DISC BURNING PROBLEM

[ianwoody123]

Not sure if this has been posted already - could not find it. Once I managed a complete install of X4 having had to wipe the laptop completely and start again with everything the program has been running well with the exception of no preview window when downloading mini dv footage from my panasonic camcorder. Last night I tried to create a dvd using one of the thumbnail menus as I had 5 scenes to include in the menu. The first disc burnt correctly followed by two discs which would not play - the dvd player came up with 'bad disc'. Went back to the menu I normally use that has never given any problems only to encounter the same thing, this time with the added problem that it wouldn't eject the disc. Uninstalled X4 and then re-installed it with the resulting message - X4 may not have installed correctly. Before when I had this it just meant I had very few menu templates but other than that the program worked fine. Again I have only 3 menu templates but went ahead and tried to burn a dvd. Again, the first one burnt fine but nothing after that would burn correctly or eject. Any help would be appreciated. Am using rendered footage in avi format as I always have, previously with no problems at all.

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi

From the editing timeline you have two options to Burn a Disc.

1 / first Share Create a Video file – DVD , then from a new project Share Create Disc-Add video file.
This would burn the dvd without further rendering. (Take care with the frame order )

2 / from the edit timeline Share Create Disc would mean the project is rendered prior to burning the disc.
What workflow are you using.???????

The first method is recommended. (View my quick guide from the link below.)
I assume your original video file are DV-Avi types
Can you right click your original clip and select properties, what are they.?

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Only having three menu options suggests that you haven’t installed the Contents file that is provided to complete the installation of Video Studio.

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What type of discs are you using I prefer DVD-R rather than DVD+R

[ianwoody123]

Hi Trevor

Thank you very much for your input. I always use the first method when creating dvds as I have found it to be the most reliable. I video mounted games (sports day on horseback). On an hour long tape I can get 4 teams worth of footage. This is downloaded as DV-AVI types. I then edit the individual teams out and create a video file of each one using the "same as first video clip" option. This renders it still in avi format as I have found this to be clearer than using mpeg. I then clear the timeline and under the share option move on to "create disc". Select dvd and then when the screen comes up I then "add media". The initial capture of film is saved on a 1TB external hard drive and I output the rendered video file to another external 1TB hard drive from which I then add the media to the disc creation setup. Up until today this has worked extremely well and I have not had any problems with burning discs. What changed goodness only knows.

I would agree that the re-installation has not been complete. This is what was happening when I first tried to install X4 on my laptop. In the end I had to wipe the hard drive completely and start again from scratch - Windows 7 -- absolutely everything. X4 did then install completely for the first time and has worked well since up until today. I am sure you can appreciate I do not wish to go thro that process again just to install X4 in its entirety. I did not encounter problems like this when I used X2 - that installed without any problems once the appropriate patches were added. I also feel that since the re-installation today the output to the dvd is not as clear as it was when it was working properly.

I use Taiyo Yuden dvd-r discs which I have found to be the most reliable so far.

PROPERTIES:

File format: Microsoft AVI files - Open DML
File Size: 12,507,803 KB
Frame Rate: 25.000 frames/sec
Data Rate: 1304.06 Kps
Video Compression: DV Encoder Type 1
Attributes 24 bits, 720 x 576 16.9
Total Frames: 88,933 frames
Audio:
Compression: DV Audio - PAL
Attributes: 32,000 KHz, 12 bit stereo
Total Samples: 113,834,240 samples

Ian

[Ken Berry]

I then edit the individual teams out and create a video file of each one using the "same as first video clip" option. This renders it still in avi format as I have found this to be clearer than using mpeg.

I hate to say it, but that is a somewhat pointless workflow. Moreover, it is NOT what Trevor was suggesting in his point 1 above. He said you use 'Share > Create Video File > DVD'. That will prepare a DVD-compatible mpeg-2 if your project is an hour or less long. (If it is longer, you would need to choose Share > Create Video File > Custom, choosing mpeg-2 as the format and reducing the bitrate: 6000 kbps for 90 minutes of video; 4000 kbps for a 2 hour project.)

What you don't seem to realise is that by international standard, a video DVD *must* be in mpeg-2 format (and in some cases, the older mpeg-1 format). But DV -- regardless of how good it is -- is NOT part of the DVD standard. So when you first produce a new DV/AVI file of your project, and then insert that in the burning module, it is going to be converted again during the burning process into mpeg-2 before being actually burned to the disc. That will obviously add significantly to the time taken to burn the disc. But it also opens up the possibility of things going wrong during that particular conversion/burning process. Authoring and burning a disc are complicated enough processes in themselves, without adding to them a very complicated conversion process.

[ianwoody123]

Hi Ken

I have just done as you have said and burned a disc having rendered the footage as dvd 16.9. There is a slight drop off in clarity compared to the way I have been doing things so far. This is why I started doing it that way in the first place. The camera I use is a Panasonic NV-GS400 which has a lovely clear picture. Converting the footage directly to Mpeg seems to take away some of that clarity. There is a gain however in that I can fit more on a dvd. By setting it to burn just one copy at a time the program is burning dvds correctly. This is a bit more long-winded but successful.

