How to - upgrade to HD results

[Davidk]

Pretty much every new TV, Monitor and computer screen (eg, new PC, laptop or tablet) sold for the last 3 years has been HD capable - ie, capable of displaying much greater resolution than the standard DVD (720x576). HD screens still display DVD resolution OK, and DVD players are still common, because they are cheap, but that won't last: sometime soon, DVD resolution will be go the way of the dinsosaur, and so will any equipment that is limited to that standard. I've been considering an upgrade to make use of that HD screen capability but a bit of thought indicates that there is more to it than meets the eye, and pretty much zero advice on how to do it.

For example:
a. the computer burner that VS drives must be capable of more than just DVD capable, in terms of resolution. That might ultimately be just in file sizes, but at first thought it seems that it's either DVD normal or a blu ray burner. The burner resolution capability seems to be sadly lacking in the limited doco one gets by looking up the manufacturers site with the model number (if a user actually does that) and its all related to the burn technology - DVD or blu ray.
b. the player attached to the TV screen that you want to screen high def movies on needs to be more than just DVD. But the only 'more' that seems to be available is blu ray.
c. if both of these things are available, how do you do it (the process) using VS and the various formats for higher resolution that are available? eg, AVCHD, Blu ray and BD-J?
d. for AVCHD and BD-J, what sort of disks does one use?
e. even a description of the various terms is hard to find.
f. lastly, having at least understood what is needed to display HD, what resolution specs should one be looking for in a video camera which would produce the source materials the end result is based on.

The VS user guide is useless in advising the pros and cons of this. And I've searched the tutorials forum looking for something like a tutorial or advice guide, without success. But even that seems to be increasingly dated - the most recent item is 2 years old.

So, the question
Is there a guide anywhere - on forum or off it - that would provide the basics of necessary technology, a description of how to use VS to achieve display of HD video output from VS

Davidk

[Old Grey]

I think std def is 540 lines, HD or double def is 1080 lines - I think it's now called 2K 1920x1080 - and the soon to be released format will be 4K, around 4000x2000 - not mentioning 8K -.

I think the DVD is becoming a bit redundant as file sizes increase, but then again new compression formats can make files very small - look at the HD for the new GoPro mpeg4 -. I don't use DVD but have a Home Theatre PC - mine has 4TB of space -. And now that TVs have USB, people are switching to memory sticks instead.

[Davidk]

I know from reading the occasional comment - especially by moderator experts - about HD process bugs(?) in VS that this has been done before. And I've been waiting with bated breath for some of those experts to answer the question - ie what info is available, and where to find it. So far, nothing.

In the mean time I cast my info searches a bit wider and came up with a range of detail that had to be summarised, interpolated, re-organised and generally manipulated to make any sense at all. The nett result is a very draft document on what is needed, attached.

I would appreciate some - any - feedback on it, especially the accuracy of the commentary box in section 4 and the remarks on the use of the smart proxy option.

Davidk

Upgrading to Editing and Playing High Resolution Video draft.pdf

(90.87 KiB) Downloaded 458 times

[Old Grey]

From what I read, you mainly seem concerned with the hardware compatibility with HD

I'm no HD expert - I'm still using DVD 720x576 - but hardware wise :-

I think all modern flat screen TVs are 1080 HD.

Modern PC monitors start becoming 1920x1080 at 21.5".
http://www.msy.com.au/default.jsp?category=50

Modern PC video cards can do at least 1920x1080
http://www.msy.com.au/default.jsp?category=20

Video studio X5 can do 1920x1080 - X6 does 4K 4096x2160 -
http://www.corel.com/static/product_con ... rix_EN.pdf

Burners I know nothing about because I use files straight from the PC

As far as format and file size, I save 10 sec test clips in different formats, to test quality, time, and file size.

I am currently dabbling in HD by doing my friends GoPro videos. They are amazingly clear, they are roughly 200MB for 2 min. They do use MP4, supposedly not suitable for Blue-Ray, but that's not a problem because I don't use optical disks any more.

I know there was a bit of problem with HD initially, like you couldn't change the resolution/aspect ratio of HD video because the pixels would have to be interpolated, thereby loosing the quality.

Also, I don't think you can made a video HD if it wasn't recorded HD, so you need the video in HD first

Maybe a simple run down of what you want to do will get more bites - I had to read you post a couple of times because I'm a bit old -

Sorry I can't help much, as I'm just starting with HD, but at least I can bump this post.

