Workaround for Topaz plugin issues with batch processing?

[gbotes]

Does anybody know if there is a workaround for using PSP X8 and Topaz plugins when doing batch processing? The plugins can be scripted and run fine when a single image is open in the workspace. But when used from batch processing mode the plugins tend to hang or crash. I found a similar topic in this forum pertinent to PSP X4 but did not find any resolution.

[rondo]

A few years ago Corel said they were going to work on it, but it appears nothing came of it.

Besides batch processing, if you run plugins on an image and then capture and apply the editing, the same thing happens in that PSP locks up. For me it is a major limitation, as I often use Topaz plugins and would like the editing and processing I did on one image to be applied with the same settings to similar images for uniformity. It's a big process slowdown, and not something I think you would see happen in Photoshop. If Corel wants to play in the big leagues they need up their game here.

[JoeB]

A few years ago Corel said they were going to work on it, but it appears nothing came of it.

Besides batch processing, if you run plugins on an image and then capture and apply the editing, the same thing happens in that PSP locks up. For me it is a major limitation, as I often use Topaz plugins and would like the editing and processing I did on one image to be applied with the same settings to similar images for uniformity. It's a big process slowdown, and not something I think you would see happen in Photoshop. If Corel wants to play in the big leagues they need up their game here.

If Corel wanted to play in the "big leagues", as you put it, then they would have to charge big league prices for the software. As things now stand, the price differential is huge and the features differential is relatively minor. Add the extreme flexibility PSP has regarding customizing the workspace plus the extreme flexibility of Python scripting and PSP comes out on top easily IMHO. It's pretty big league already in terms of features while staying extremely affordable.

By the way, have you tried automating the OP's complete process using Photoshop, or were you just guessing that it would be able to easily duplicate that automation with an action plus make the plugin work with the action as the OP wishes it to work?

[rondo]

JoeB
Requesting a feature that would expand PSP's use isn't unreasonable. No, I haven't tried in Photoshop, as I don't have it- although the new Photography plan at $9.99 a month for PS & LR doesn't come out to much more a year than a new version of PSP Ultimate & Aftershot Pro.
So your argument that the price of PSP should justify a lack of desired features just isn't sound.
I use PSP because I like it, period, not because the price is "cheap".

[JoeB]

JoeB
Requesting a feature that would expand PSP's use isn't unreasonable. No, I haven't tried in Photoshop, as I don't have it- although the new Photography plan at $9.99 a month for PS & LR doesn't come out to much more a year than a new version of PSP Ultimate & Aftershot Pro.
So your argument that the price of PSP should justify a lack of desired features just isn't sound.
I use PSP because I like it, period, not because the price is "cheap".

Not sure that I can see your logic.

First, I would like to state that if you haven't even tried it in Photoshop then from where did you get the information that, as you stated, this was "not something I think you would see happen in Photoshop". It seems, from your reply, that it was simply your uninformed opinion and not based on any facts that you had even tried to verify. While you, as everyone, are entitled to your opinions, you are not entitled to your own facts unless you are able to produce those facts.

That said (and in response to the rest of your reply), Corel PSP X8 is currently selling for $59.99 Canadian. PS, at 9.99/month would work out to $119.88 per year, twice the cost of PSP. Is twice the price what you call "doesn't come out to much more a year than" PSP? And for the $59.99 cost of PSP a person can use it for as many years as they like, not just one year as with Photoshop's $119.00 cost. And a quick browse of this forum will show that many people have been using v.x6 for 2 or 3 years and older versions even longer, so how much would those years of use have cost them on Photoshop's yearly plan? Your cost comparison is, I'm afraid, sorely lacking in accuracy, or else you don't think that twice the cost - and just for one year of use - is much of a factor to consider, given that PSP offers most features of PS plus several others (as mentioned in my previous post) that PS lacks.

And I'm not sure why you put the word "cheap" in quotes, because I did not use that word in my post. PSP is "inexpensive" (the word I used) compared to PS. To me (and it's just MHO), the word "cheap" connotes "not of a good quality". That definition does not apply to PSP, again IMHO.

I do agree with you that requesting a feature that would expand the use of PSP is not unreasonable. In fact, requesting features is encouraged by Corel and users do so all the time. However, your suggestion that PSP's "price should justify a lack of desired features" is open to argument.

As a person who has been a marketing consultant for many years, I can say that all products are produced with 3 major considerations in mind (as well as may others, of course). They are (a) the requirements of the majority of consumers of the target market of the product, (b) the cost of implementing those requested options for the majority of the target market, and (c) the marginal cost of adding options requested by a small minority of people who otherwise fit within the target market.

In other words, the third consideration has to consider what you call a "desired feature". If such a feature is desired by a very large segment of the target market, every effort will be expended to implement it AS LONG AS IT DOES NOT have a significant effect on the second item - i.e., the cost of implementing those options. That is because one of the important considerations in first determining the Target Market is the price point at which their target market will be comfortable.

In your case, you have expressed a desire for an option that may not fit within all of those 3 criteria and the considerations taken into account in determining those criteria. However, I am glad that you continue to use PSP because you like it, regardless of price considerations.

