Why is the file so big?

[StitchedPigeon]

I'm working in VSX4 (I just got it so please forgive me for being a newb). I've created a couple of small movies which I want to compile onto a single dvd. The video files from both movies combined only amount to about 3.2 GB, yet when I try to "share" and make the dvd with both of my vsp files, it adds up to be a total of over 7 GB. What am I doing wrong? AM I doing something wrong? Is it normal to have this much "inflation" on a project? I've not done anything special as far as graphics or fancy menus or even chapter markers. It's just a handful of clips with the "crossfade" transition applied. And that's it.

Thanks for any help you can provide!

[BrianCee]

The size of the file created in the 'Share' option depends entirely on what settings YOU chose to use when creating the file - what are the properties of the two clips you are using and what are the properties of the single file created by the share step. Is this 7GB before the file has been converted to burn to disc or after final conversion to a DVD compliant file.

[Ken Berry]

To tell us the all-important information about your original files, please right click on one of them in the VS timeline, and please copy ALL its Properties here.

If your original video is, for example, highly compressed mpeg-4, whether high or standard definition, then it has to be decompressed to DVD-standard mpeg-2, which is automatically less compressed and therefore bigger...

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi

Can you also tell us the total length of your video files in minutes.
If you use the standard DVD template then you will create a file approx 4 Gb for 60 minutes.

If your file is 7 Gb I am guessing that the length in minutes is 100ish.

[StitchedPigeon]

NTSC DVD
138,272 KB
631.131 Sec
MPEG-2 Video
18,915 Frames

Does this help any? How do you change the import settings? Thanks!

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi

If you use Share -- Create Video File – DVD the template will create a video file approximately 4.3 Gb per hour. It will use a bit rate of 8000kbps.
----------------------------
If you use Share Create Video File – Custom –Mpeg Files –Options –compression tab.
Reducing the Video Data Rate (Bit Rate) to 4000kbps, Will produce a video file of 4.3 Gb but for a two hour video.

You haven’t yet told us how long your video files are. We are assuming at 7 Gb that the movie is 1 hr 40 minutes

For 60 minutes use 8000kbps
At 90 minutes you should use a data rate of 6000kbps
At 120 minutes you should use a data rate of 4000kbps


You can always use the Make Movie Templates Manager to create your own template, Using the add function browse for your video files. Then edit the template reducing the video data rate………

Typical Settings

MPEG files
24 bits, 720 x 480, 29.97 fps
Upper or Lower Field First -------------- (same as original)
(DVD-NTSC), 16:9
Video data rate: Variable (Max. 6000 kbps) ---------- Depends on total length of movie
Audio data rate: 256 kbps
Dolby Digital Audio, 48 KHz, 2/0(L,R)

[StitchedPigeon]

My movie is about 2 hours long. It is various clips imported from home movies. I take it Bit Rate is like resolution. So lowering the bit rate would reduce the video quality right? What exactly is the Make Movies Templates Manager used for and once I change the settings how do I use it.

[Ken Berry]

Bitrate is not related to resolution. However, it IS related directly to quality. A high bitrate usually means high quality (putting aside the question of the person handling the camera!!!) And low bitrate usually means lower quality. But you have to bear in mind that different formats use quite different ranges of bitrates. The ones we are talking about here relate to standard definition DVDs and the mpeg-2 which is used with them. 8000kbps as a bitrate will give you high quality. But the higher the bitrate, the larger the size of the resulting file. So that means conversely that it you want high quality on your DVD, you have to accept that you can burn less video in the same space available. 6000 kbps will still give you good quality, but 4000 kbps will only be about the same as VHS tape quality.

The templates made in Make Movie Template Manager are in effect blueprints which the program can use to make any number of DVDs using the same properties. So if you think you are going to have a lot of 2 hour videos using 4000 kbps, you make a template with those properties, and give it an obvious name you will remember e.g. 2hourproject. Then next time you have such a project, and have finished editing it, you can then go Share > Create Video File > and in the menu which will then appear, you will see "2hourproject" down at the bottom. You choose that, and it will churn out a new DVD-compatible mpeg-2 with those properties automatically used.

