Output video jittery and rendering problems

[Powelly_au]

Hi,
I am presently working on a HD video project in VS Ultimate X6. This is the first project I have worked on using HD video and I am experiencing 2 issues.
1. When creating the video file with an output format of Blue-ray (1920x1080), Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080), Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080, 25p) the resulting video has excessive jitter or jerky results on clips with panning video. The source video from my JVC video camera is good quality with smooth panning motion and clear picture. The best results are achieved using the “same as first video clip’ option. Also the project video when played back from the VS time line is jittery and flickers particularly vertical lines.

Can you tell me the difference between Blue-ray (1920x1080), Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080), Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080, 25p)and what would be the optimum settings to suite my source video to avoid the jitter / flickering result or should I always use the ‘same as first video clip ‘.

My PC has an Intel i5 4440 (3.1GHz) CPI and I am using the on board GPU (ie no video card). 16G Ram, 64 bit OS, Windows 7 professional.

The source video is:- .MTS, 1920x1080, 25fps, Data rate: 22387 kbps, Total bitrate: 22643 kbps. Audio bitrate 256kbps, 2 channel stereo, audio sample rate 48 kHz

The video properties of the same clips when inserted into the VS time line :- PAL HDMV, H.264 Video, Upper field first, 24bit, 1920x1080, 16:9, 25fps, Data rate Variable (Max 22599 kbps.) Dolby Audio, Total samples: 391, 680 samples, Attributes 48000Hz, layer : none, Audio bitrate 256 kbps

The video properties of the output video file when “Same as first video clip” is selected in the ‘Share’ menu: - .m2t, 1920x1080, Data rate : 22573 kbps, Total bit rate: 22829 kbps, frame rate 25 fps, Audio bit rate: 256 kbps, 2 channel stereo, audio sample rate 48 kHz

2. The second issue is when I am rendering the above video file to Blue-ray disk or folder it always spends an inordinate amount of time “converting title” even though I have the “do not convert compliant video” box ticked. This is the case regardless of whether Blue-ray (1920x1080), Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080), Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080, 25p) or same as first clip is selected. Also it appears to hang at 5% complete, even when left to render over night.

Lastly, I am going to upgrade to VS X9 Ultimate to see if any of these issues can be improved. Is there some way I can save the files containing the extras and templates obtained in VS X6 Ultimate. Are they stored in a particular file

[lata]

Hi

A few issues going on here

1 / First go to Preferences (F6) tick Show messages when inserting first video….
2 / Start a new project
3 / Insert a video file, a window will/should appear to match the video files properties, say yes

4 / Edit the project
5 / Share – Same as first clip or Same as Project Properties ( assuming 3 above)
6 / to burn a disc, start a new project to clear the timelines
7 / Share – Create Disc – Bluray should open the burner module
8 / when you hit burn the process should start with create Menu.

9 / if in 6 above there are files in the timeline then you are opening the burner module with a project VSP and not a compliant video file so Create Title will be used to convert the project when pressing burn.

For any tests create the folder rather than a disc, saves on coasters, you can view and play the folders content from the Stream folder

I do not have X6 loaded at the moment to check the templates available for Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080)

But should not be an issue when using same as first clip.

[Ken Berry]

Can you tell me the difference between Blue-ray (1920x1080), Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080), Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080, 25p)

Essentially, there are two main types of Blu-Ray video. (There is in fact a third, but we won't worry about that as it is not very common.) These are high definition transport stream mpeg-2, and high def transport stream mpeg-4 produced using the H.264 codec -- which is definitely what your options 2 and 3 above cover. Your option 1 could be either mpeg-2 or mpeg-4.

Under the international Blu-Ray standard, the video can also have a frame size of 1280 x 720 as well as the 1920 x 1080 one you mention. There are also other permissible frame formats, including 1440 x 1080.

The international standard also allows the use of both progressive ("p") and interlaced ("i") video. This includes the 25p you mention, which is for PAL countries such as Australia. NTSC countries would be 29.97 fps (which is usually shown as 30p). Also permissible are interlaced frame rates 50i (PAL) and 60i (NTSC) which confusingly can also be shown as just 25 or 30, though without a p and also showing "Upper Field First" in the video's Properties (to indicate it is interlaced rather than progressive). There is also the cinematic 24p which is also permissible.