[gbotes]

Hi guys - thanks for your responses. You've given me some things to think about. How does one go about successfully submitting feature requests to Corel? I would like to submit a request for batch processing support for the Topaz plugins, as Corel does offer a special deal on some of them, and I assume therefore they are "officially sanctioned", and because they are scriptable. It's just that something goes wrong when running these scripts from batch processing mode.

So far I have raised support issues with Corel but mostly seem to encounter levels of support that don't get me to a person who has the right background or authority to look at issues - i.e. Level 1 Support, Level 2 Support, etc.

[rondo]

JoeB

No point in getting into a technical and philosophical business debate.

Address the topic of batch processing issues with plugins if you have anything to contribute.

[Kathy_9]

I have seen the same thing. It will batch process the requested script successfully but then freeze up and I will have to use the Task Manager to close the program. This was reported during beta testing.

[JoeB]

Hi guys - thanks for your responses. You've given me some things to think about. How does one go about successfully submitting feature requests to Corel? I would like to submit a request for batch processing support for the Topaz plugins, as Corel does offer a special deal on some of them, and I assume therefore they are "officially sanctioned", and because they are scriptable. It's just that something goes wrong when running these scripts from batch processing mode.

So far I have raised support issues with Corel but mostly seem to encounter levels of support that don't get me to a person who has the right background or authority to look at issues - i.e. Level 1 Support, Level 2 Support, etc.

It is my understanding that Corel personnel don't visit this user forum very often, but do show up occasionally. However, those who use their Facebook page say that Corel does monitor it fairly well so comments made there would likely be a better way to get a response. The messenger link on their Facebook page may connect to the moderator of the page, but someone else would have to confirm that.

EDIT: Below is a link to the Corel blog. This particular link goes to the page describing changes to X8 with the 8.1 patch but reading it indicates that comments on that page regarding further update requests are monitored:

http://tinyurl.com/jvff4sl

[JoeB]

JoeB

No point in getting into a technical and philosophical business debate.

Address the topic of batch processing issues with plugins if you have anything to contribute.

@Levifiction is the scripting guru on this forum and likely the best source of a script workaround solution. I don't know why using Topaz in a script is causing an issue with batch processing but it may be that the script doesn't allow enough time for the plugin to complete its process before moving on to the next step of the script. If that is the case, Levi has posted in another thread the method to add a delay in a script to allow a previous step to complete before moving on to the next step, so may be able to help with that. You could always PM him and ask for help with the script.

Also, it's possible that part of a workaround might (note I say "might" because it's just a thought that popped into my mind) incorporate something from the script created by forum member JSJ to get NIK plugins to work for people like me who can't get some of them to work in my PSP. If my limited knowledge of scripting is correct, it basically works by saving the image in the workspace in a temp folder, opening the plugin as a standalone and having it retrieve the image, adds whatever effects you want, then returns the image as changed to the temp file when you click Save in the plugin, and then has PSP call the image and add it as a new layer to the workspace image. Now I agree in advance that this is a slow process and not suitable for batch processing. But as this is just guesswork on my part I'm just suggesting that a batch script that perhaps loads the plugin and keeps it open with the same settings (or perhaps the user opens it in advance of running the script) might be able to be scripted to work with Topaz. The script could save the file (just before Topaz is called) to a temp file (named in the script), then have Topaz call the file, apply the effect and send it back to the temp file from where the script could then pick it up and continue. This would be faster than having to open the plugin each time and having to have PSP retrieve the image. Pure speculation! But just a thought at the moment.

[gbotes]

I was also thinking of maybe adding some pauses, JoeB, for just the reason you've pointed out. I'll have a go at it and see how far I get

[gbotes]

I have seen the same thing. It will batch process the requested script successfully but then freeze up and I will have to use the Task Manager to close the program. This was reported during beta testing.

Thanks, Kathy_9. It helps to know the problem was picked up during beta testing.

[gbotes]

Alas, it is not simply a matter of needing pauses in the script(s). Must be something more to it.

[rondo]

It's not just in batch editing. If you use a Topaz plugin on a single image and then use Capture Editing and Apply Editing to another image PSP will lock up and freeze during the processing. I know the Capture and Apply Editing are script based batch processing within the program.

Out of curiosity, I ran the Perfectly Clear plugin and Captured and Applied Editing and the process went fine and completed with no freeze or lock up.

I sure wish Corel would work this out as Topaz is one of the few commercial plugin companies that supports PSP. And when processing a lot of photos and wanting some consistency in the applied edits it would make it so much easier than doing them one by one.

[gbotes]

It's not just in batch editing. If you use a Topaz plugin on a single image and then use Capture Editing and Apply Editing to another image PSP will lock up and freeze during the processing. I know the Capture and Apply Editing are script based batch processing within the program.

Out of curiosity, I ran the Perfectly Clear plugin and Captured and Applied Editing and the process went fine and completed with no freeze or lock up.

I sure wish Corel would work this out as Topaz is one of the few commercial plugin companies that supports PSP. And when processing a lot of photos and wanting some consistency in the applied edits it would make it so much easier than doing them one by one.

Yes - I agree, and especially as Corel advertises Topaz plugins from the Corel website. I am able to use all the Google Nik Collection plugins in PSP X8 as long as I don't try to use their "control points" - this causes PSP to crash too. I've experienced the same thing you mentioned with Capture Editing and Apply Editing.