Videostudio Pro X5 very slow multi-trim

[mikeb]

I have bought Videostudio Pro X5 to replace my older VS10 version for faster rendering, and are pleased with the reduced times, but I am very disappointed with the multi-trim function which is so slow that I find it unusable on mpeg 2 files above about 1 hour long. Part of my business is to transfer customers VHS tapes to DVDs, these are often 2-3 hours long. They are captured using a Canopus EMR100 encoder. I use multi-trim to trim the start and ends and to remove some poor sections between. As I move the cursor there is a delay of up to 6 seconds with the green star showing before the image changes. With this 6 second delay it takes a long time to move backwards and forwards to select specific frames to crop to, which makes it almost unusable. If I put the same video into VS10 there is no delay at all, X5 works ok if the files are below about 1 hour long.

My computer is a i7 930 2.8GHz 3.5GB ram, 1GB Nvidia GT520, fitted with system SSD and HDD Windows XP pro 32bit. I have been in contact with Coral who have suggested several things to try but none has helped. They said that I was not getting the best out of the software using it on a 32 bit system.

I have made up a new system using an i5 2400 at 3.10 Ghz, 12GB ram, 1 GHz Nvidia GT610, SSD, HDD, Windows 7 64 bit. Unfortunately there is virtually no improvement. In my emails to Coral I kept asking them if there was any delay on their computers with large mpeg 2 files but they never answered this question. If it wasn’t for the faster rendering times I would give up and just use VS10.

If anyone has any ideas I would be very grateful.

Michael

[lata]

Hi Michael

I do not use Multi Trim but prefer to use the scissors in the main timeline to cut the video, deleting the sections I don’t need, the white bar below the preview screen can also be used along with the F3 / F4 Mark-IN/Out brackets.

Even so there should be little delay in doing this especially with standard definition Mpeg2 files.
If it were AVCHD or non standard video that the program is finding difficult to read then you may have problems/delays.
Strange that you are having problems with both computers.

I have just tried Multi Trim on a 1hr50minute video, no delays the scroll wheel, dragging the cursor is instantaneous.

Can you give the properties of the video files you are using?
Right click a clip in the timeline or library and select properties.
Copy the details to your post, or screen capture (Alt+Prt-Scr) to create a Jpeg and attach to the post.

[mikeb]

Thanks Trevor for your reply.

I have just tried using the scissors function but as I move the cursor along the timeline I get the same long delay. I have attached a jpeg showing the properties of one of my files, I don’t think it is non standard as it works perfectly with VS10. I have checked the project preferences between VS10 and X5 and the only difference I can see is the audio format. VS10 is set to MPEG audio, stereo and X5 is Dolby audio 2/0 (L,R), I cant set it as VS10 as mpeg audio is no listed. I have always been pleased with previous versions of Videostudio and feel that it is something that I am not setting up properly otherwise this forum would be full of people complaining as this slowness makes it virtually unusable for editing.

Regards

Michael

[lata]

Hi Michael

What is the files extension, m2p what is that?

I would expect PalDVD Mpeg2 to use MPG as the file extension.

Try renaming the file to use "clifford 1.mpg", (make a copy first, just in case?)

You may have to convert these to Mpg??????????

[mikeb]

Hi Trevor

The Canopus encoder saves the mpeg files with this odd extension. I have just renamed it as you suggested but I still have the same problem. Below is the Canopus settings.

I was about to upload some more information when I got your reply, I will send it next.

Thanks for all your help

Michael

[mikeb]

Hi Trevor

I have checked a few of the films with X5 that I have recently transferred and found that all the short ones work ok.
Some of the longer ones are ok but others are not. Below is a few of my results

1h:37m slight delay
1h:38m slight delay
1h:35m ok
2h;30m ok
3h:14m ok
3h:14m long delay

All the above work perfectly in VS10. All the same equipment was used in the transfer.

Below are the properties of the last two coincidentally almost the same length, the one on the left had no delay at all, the one on the right had about a 5 sec delay every time the curser was moved, making it almost impossible to edit to specific frames.

Regards
Michael

[lata]

Hi

Everything you show looks normal other than the file extension, i looked at the Corel site for VS5 and the m2p does not show as supported formats. (X5 sales page).

Are you able to set the Canopus encoder to use mpg, maybe over-typing the Extension option shown in the images.

Hopefully someone using the canopus will comment.

As a workround, use VS 10 to multi trim and initial editing, then open the VSP in X5 to complete the editing, once saved with X5 you will not be able to open in VS10, make a copy for VS 10 just in case..............

Otherwise try converting to Mpeg using another program, video converter, not good having to do the extra renders?

[mikeb]

Hi

I have looked at the Canopus settings and I have been able to change the extension to mpg, so when I do my next long video I will see what happens.

Out of curiosity I loaded one of the problem files into VS10 and rendered it so I ended up with a true mpg file to see how X5 gets on with it. It still had the same long delay.