Ian

[Ken Berry]

Clarity/quality is usually only a question of the bitrate used. With a project of one hour or less, you can use a bitrate of 8000 kbps and get the highest quality in your mpeg-2. And quality should be the same, using that bitrate, regardless of whether you first produce a new mpeg-2 in the editing module or when it is converted to mpeg-2 as part of the burning process. Both the codec used and the time taken for the conversion will be exactly the same, regardless of where the conversion takes place.

If you have now followed our suggested workflow, then in the burning module, click on the middle icon down in the bottom left of the burning screen, the one looking like a cogwheel and which says Project Settings when you hover the mouse over it. Is the box beside 'Do not convert compliant MPEG files' ticked? If not, then tick it. Otherwise, the whole thing will be converted yet again, and mpeg is a lossy format. That could in itself account for the slight degradation in quality you can detect.

Also, when you created your new mpeg file, did you check to ensure that it used Lower Field First? It has to do so because the original DV/AVI uses Lower Field First and a basic rule of video editing is that you have to use the same Field Order throughout a project. Using Upper instead of Lower Field First will produce quality artifacts, including jagged edges on vertical straight lines and some jerkiness in fast moving pans.

I note in this regard that X4 uses Upper Field First by default in its DVD template, both in the Editor and in the Burning Module. Following our suggested workflow, therefore, it would probably be best for you to make your own template using Make Movie Template Manager, and including a high bitrate (8000 kbps for a one hour project; 6000 kbps for 90 minutes) and ensuring it is Lower Field First. You could fit about 10 minutes more of video on a DVD also if you use Dolby audio instead of the standard LPCM. You could try this out first on a single disc using Share > Create Video File > Custom, and then clicking on the Options button to change the Field Order to Lower Field First.

[ianwoody123]

Hi Ken

Thanks for that. Will try it asap.

Ian

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi

Excellent Ken
I was going to expand on the frame order regarding X4 using Upper Frame, seems corel has brought this in line with HD video, to be expected I suppose.

Ian

One other option you should use and does improve quality, make sure if using “variable” bit rate that you select 2_Pass encoding.
Do this when using the make Movie Templates Manager.

I generally use Constant bit rate, but when I have used Variable I have noticed an increase in quality when using 2 pass.

If you set the project properties to your Mpeg DVD file, with an empty timeline do Share Create Disc, the convert options under the cogwheel will reflect the project properties and use Lower field.

Having said that when adding a Compliant Mpeg DVD file to the burner module no re-coding will take place, the settings being superfluous to requirements. (not needed)

Ian…..Read my Quick Guides for Dv-Avi, from the link below.

[ianwoody123]

Hi Ken/Trevor

Thank you very much for your advice. I now have a dvd using the settings you recommended which is as good in quality as the original footage from the camcorder. Brilliant. All I need now is how to get the best from my new camcorder which is a Panasonic HDC-TM700 high def camcorder. Any help would be much appreciated on settings to use to get the best result from this footage but onto a dvd disc as I do not have a blu ray player so a high definition disc is not an option at the moment.

It produces AVCHD Video .MTS
Data Rate 12593kbps
Total Bitrate 12849kbps
25 frames per second
1920/1080 frame size

Ian

[ianwoody123]

Actually have been looking through earlier posts on AVCHD video which more or less covers it so please ignore that part of my last post.

Ian

[ianwoody123]

Hi

Despite following the workaround suggested by your good selves which has resulted in a vastly improved end result I still cannot burn more than one disc at a time which makes it a very lengthy process when you have a few to produce. Any thoughts on the problem would be greatly appreciated.

Ian

[Ken Berry]

I personally don't use the VS route for burning multiple copies. I used to around about the time of VS 7 which was eight years ago. But I soon found it rather cumbersome. These days, I simply "burn" DVD Folders (a Video_TS folder, in fact) or AVCHD hybrid disc/Blu-Ray folders in VS, and use Nero to make as many copies of these as possible. Other people make ISO files instead and do the same with third party software -- though I think that VS cannot make ISO files for at least AVCHD hybrid discs, and possibly also BD discs -- only Folders. But the end result is exactly the same. You have the complete structure of the final disc in both an ISO and a Folder, and it only remains to burn it to disc.

[ianwoody123]

Hi Ken,

Thanks. Having seen the posts re Nero possibly causing a few issues with VS I take it you have had no such problems. At the moment I can still make copies on our old XP desktop which gets round the problem. I would agree with you that doing multiple copies (when it had been working ok) had been much more long winded in VS4 than Ulead 9.

Ian

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi Ian

VS 9 is provided with a Disc Image Recorder (BurnIxa.exe) there are 4 files, copy to the new pc.

Create an iso using X4, use the recorder provided with VS9 to burn the multiple discs.
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I have a LG disc recorder (CD-Drive) which came with some software that allows burning iso’s
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DVD Shrink will burn Iso files (I think)

[Ken Berry]

...And for the record, reported problems between Nero and VS only relate to a Nero module -- InCD -- which can take control of a computer burner drive and deny access to it for other programs like VS. But that has been a known problem since about Nero 6, and since then Nero itself has adapted its own program to ensure that InCD is not loaded, as it was before, automatically. Now you have to consciously download and install it, and few people do that. Otherwise, there is absolutely no problem burning with Nero...