All I-Frame (72 Mbps) editing with VideoStudio

[erdna]

OK.What was the original framerate? Can you show the MediaInfo overview. Can you playback/verify your edited file on TV via a multi mediaplayer ?

[pvreditor]

OK.What was the original framerate? Can you show the MediaInfo overview. Can you playback/verify your edited file on TV via a multi mediaplayer ?

At the moment, I'm away from the computer that has VideoStudio and the files, so an answer will have to wait a day. That said, I'm not sure what the "MediaInfo overview" is... is that the list of information about the file type? I can switch the file to my new laptop and use it to play the video on a TV, but I can't imagine that it will look any better than it looks on the computer. What you see on the computer's screen is what you get on a TV, right?

Bob Kovacs
http://www.bobkovacs.com

[erdna]

MediaInfo is a free program that gives you information about AV files. Just Google and install the program
I suggested to playback via a multi mediaplayer because it has a much faster hardware decoder, as opposed to PC SW decoding. Playing back from yr laptop will not show a posible difference.

[aljimenez]

I am getting a new GH3 this week and have not had any experience with its great new video files. However, your problem has been discussed before at length. See this http://forum.corel.com/EN/viewtopic.php ... it=ffdshow
Also I have been very successful using free encoder ffdshow which does a great job of rendering very high quality files. A search in this forum will show you many early discussions on ffdshow... Al

[pvreditor]

I am getting a new GH3 this week and have not had any experience with its great new video files. However, your problem has been discussed before at length. See this http://forum.corel.com/EN/viewtopic.php ... it=ffdshow
Also I have been very successful using free encoder ffdshow which does a great job of rendering very high quality files. A search in this forum will show you many early discussions on ffdshow... Al

I read through that thread and the bottom line was that the problem discussed had to do with the original files being at 30 fps but his system was set to render them at 25 fps. That's not the case in my system, which is 30 fps (as is the camera).

I've seen discussions of getting new encoders, but never had need to download one and associate it with VideoStudio. How does that work?

Bob Kovacs
http://www.bobkovacs.com

[aljimenez]

I've seen discussions of getting new encoders, but never had need to download one and associate it with VideoStudio. How does that work?
Bob Kovacs

Just install: http://ffdshow-tryout.sourceforge.net/ and it will be listed as one of the encoders available when creating a Movie Template using the avi wrapper. The encoder ffdshow will take some experimentation to set its configuration, and it has many options. I have found it to be very good. I have been using it rarely lately since the latest VS is so good; however, given your experience ffdshow may be back in business. I discovered ffdshow when I first bought the GH2 more than a year ago and VS had troubles dealing with the AVCHD files then. VS has a tough time keeping up with camera improvements, understandably... Al

[erdna]

Maybe a good idea to try ffdschow, but I think all their codecs relate to long gop modes. I think, if panasonic applies cabac entropy coding in the 72Mbps (Inttra) codec, it will be difficult to match. Maybe Panasonic has a working version. I still like to see what MediaInfo returns as properties, and if a HW decoder (mmplayer) can cope with it.

[pvreditor]

Maybe a good idea to try ffdschow, but I think all their codecs relate to long gop modes. I think, if panasonic applies cabac entropy coding in the 72Mbps (Inttra) codec, it will be difficult to match. Maybe Panasonic has a working version. I still like to see what MediaInfo returns as properties, and if a HW decoder (mmplayer) can cope with it.

Okay, if all goes well, here is the information from MediaInfo. I had to format the information so that it fit on a single page, and the formatting didn't carry over well here. But here we go:

General
Complete name: C:\Users\Public\Videos\Test videos\All I-frame clip1.MOV
Format: MPEG-4 .. Format profile: QuickTime
Codec ID: qt .. File size: 197 MiB
Duration: 22s 523ms .. Overall bit rate mode: Variable
Overall bit rate: 73.2 Mbps .. Encoded date: UTC 2013-02-16 14:43:22
Tagged date: UTC 1991-05-06 17:41:33
PANA: DMC-GH3