Unfortunately, the international standard has not yet been amended to include the 50p/60p produced by many video cameras these days in the 1920 x 1080 frame format size. The only frame format allowed for 50/60p is 1280 x 720p.

Incidentally, that "Converting title" message you are getting is using the word "title" as a video-speak term of art. It really means the whole video itself represented (as lata has already explained) by your project file. That explains why it might seem to take so long to complete, when you might be thinking "title" just means the opening credits you probably inserted.

Video Studio is supposed to work that way: insert clips -- edit them -- then move over to the burning module to burn them to disc. But from the earliest days of Video Studio, some users were having trouble getting discs which played smoothly when these otherwise logical steps were followed. Indeed, sometimes the burn failed completely. So some of us here started breaking it down into smaller steps, which is what lata has outlined above. So the basic idea is to do your editing but before going into the burning module, you first convert your edited project into a Blu-Ray compatible video clip. Once that is done, you can also then play it back in a software player to make sure everything looks OK before you open the burning module.

The other thing to be aware of here is that your project file (***.vsp) is NOT a video file. It contains NO video. It is just a small text file which contains information for Video Studio about what clips are included in the project, where they are located on your computer and what editing has been done to them. Using our preferred workflow, we don't want the vsp file to end up in the burning module's timeline. Instead, we want the new Blu-Ray compatible clip you created. Hence lata's instruction to delete anything that may be in the burning timeline when you first open the burning module and before you have manually inserted your new clip.

You also need to click on the cogwheel "Project Settings" icon in the bottom left of the burning screen to make sure that the box beside "Do not convert compliant MPEG files" is ticked -- though normally this is done by default when you install the program. Given that you have already manually inserted a complaint Blu-Ray MPEG file, this will mean that when you begin the burning process this time, you should no longer get the "Converting Title" message -- just "Converting Menu" (if you have inserted a menu) and then "Multiplexing".

[Powelly_au]

Hi
Thanks for the response. I followed your instructions above and tried two things with the following results:
1. I started a new project.
2. I confirmed the ‘Show message when inserting first video’ was ticked in preferences
3. I inserted two of the .MTS video clips into the time line however the window asking me to match the video file properties did not appear when either of these files were inserted

then

1. I then again started a new project with a clear time line
2. I selected Share – create disk -selected Blue-ray H.264 (1920x1080)
3. I inserted two .MTS video files (Ie original video camera files not files created in VS)
4. I created a menu with 2 chapter titles with default back ground and music.
5. Hit burn which again resulted in “Convert title’ and ‘Convert menu’ before’ preparing output content’ being displayed.
Should I consider reloading VS Ultimate X6 or upgrade to X9 now.
Appreciate any comments

[Powelly_au]

Additional note: I did confirm the 'do not convert compliant MPEG files' box was ticked prior to hitting the burn disk button.

[Ken Berry]

Blu-Ray compatible files use the .m2ts extension and not .mts. So the burning module would still be converting the latter, hence the 'Convert Title'.

[lata]

Hi

I have just tried CVSX6, apologies for Show Messages… that will not see MTS files to set project properties, X6 only allows Standard Definition as project properties. Just simply missed the fact you were using X6.

However I did not have a problem and burning a Bluray Folder which did not activate Convert title.
Yes I used original MTS files, the burner process did however change the files extension to m2ts, but certainly no Convert Title.
I also tested X9 as the same.

I can only assume your original MTS files are not Compliant video files.

With the MTS in the timeline, right click and choose properties, what are they?
The frame rate has to be 25fps or 29.97 fps. not 50p or 60p

Upgrading to X9.

From X6 view Corel Guide, orange disc top right, Messages Tab should show some deals to upgrade to X9, I see two offers, one for 75% off

[Powelly_au]

Thanks Gents, much appreciated.
That explains the show message.

