project file can use the same proxy files if the same source clip is in it. Untrue.

VS does not handle reuse of proxy files very well. In fact some crashes of VS result in the need to manually recreate proxy files even though the original proxy files still exist in the Proxy Folder.

tletter
https://www.youtube.com/user/tletter