As a temporary measure I will do as you suggest, trimming in VS10 then rendering in X5.

Regards

Michael

[mikeb]

I have now tried capturing a film using the Canopus and setting the file type from m2p to mpg. This made no difference I still had the problem. Its much worse with longer films but sometimes even the longer ones work ok. I have just transferred two films the first one was 2H 49min long 5.00GB, every time I moved the cursor it took about 7 seconds for the video to catch up, the jog shuttle is virtually unusable as the image doesn’t move. The second film was 2H 39min to my surprise with this film there was no delays at all and the jog shuttle worked perfectly. I used the same equipment and had not changed any settings. I tried editing both films in VS10 and they both can be edited properly with instantaneous response from the cursor or jog shuttle. As a test I copied the film again using a second Canopus unit and VCR to see if there was any improvement. It was exactly the same as the first recording, very slow to edit. I have looked at the file properties in X5 of the two files to see if there is a difference that could slow one of them down but I cannot see one. Unfortunately I don’t know anyone local to me that has X5 so that I could try this video on their set up in case there is something odd with my settings. I think I am going to give up and use VS10 for editing longer films.
Thanks for your help
Michael

[lata]

Hi Michael

I dont know why VS 10 reacts quicker than X5, but seems strange that one of the videos has no problems, which would suggest a problem with the video file its self.

However i am surprised at the length of the video files at 2 hrs 39 minutes is very long.
The file size of 5gb will not fit to a standard disc which holds 4.3 Gb
No problem if you are intending to burn HD BluRay which seems a little excessive for VHS

A bit rate (Data rate of 4500 is suitable for VHS quality, 4000kbps would allow for 2 hours per disc.
Either you are gonna use two discs or re-code to a lower bit rate, maybe 3500kbps, the latter will reduce quality.

Have you considered capturing shorter footage, this would make editing easier. If not reduce the capture data rate to produce a file below 4.3 Gb. Guess that depends on the subject matter?

By the way do you set the project properties to match the video properties.?

[mikeb]

Hi Trevor

Yes I do set the project properties to match the video properties. These files come from VHS tapes. I often get tapes over 2 hours, I transfer the complete tape and then edit it and split it at a convenient point. As you mentioned I keep the files below 2 hours per DVD to keep the quality. I am worried that there could be something wrong with my computer setup, If you were interested to see if you get the same problems as I get, I am happy to put the two files on a memory stick and post them to you, I wouldn’t want the memory stick returned to me. If so please email me with an address.
I would be grateful for any help.

Michael

[canuck]

I would capture in 1 hour segments and burn those to a DVD. That way you can keep almost the original quality of the VHS video. A standard 4.7GB DVD can only hold 60 minutes of video at the best quality (~8000kbs bitrate), any longer and the video has to be compressed even more and you start to lose quality. Smaller files are also easier/quicker to edit.

[lata]

Hi Michael

As you have already said one of the Mpeg files works ok the other is slow, I doubt very much if I will see any difference.
So if it was a PC issue both files would be affected.

You don’t have any virus scanners programmed to do periodic scans? slowing the PC????

Capturing the VHS, if you capture 2 hours of video does the process complete in one go without dropped frames.
I remember having Buffer Underrun issues when capturing long analogue files. The incoming stream needs to be encoded on the fly as it were, maybe I am thinking of an older slower PC?

But if there are capture issues they may be creating corupt files that Video Studio is struggling to read.

Using the Mpeg2 that is giving problems, use a program to convert the video, maybe Super
Use similar settings as to original.
Then try using video studio, if there is an improvement then we can suspect the original files?

[mikeb]

Hi Trevor

I don’t have a anti-virus program on the computer I used for this transfer as I never connect it to the internet.
The Canopus is an external device connected to a USB port. I don’t get any error messages, I feel embarrassed to ask this but how would I know if I was getting dropped frames. I have done several 4 hour long videos with no error messages. I tried to download and install Super but I had so much trouble with extras like tool bars etc that I gave up. I tried loading the video file into X5 then rendered and saved it. The new mpeg file still had the delay, if there was an error in the file wouldn’t X5 have removed it. Is there another video converter program that you can think of to try.
I have just copied two camcorder tapes, one 1h34m no problems and the other one 1h48m had the long delay when editing.

Regards
Michael

[lata]

Hi Michael

Dropped Frames

Go to Preferences F6 - Capture Tab--Tick Show Dropped Frames.

When you capture the Drop Frame Counter shows in the information panel, lower right of list.
Note only shows during capture. The counter should be zero.......try a capture
---------------
The camcorder you were using, what type is it. if Mini DV does it use Passthrough. This is where you connect the composite cables to the camera input and Firewire to the pc.

I understand what you mean when referring to Super their web pages are a nightmare.
The actual download link is on the third window, i think, but at the bottom. But yes you do download a load of rubbish, maybe I should have warned you. Sorry