Video
ID: 1 .. Format: AVC
Format/Info: Advanced Vid Coding .. Format profile: High@L5.0
Format settings, CABAC: No .. Format settings, ReFrames: 2 frames
Format settings, GOP: N=1 .. Codec ID: avc1
Codec ID/Info: Advanced Video Coding
Duration: 22s 523ms .. Bit rate mode: Variable
Bit rate: 71.7 Mbps .. Width: 1920 pixels
Height: 1080 pixels .. Display aspect ratio: 16:9
Frame rate mode: Constant .. Frame rate: 29.970 fps
Color space: YUV .. Chroma subsampling: 4:2:0
Bit depth: 8 bits .. Scan type: Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame): 1.153 .. Stream size: 192 MiB (98%)
Encoded date: UTC 2013-02-16 14:43:22
Tagged date: UTC 1991-05-06 17:41:33
Color primaries: BT.709 .. Transfer characteristics: BT.709
Matrix coefficients: BT.709

Audio
ID: 2 .. Format : PCM
Format settings, Endianness : Big .. Format settings, Sign: Signed
Codec ID: twos .. Duration: 22s 523ms
Bit rate mode: Constant .. Bit rate: 1536 Kbps
Channel(s): 2 channels .. Channel positions: Front: L R
Sampling rate: 48.0 KHz .. Bit depth: 16 bits
Stream size: 4.12 MiB (2%) .. Encoded date: UTC 2013-02-16 14:43:22
Tagged date: UTC 1991-05-06 17:41:33

Other
ID: 3 .. Type: Time code
Format: QuickTime TC .. Duration: 22s 523ms
Time code of first frame: 00:17:46;15
Time code settings: Striped .. Encoded date: UTC 2013-02-16 14:43:22
Tagged date: UTC 1991-05-06 17:41:33
Bit rate mode: CBR

I don't have any sort of media player that can play these files, only my computers. Of course, I can play back the 72 Mbps source files in the camera and I can plug the camera into a big-screen TV. The files play back smoothly in the camera's display, and should do the same on a big TV. I assume the camera has a hardware decoder for these video files, but don't know for sure. To be honest, I really don't know what sort of player would have a hardware decoder for this format of video. Is one even made?

Bob Kovacs
http://www.bobkovacs.com

[erdna]

Thanks. No Cabac=less complesity that;s good, but High@L5 is very demanding. Still to see what happens, can you download the free "bitrate viewer"program to verify the peak bitrates in your original mov (72Mbps VBR!) and the rendered AVCHD/MPEG2 (VBR)? I am still convinced the a mmplayer (Xtreamer,AC Ryan, Medi8ter,...)can handle yr file better. Can't you upload an original file?

[pvreditor]

... Can't you upload an original file?

I would be happy to upload a file to help get a better handle on editing this. Do you have a site that I can upload to?

Bob Kovacs
http://www.bobkovacs.com

[erdna]

I often use WeTransfer (www,wetransfer.com). Upload to yourself and post the link which you will get back (e-mail) after a while, from WT .

[pvreditor]

Here is the link to download one of the 72 Mbps clips. According to the e-mail I received, this link is good only until March 19, 2013:

http://we.tl/rRKZBBAmpB

I'm curious as to what anyone else can make of it. It plays smoothly on my computer, but all renders I've tried so far have been jerky during pans.

Bob Kovacs
http://www.bobkovacs.com

[erdna]

Thanks Bob. Got same results: no way to get clean edits with VS...up to now. The multi mediaplayer doesn't solve the problem. I will do some more tests tomorrow and report.

[erdna]

I did some more tests. Nothing works in VS. I only found (link) that Edius6 and WinXHD (as a converter) can handle the footage. Btw. was OIS on when shootong yourvideo?
http://we.tl/dDPZ6nQ2ae

[pvreditor]

I did some more tests. Nothing works in VS. I only found (link) that Edius6 and WinXHD (as a converter) can handle the footage. Btw. was OIS on when shootong yourvideo?
http://we.tl/dDPZ6nQ2ae

Thank you so much for trying. I actually thought that the WinXHD footage looked a little cleaner, despite it being more compressed. I will try later today to see how that edits in VideoStudio. And yes, I did have the image stabilization turned on.

I was thinking of downloading the trial versions of Sony Vegas and Adobe Premiere to see how they cope with the all I-Frame files. I'm in the early stages of developing a documentary and I'd like to shoot/edit it at the highest bit rate. (Most networks insist on at least 50 Mbps, despite the quality of well-done AVCHD footage.) It would be fantastic if the next version of VS could handle this format, in addition to stepping up to 64-bit functionality.

Bob Kovacs
http://www.bobkovacs.com