When I insert the source .MTS file into the VS time line and check the properties they are as follows:

PAL HDMV, H.264 Video, Upper field first, 24bit, 1920x1080, 16:9, 25fps, Data rate: Variable bit rate (Max 22599 kbps.) Dolby Audio, Total samples: 391, 680 samples, Attributes 48000Hz, layer : none, Audio bitrate 256 kbps

I noticed that when I created a video from the clips in the time line the output rendered video file is .m2t and not a .m2ts. Could this be causing the Convert Title? Is a .m2t a compliant video file? What is the difference between these two video formats.

[Ken Berry]

I noticed that when I created a video from the clips in the time line the output rendered video file is .m2t and not a .m2ts. Could this be causing the Convert Title? Is a .m2t a compliant video file? What is the difference between these two video formats.

That .m2t video is in fact HDV and is NOT Blu-Ray compliant. (I use it all the time as my main high def camera is a Canon HV20 which shoots in HDV on a small tape.) But I am puzzled as to how you have managed to select this as the output format. What exactly do you select when you go to SHARE?

[lata]

Hi
Done a few tests.....
For some reason CVSX6 has a 20000kbps limit on its Bluray H264 templates, so I am unable to use Make Movie Templates Manager to create a 25990 kbps template, Share – Bluray options also limit to 20000kbps, compared to X9 at 28000kbps.
X8 is the same with X7 allowing 65000kbps, Hmmm
Interestingly the burner module will allow for 35000kbps for Bluray,

Anyway using X6 Same as first clip will replicate the 22599kbps rate.
I created my own video using your settings, renamed the video to use mts extension.
Then used in Burner module to create a Bluray folder, and again no Convert Title.

Clearly there is a difference using X6 to X9 when rendering Bluray compliant files, but I do not have problems with Convert Title using X6.

Maybe your files are different to my files, but they do look the same?


PAL HDMV, H.264 Video, Upper field first, 24bit, 1920x1080, 16:9, 25fps, Data rate: Variable bit rate (Max 22599 kbps.) Dolby Audio, Total samples: 391, 680 samples, Attributes 48000Hz, layer

[Ken Berry]

Interestingly the burner module will allow for 35000kbps for Bluray

I think you will find that that is for Blu-Ray mpeg-2 as opposed to H.264 mpeg-4...

[lata]

Hi Ken

Yes that is true for Mpeg, but viewing X9, 35000kbps is also possible when using H264.
X6 limits to 20000kbps

From what I saw all versions of Video Studio from X6 allowed different parameters when creating HD templates and in some cases in the burner module.

Not a problem if we overcome the Convert Title.
Otherwise the render properties used will be as default and from what I can see use MPEG2 instead of H264

[lata]

Hi Powelly_au

Can you go to F6 Preferences – Edit Tab and set Best for the Resampling Quality option.

Try rendering the project again using “Same as first clip” to use original video files properties.

Does that improve the quality, especially those vertical lines?

[Powelly_au]

Thanks Lata,
Yes I always have the re-sampling quality option set to best. And rendering with properties set to same as first clip definitely fixes the jitter problem on the rendered video file. However it is interesting that even when you use MTS file you still do not see converting title. I think I will bite the bullet and upgrade to VS X9.5 tonight as it is being offered at a good price and see if I can produce the desired results.

[Powelly_au]

Hi All,
I finally had a chance to load the new VS9.5. There are many more HD video output file options available. This seems to have eradicated the jitter and flickering of the rendered project videos. I have not burned a project to blue-ray folder yet but plan to test that on the week end.
I have a few questions:

1. Would you still suggest for best results that I should render the project to the video output file using the same properties as the first clip or use one of the AVHD standards available in the drop down box?
2. When burning to BD folder you have choices of 1920x1080, 25p, 25i, 50p, 50i etc. Again for best results would you recommend interlaced or progressive video rendering for my Blue-ray files and would 25 or 50 frame rate be preferable.
3. Some of the many video forums indicate that Blue-ray players require 25p and some say 25p and 50i are essentially the same thing. The more I read the more confused I become. I just need to know what format in VS 9.5 will produce the best quality BDs. Any suggestions? .
4. What does selecting the Video optimisation tick box do?

I think I am getting close to good quality BD videos but any suggestions to improve the finished product would be most appreciated.
Regards
Mark