[StitchedPigeon]

Thanks for all the great responses! So when I am making a template do I select mpeg, mpeg-4, avi, etc. I guess I don't get why one would choose one format over another. Also, when I am importing AVCHD movies from my camcorder that are 2 hours, what format do I make a dvd with? The camcorder makes really good quality HD movies and I would like to translate that quality to a dvd but I know my movies will be 2 hours or more. How would you make the dvd?

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi

First you gave some property details I assumed of your video file, these indicated a standard NTSC file, hence my reply using the MPEG2 properties.
However you now say you are using AVCHD types.

To give a definite reply we need to know the properties of all the video types you are using.
With the video in the timeline, right click and select properties, what are they?
If you use your keyboard Alt + Prt Sc (print Screen) the window details will be saved to your clipboard, open an Image Editor, Paint will do, Ctrl+V will paste the window as an image, save the image and upload as an Attachment to your post.

Ok

A Standard definition DVD disc uses Mpeg2 video files. (aka-- DVD-NTSC). Your files/project will be converted to this format to burn the disc.
By making a Template you can control the Data Rate (bit rate) thus controlling the size of the video file. and once created is available to use again.
A standard DVD holds 4.3 Gb

Settings-Make Movie Templates Manager
Some details of how to use, be aware that they were created using Pal, start reading from the point where you select NEW.
http://lata.me.uk/video_studio/manager/manager.htm

MPEG files
24 bits, 720 x 480, 29.97 fps
Upper Field First-----as your original video files
(DVD-NTSC), 16:9
Video data rate: Variable (Max. 4000 kbps) ---allows for 120 minutes
Audio data rate: 256 kbps
Dolby Digital Audio, 48 KHz, 2/0(L,R)

The template will be available from Share Create Video File—adjacent to the custom option
This will produce a file suitable for Standard Definition DVD


There are a few types of disc to consider……………..

1 / ---Standard Definition DVD (Single Layer ) hold 4.3 Gb of data or 60 minutes at full quality.
120 Minutes at VHS quality.
2 / ---Standard Definition Dual Layer same as above but holds twice as much.

3 / AVCHD Hybrid disc, this uses the HD video but burned to a Standard Definition disc, holds about 40 minutes—Blur ray Player required to play the disc

4 / Bluray disc, I think these hold 25 Gb, I don’t use Bluray Ken is our HD expert and will I am sure explain further. Blu ray burner required + discs—and Bluray Player required to play the disc


Just to confirm an you tell us just where you live or that you are Pal or NTSC

To Make/Burn a DVD
After creating the video file using your template, which should be under 4.3 Gb.
Start a new project, with nothing in the timelines
Share Create Disc – DVD —this opens the burner module.
Icon Top left – Add Video—browse your hard drive for your video.

After creating the menu, on the final window, Burn Disc

[Ken Berry]

Also, when I am importing AVCHD movies from my camcorder that are 2 hours, what format do I make a dvd with?

Just to be absolutely clear, as Trevor has already indicated, a standard definition DVD uses mpeg-2. This is not just a matter of whim: mpeg-2 is the international standard for DVDs (though the old low quality mpeg-1 format can also be used). And in fact it is not just any old mpeg-2, but ones that have specific properties. Moreover, in the process of authoring/burning a DVD, the mpeg-2 files involved are further converted to ones that use the .vob extension and not .mpg.

While you can. of course, burn videos in different formats e.g. DivX or XVid, or indeed any other type as well, this makes the disc only a storage or archive disc. (Most DVD players, however, can recognise when such a disc contains DivX or XVid video, and will play it, but it is still not a standard def DVD by international standard.)

As Trevor also indicated, you can burn AVCHD video direct to a DVD (as opposed to a Blu-Ray disc) in the form of what is called a hybrid or AVCHD disc. In effect, a BDMV folder is created on the DVD, just as it would be on a Blu-Ray disc, and the AVCHD files are contained in a STREAM sub-folder and use the .m2ts extension. Bitrate also determines quality on these discs. Using the highest quality bitrate currently available for such discs (another international standard) of 18,000 kbps allows only about 20 minutes of AVCHD on a single layer DVD (or 40 minutes on a dual layer DVD). But by lowering the bitrate, you can burn more video. However, if you lower it too far, you are getting down into standard definition appearances, which rather defeats the purpose of having a high def camera in the first place. And the important thing to remember is that such discs can only be played on a Blu-Ray player which is rated to play such discs. It's a bit like DVDs or CDs with DivX on it. Such rated players will have a sticker on its top front edge which looks like this:

AVCHD Logo.jpg (4.76 KiB) Viewed 3690 times

The main attraction of hybrid discs is that they form a convenient and cheaper way of playing AVCHD in its original format, given that DVD blanks are very cheap these days. Note also that the PlayStation 3 can play such discs, just as it can Blu-Ray discs.

