VideoStudio x8 Mpeg Optimizer jitters

[Pavel_Kolotilov]

Hallo,

I have the following problem with VideoStudio x8 Ultimate:

I have a Panasonic camera and my footage is 1080 50p. Everything works quite well, but when I use Mpeg Optimizer to create a final video, I have small jitters after all the effects (transitions, titles, etc). Exactly in the frame where the effect finishes and original video starts.

I understand there is some kind of keyframes misallignment between recoded video and the original video.

Any ideas how I can solve it, otherwise the resulting video does not look very nice?

Of course, I could just process again the whole video, but I takes a lot of time and I would rather not recode the original video (as the VideoStudio HD codec has some quality issues when where is a lot of small moving objects, like water for example)-

Cheers,

Pavel

[lata]

Hallo,

I have the following problem with VideoStudio x8 Ultimate:

I have a Panasonic camera and my footage is 1080 50p. Everything works quite well, but when I use Mpeg Optimizer to create a final video, I have small jitters after all the effects (transitions, titles, etc). Exactly in the frame where the effect finishes and original video starts.
Pavel

Please try deselecting Smart Render before pressing Start

Please read this post to see if you have the same/ similar problem

http://forum.corel.com/EN/viewtopic.php ... 15#p306796

[Ken Berry]

I never use the Mpeg Optimizer for outputting video, but choose a specific format under Share. Have a look at this response I just posted on another user's problem. Even though your own problem is different from his, my response should still work with your situation: http://forum.corel.com/EN/viewtopic.php ... 53#p307453

[Pavel_Kolotilov]

Hello Ken Berry and lata.

Thank you for your replies, I have to check them out. Unfortunately I am quite busy at work right now, but as soon as I get to my VS project I will post wheather it helped or not.

Cheers, Pavel

[Pavel_Kolotilov]

Hello guys, I just got to my WS and tried out your solutions.

To Iata: Sorry to tell you, though your solution works it is not what I am looking for. Basically you solve the thing by just switching off the whole Smart Render feature and recoding the whole project. Something that I wanted to avoid completely. I tried to recode it with 100% quality and still got the quality of complicated scenes (like water) much worse than original hardware Panasonic encoder. And it takes much more time of course.

The Panasonic program which comes with the camera (HD Writer AE 5.0) does Smart Render automatically and does it perfectly. Unfortunately, as an editor it is quite a simple program that cannot be used for anything serious.

To Ken Berry: I tried to matching the project properties to the source material, and outputting it with "Same as project settings", but it does not help. Same jitters.

Also I noticed that those jitters you can see clearly in the Windows Media Player, but in some other players you can't! For example SMplayer plays the file perfectly! VLC also looks ok, but on my computer VLC is usually slow and have lots of drops. Unfortunately On my standalone AV player you still can see the jitters, but not as bad as on WMP. So, I do not know what to think. Maybe it has something to do with the codec implimentation.

Pavel

[lata]

Hi Pavel

I have to agree that deselecting Smart Render does take far too long to render long projects, but for the short clips does seem to clear those “Jitters”

I have been using HD from Pana 900 for over a year without much problem, my recent project coincidently is showing these jitters, for me at the beginning of the transition, I used Fade to Black and Crossfade both show the problem. As though the frames replay again, 3 or 4 frames repeat.

Frames 1 , 2 , 3, 4, 5, 6 , 7, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9,

Only shows if there is movement within those frames, a stiller image would not shot the “Jitter”

HD Writer AE 5.0

I remember long ago before I used HD that some users complained about quality when using the Writer to transfer footage, using Windows Explorer Copy and Paste seemed a better option. I did not get involved in the posts so cannot comment as to whether this is a problem or not. I used Video Studio Import Digital Media option, like the Writer transfers the files as M2t, whereas Copy and Paste used MTS, not sure if that is significant?

I will reply when I have tested the files again?

Post updated

Well now I am totally confused, all samples I created yesterday showed this judder as well as the main movie at 56 minutes, all were faulty.

Today I play the same files again using Video Studio and no judders.
I don’t understand it, I even nudged through the frames, one by one and identified the bad / rogue frames

Clearly it must be a playback issue but……….

[Pavel_Kolotilov]

Hi,

probably I was not clear about the type of "Jitters" that I expirience. What I call a "jitter" is a frame with multiple noise artifacs on the screen (cripled frame) accompanied sometimes with the "tsik" sound effect. As far as I can say it either just one frame (or just few frames), but nothing continuos.

In your case Iata, it seems to me you are having simple interlace wrong field order effect (when the fields are played back "Lower field first" instead of "Upper field first" or vice versa). This thing happens to me all the time in VS projects when I mix footage from different sources. That is why you only can see it in the projects with movement.

HD Writer AE I mentioned only for the sake of comparizon, it actually does not have anything to do with the problem. By the way I use Panasonic HC-X920 camera, which I think really similar to what you have, Iata. Really satisfied with it.

I raised the issue to the Corel support, so I will see what they are going to say. At the moment, they asked my work station configuration.

I will keep you posted about the results.

Cheers,

Pavel

[Pavel_Kolotilov]

Hi,

I am coming back to my post, as I never was able to fix the issue.

Corel support did not help much. Even worse, they basically stopped answering me after some time. I sent several mails, but never got the response apart of the standard automatic ones.

