Opinion on analog settings for project...

[ac37174]

I am working on converting about an hour's worth of 8mm analog camcorder footage to DVD. I captured to MPEG2 at 4000 VBR, upper field first, with matching project properties. Is the VBR setting too low for optimal results? I ask this because after burning a test dvd the footage looked like a second/third generation VHS copy. Audio was great, normalized and synched perfectly. As far as capture/project settings, should I bump it up to get better quality? Or perhaps capture to AVI first?

Dell Dimension 4600 2.8 G, 1G RAM
Leadtek Winfast tv tuner card
Radeon Sapphire 9250 128 MB AGP card

[bryave]

Try capturing in MPEG-2 format with frame size of 720x 480 for NTSC format with the following video bit rate to what quality you would like it to be:
High quality = 8000kbps upto 60mins per DVD
DVD Good Quality = 6000kbps upto 90mins per DVD
DVD Fair quality = 4000kbps upto 120mins per DVD
^_^

[Ken Berry]

With respect, there is probably little point in capturing from an analogue source at 8000 bps. The best image you can probably ever achieve with an analogue source would be at a maximum of 6000 bps, and probably even a little less, and any higher rate will not produce a better result.

I have that same capture card, by the way, and get good results capturing using its native software, but then doing the editing in VS9. But there seems to be a quirk, at least in my set-up, in that it captures from an analogue camera in Lower Field First, when normally it should be Upper. But it seems to work fine in my final DVDs.

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi
I my opinion you should capture to the highest bit rate that will allow the video to fit to disc.

As bryave said
8000 for up to 60 minutes.
6000 for up to 90 minutes
4000 for up to 120 minutes

The only benefits you achieve by capturing at a lower rate is the render time, and hard drive space.
Saying that I usually end up using 6000, that gives me sufficient space to allow an additional video, a slide show for example.

Using a bit rate calculator helps in assessing the rate, try this one:-

http://dvd-hq.info/Calculator.html

You captured at 4000, I would expect reasonably good quality, if the quality is very poor compared with the camera footage check, your capture settings, try Kens advice re field order, that may be the cause of the bad quality.
By the way VS 8 and 9 can detect the source field order (options tab / change field order / detect)

Trevor

[ac37174]

Hi Trevor,

I went to your Ulead help site and set up my capture settings as you suggested. There seems to be some bizarre occurrence when it comes to creating the disc that I get choppy video but only in one part. It's handheld camcorder, not fast action, but of a band playing in a recording studio, and everytime the camera panned to the left that part has some kind of dropped frames and the video gets choppy. How weird is that? The other shots had no weird frame drops after burning to disc. I recaptured at 6000 VBR to see how much of a difference it would make. Not too different from my original 4000 VBR, except that the same video problem happened in the same section. The original camcorder tape is fine and doesn't do anything weird at all during panning. This is as good as it is probably going to get, for preservation's sake. Could this be a VS9 Create Disc anomaly?My whole point is to preserve these old tapes but when the end result looks worse than the current state of the vhs copy, that's frustrating. Thanks.

[THoff]

If the video is choppy during horizontal movement or panning, you are probably using the wrong field order.

[ac37174]

Upper Field First, both for capturing and for property settings. Even more strrange, when the video was choppy post-DVD even when those shots described were start/stop record shots, not just pans. That is, if the camera started taping in that area it would look choppy after the entire project. Everything else looks great though.

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi ac
As I see it:-
Variable bit rate reduces the amount of data needed to produce a still frame, a frame with movement requires and gets more data, typically a Vbr 4000 will produce anything from 1800 to 8000 bits depending on the frame content.
If you capture to Constant Bit Rate then every frame will get the same amount.
There is enough capacity on a dvd to capture 60 minutes at 8000 kb/s, using variable, the upper and lower rates would be 8000, as though capturing Constant.
Any video longer than 60 minutes will be of lower quality, although I do not think we notice the difference unless you go to the extremes. Longer videos (over 80 minutes) may benefit from variable capture.
Try a capture using a Constant Bit Rate.
--------------------------------------------

I have tried in the passed to capture from a Vhs tape only to be disappointed in the results.

After upgrading to a digital camera that supported ‘pass-through’ I did achieve very good capture.

I am assuming that you don’t own a digital camcorder with Dv-in / out and Av-in / out.
----------------------------------------------

Upper or lower field
Not all analogue video sources use ‘upper field’ some may well be ‘lower’
Unlike a digital source which seems to be always ‘Lower’

Trevor

[ac37174]

Hi Trevor,

Unfortunately, my JVC DV Camcorder only has DV out, but a USB in for editing. Had I purchased the next model made I would have everything i need

Hi ac
As I see it:-
Variable bit rate reduces the amount of data needed to produce a still frame, a frame with movement requires and gets more data, typically a Vbr 4000 will produce anything from 1800 to 8000 bits depending on the frame content.
If you capture to Constant Bit Rate then every frame will get the same amount.
There is enough capacity on a dvd to capture 60 minutes at 8000 kb/s, using variable, the upper and lower rates would be 8000, as though capturing Constant.
Any video longer than 60 minutes will be of lower quality, although I do not think we notice the difference unless you go to the extremes. Longer videos (over 80 minutes) may benefit from variable capture.
Try a capture using a Constant Bit Rate.
--------------------------------------------

I have tried in the passed to capture from a Vhs tape only to be disappointed in the results.

After upgrading to a digital camera that supported ‘pass-through’ I did achieve very good capture.

I am assuming that you don’t own a digital camcorder with Dv-in / out and Av-in / out.
----------------------------------------------

Upper or lower field
Not all analogue video sources use ‘upper field’ some may well be ‘lower’
Unlike a digital source which seems to be always ‘Lower’

Trevor