But to repeat: the bottom line is that if you are burning a standard definition DVD, you have no choice in the matter. Your AVCHD has to be down-converted to standard definition mpeg-2 somewhere along the line. That means that you will already have lost an awful lot of the original quality. By then burning the DVD using a bitrate of 4000 kbps, you will be trashing the quality even more. That's if you're using a single layer DVD -- not so bad if you use a dual layer disc. I have to say, however, that I and otherr users have had difficulty producing successful dual layer DVDs. Could work for you, though you'd need to experiment first.

The other alternative would be to split your project in two, and produce two one hour discs using the highest quality DVD bitrate of 8000 kbps. Your audience might also thank you for the break after sitting there for the first hour!!

Blu-Ray discs come in two flavours: a single layer disc which holds 25 GB, and a dual layer one which can hold 50 GB.

[StitchedPigeon]

Sorry for the confusion. I am actually working on two different projects. The first project was the reason why the post was initially created. I am combining home movies from dvds that I had made years ago on a dvd burner. I believe I understand now that regardless of what format files I import, they will be converted over to DVD-NTSC when I click the Create Disc then DVD option.

The second project I am working on is making home movies with my Canon M31 HD camcorder (AVCHD). We typically make one disc with chapters for all of our travels during the year. I guess I was hoping that I could get high quality two hours worth of movies on to a dvd. I mean the dvds at Blockbuster have two or more hours worth of quality film on them. How do they do that?

Thank you all for your patience. You responses have been a great help!

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi

One other thing to consider is interlacing, the field order either uses upper or lower.
The basic rule being to use the original field order, Avchd uses Upper Field, indeed most video now uses upper field, DV-Avi uses Lower Field.
The video from your old DVD’s should be checked for their field order, this should be kept throughout to burning the new DVD.

Chapters,
I don’t use chapter points, but prefer to create separate video file of my projects
Like you I create a DVD of our travels, but create shorter videos, 15 / 20 minutes long

I then add the video files to the burner module, each video file I add gives me a link (title) on the Main Menu.
The video files are compliant Mpeg2 suitable for burning to disc without further conversions.


If you want high quality then use bluray, you will need a bluray burner and a bluray player, and the discs of course. Kens your man for HD

[Ken Berry]

You asked how come commercially produced DVDs can have so much high quality video on them. It is because they are produced on extremely expensive equipment and with very sophisticated and expensive software. Essentially, the use multi-pass technology which scans the video a number of times to work out the absolutely best way of squeezing as much video as possible into a given space. For instance, scenes without much action don't require a high bitrate, whereas action scenes do if they are to maintain quality. So this multi-pass scanning works out exactly what bitrate is required to best play back every inch of the video.

A consumer level program like Video Studio does not have this luxury. It does have the option of using two-pass encoding with VBR (variable bitrate) video, but that's as far as it goes.

Commercial DVDs are also pressed from a master disc, instead of using the individual burning which we have to use. And burning has its its own constraints which impact directly on size and quality.

[DVDDoug]

I mean the dvds at Blockbuster have two or more hours worth of quality film on them. How do they do that?

Most commercial discs are dual-layer. The discs I've looked at typically have 6 or 7GB of data on them. Commercial single-layer discs seem to be rare. You can burn dual-layer discs if you get some dual-layer blanks ("DVD+R DL" or "DVD-R DL") as long as your burner is capable of burning dual-layer discs (all of the newer burners can burn dual-layer).

The downsides are, some DVD players have trouble with "burned" (homemade) dual-layer discs, and I've had a higher percentage of "bad burns" than with regular single-layer discs. So I try to avoid them. And, they are more expensive.

Or... If you don't want to calculate or experiment with the bitrate, you can create the DVD folders on your hard drive and re-compress with DVDshrink (FREE!!!) before burning.