I hoped the issue can be solved with the latest updates, but after installing the version 8.5 the issue is still there. I remind you what is happening:
when I use Smart Render in the beginning of the transition or effect and in the end of the transition or effect I have one or more crippled frames. If I draw the render map, it could be something like that:

OOOOOOOOOOOCCFXFXFXFXFXFXFXFCCCOOOOOOO

Where O is Original not-recoded video, C is a crippled frame and FX is effect or Title, etc (recoded video by the VS).

I did some investigation, and am pretty sure that something is wrong with the interlace / progressive encoding routines:

1. Played with sound drivers, switched them off, all of them except the one I use: no improvement whatsoever.
2. Removed all the VS completely, even deleted all of the filters. Restarted the computer and reinstalled VS. The problem persists.
3. Tried to play with hardware acceleration options in preferences: no luck. Does not matter what I choose, the problem persists.
4. Upgraded to Window 10 - no changes
5. Upgraded to VS 8.5 -- no changes.
6. Tried to use 1080 50i – problem is completely gone there, the 1080 50i files are rendered correctly!!!

So, the conclusion is that the problem is affecting only the files encoded in 1080 50p (my footage is from the Panasonic x920).

I hope Corel support reads sometimes this forum, because this is the only way to convey my problem. Mpeg Optimizer is a great feature and I am tyred to recode all of my projects.

Pavel

[lata]

Hi Pavel

Sorry you are still having issues with your video files.
As the problem is quite critical to crippled or maybe duplicated frames I feel we need to work with the same video files.
For that you may be best in creating a short project, render the project to produce a “test video” showing the issues you are having.
Create a Smart Package of that project - Zip the folder and upload to a sharing site along with the Test Video, you can either add the Test Video to the Zipped folder or upload separately will reduce file sizes. (Microsoft One Drive would be suitable)

Can I ask, what is your final output, are you intending to burn a Bluray DVD, if so then you should work with 25 fps interlaced. (50i)
50P is not suitable to burn a BD using a 1920 x 1080 frame size?

Like you I have been quite busy of late, but a recent visit to Southport Air Show did produce a lot of 50P footage, hopefully I can replicate your problems.
But as I say we are best using the same material.

Unfortunately, it is highly unlikely that any Corel people will read / visit these forums?

[Pavel_Kolotilov]

Hi Trevor,

I did what you ask and uploaded the file here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4M-5o ... sp=sharing

There in the output file you can clearly see the artifact right after the title, and after the crossfade also, but not that noticeble.

I am a quality freak, so I try to get the files in the maximum quality. That is why 50p. I watch them on the AV player with HDD and cannot bother myself with the BR disks (to lazy to change them)

By the way, as far as I know the latest Blurays do take non-standard 50p disks.

The camera I use is a Panasonic HC-x920.

I hope we can crack it!

[lata]

Hi

Sorry Pavel I am unable to open that file, my Win Zip reports no valid RAR file.???

It does however seem quite small at 78Mb given it should contain 50P Hd video?

[Pavel_Kolotilov]

Hi Trevor,

I fixed the link. Before I used the latest RAR5 compression, so I guess some programs does not recognize it.

So now I did a plain vanilla zip file. Use the same link in my previous post.

Project is small, because it is just several seconds of the video.

Greetings,

Pavel

[lata]

Hi Pavel

Well I am having similar results in rendering 50P video.
I have had mixed results, sometimes it looks good but most of the time it creates a duplicate frame not dissimilar to the frame sequence you provided.

1 / As a comparison I ran tests using 25fps with no problems.
2 / Rendering 50p created the duplicate frame immediately at the start of the title clip as well as the transition.
3 / rendering with Smart Render turned off showed good results
4 / Modified project settings to use 25fps -- Rendering 50p to Same as First Clip produced good results, although Smart Render was selected I do not know what effect it had given the 25fps project?
5/ Some tests with Smart Proxy disabled seemed better, I have to repeat those.

I am trying all combinations I can think of but so far no go – unless I deselect Smart Render

[Pavel_Kolotilov]

Hi Trevor,

Thank you for testing. At least now I see that it also happens on your machine and this is not my paranoia. Now, I will probably try to contact Corel again and try to make my point.

Have you tried to do it only with the file I sent you or also with your own footage? It would be interesting to know if it has something to do with my camera.

Myself, I will try to do the workarounds you are talking about: using 25fps projects and output to 50p. To see if it helps.

Evidently, everything is solved when you deselect Smart Render. But apart of worsened quality (especially in the scenes with water or other typical sofisticated cases) it takes 10 times more to do the render.

Best regards,

Pavel

[lata]

Hi Pavel

I repeated my tests this morning with disastrous results, I don’t know what I changed other than Smart Proxy
In addition to the duplicate frames that causes a slight blip the period over the text box ( a few seconds) showed a lot of pixalisation, certainly unwatchable.
Strangely seemed to playback ok using VLC, so maybe just a VS playback issue with the final output ok. Need a lot more tests

I did notice that its not just Titles, any clip in the overlay track, image as pic in pic also caused the poor playback.
I have been out all day and need to repeat the tests nor watch the earlier tets.

I have to say I have just finished a 30 min 50P video with little or no problems, so I don’t know whats going on here?