[Ken Berry]

They do use MP4, supposedly not suitable for Blue-Ray

Just a little footnote -- the GoPro Hero does in fact produce Blu-Ray compatible AVCHD in either 25/30 fps interleaved or 50/60 full fps progressive. AVCHD is one of the three formats which are part of the international Blu-Ray standard. (The Hero 3, which I have, can also film in 4K...)

[skier-hughes]

I think all modern flat screen TVs are 1080 HD.
A brief look through a tv sellers website shows many 1366 x 768 and 1024 x 768 p tv's still for sale

Also, I don't think you can made a video HD if it wasn't recorded HD, so you need the video in HD first

You can upscale an SD video to HD resolution and burn it as a bluray disc, won't be as good a quality as native HD but can be done!!

[Old Grey]

I think all modern flat screen TVs are 1080 HD.
A brief look through a tv sellers website shows many 1366 x 768 and 1024 x 768 p tv's still for sale

I just checked my 3 year old TV and it only does 1080i through the DVD - That explains why my TV only does 1280x768 with a PC attached -

Also, I don't think you can made a video HD if it wasn't recorded HD, so you need the video in HD first

You can upscale an SD video to HD resolution and burn it as a bluray disc, won't be as good a quality as native HD but can be done!!

How do you upcale, I want to give it a go. Do you just save a clip in HD format.

[skier-hughes]

How do you upcale, I want to give it a go. Do you just save a clip in HD format.

Yes, the quality will not be better, may even look worse, it depends on the quality of the encoder doing the job. Most tv's do a better job than cheap encoders, but it is certainly worth having play to see what you think.

[Ken Berry]

Some Blu-Ray players also upscale standard DVDs to look fairly close to HD. These include the PlayStation 3 which I think does a very good job of this.

[Davidk]

This arose from student queries in my movie/editor class (using VS) at the local chapter of the University of the 3rd age (u3a) - they are all over the world. I was frankly expecting that there would be something like this available, since I know forum members and moderators either use HD and/or comment on VS issues using HD data. Ergo, upgrades and what would be needed to do it would be known. And hence the forum post.

Many responses with bits of information. So far, tho, the doc I wrote seems to be accurate in that it describes:
a. the equipment needed to do an upgrade to HD, as a phased or full attempt to video editing in HD - which includes capturing, editing with VS, burning a disk and then playing it on an HD screen
b. how to improve the performance of VS during the edit processes using smart proxy.
At least, no one has taken issue with any of the elements in it.

In case it wasn't apparent, my reasoning for b. was as follows:
- smart proxy is described by Corel in the YouTube tutorial on the subject as designed to improve performance when viewing and editing (eg adding voiceover or text) using the small view panel in the UI when the PC has a slow computer processor. It does it with a sort of thumbnail file, and applies the edits in the timeline and tracks to the full file(s) when rendering.
- I interpreted that "slow" to mean a single core cpu at about 1ghz or less operating on mpeg or similar video clips. At one time years ago that would have the norm, on desktops or laptops. That sort of "slow" would have been very irritating to a user and a means of doing edits with the hardware available in near real time would clearly have had a product competitive advantage. Given that the cpu's in any PC these days regardless of build are generally multi-ghz clock rates (a range of 2.3 thru 3+Ghz seems common) and multi-cored even to the point that the latest versions of operating system use that facility, that "slow" consideration was no longer relevant for normal use of VS on mpeg or other DVD standard files.
- despite the speed of cpu's, HD files of any format are many times larger than any DVD/mpeg file and it was reasonable to assume that the slow computer processing condition might be apparent again when working in HD. Thus, the use of the smart proxy option in those circumstances.

Davidk

[Davidk]

More footnotes.

I was intrigued by Ken's comments about Blu-ray players and Mpeg4, and having spent a bit of time in previous professional lives dealing with standards of various sorts, I did a bit of checking.

Firstly, mpeg-4 has many versions or parts (28 formally released and 2 pending)(search wikipedia using mpeg4). It also allows a developer (eg software or equipment maker) to implement just those parts which suit it's needs. So it doesn't follow that a later part subsumes or incorporates any and every earlier part. Not very standard - more a recipe for a interconnection dog's breakfast. One of those parts is part 10, relating to the implementation of AVC formats based on the ITU H264 standard.

Now, the AVCHD format standard mandates mpeg-4 AVC/H-264.

And Blu-ray mandates the use/recognition of the H-264 codec.

So it is really not surprising that some Blu-ray players support mpeg-4 files. Or may be that should phrased as Blu-ray players support some mpeg-4 files.

Davidk

[skier-hughes]

It is often far more info than most people need to know
If you start saying things like AVI is not a file it is a wrapper it can contain well over 800 different file types............. they've gone to sleep, they just want to know why it's not working and what to do to make it work