How do I make DVD videos look better on TV screen?

[Chris B]

Hi.

I am a new user of X4 and have used X2 for only about six months so some of my questions may seem lame, but here they are.

First, I upgraded to X4 to get rid of that annoying AVCHD blip problem (it worked). But, I have become increasingly frustrated that the quality of my DVDs are still fairly poor to my mind. I have been taking HD videos of my daughter playing soccer and the videos look good on my computer (in clip mode, anyway, as opposed to project mode, which probably takes more processing power than I have). However, they don't look that good to me when I watch DVDs I have created.

The camcorder is a Sony HDR – CX150 and its native MTS files are 1440x1080. After some reading, I discovered that standard DVD conversion plummets the resolution to 720x480, or 480p. So, perhaps that is part of the answer for why a standard DVD format of the soccer game doesn't look so nice on a 37" 720P or 1080i LCD Vizio TV? The 720x480 picture is being stretched to fit? OK, but why does motion look so bad? The image is decent when people are standing still, but I see a lot of blur and, sometimes, streaking when the camera pans or people start to run. What can I do about that?

I tried upping the bitrate for the DVD MPEG settings (from 6800 to 9800), but that did not help. I thought perhaps I could try making an AVCHD DVD using the 1920x1080 resolution and play it on my Blu-ray player (a Samsung BD-P1590) to see if that might look good. It didn't. In fact, it seemed to be the same or even slightly worse.

So, how do I get the good quality videos I am taking to translate to the TV screen? I have tried two different DVD players and TVs as well as my laptop. All in all, I am unimpressed with the result. Thanks in advance for any help on this matter.

- Chris B.

[Ken Berry]

Naturally, downgrading HD video to SD quality is going to amount to a fairly significant quality hit. It's the nature of the beast. But your description of the streaking etc in fast-moving or panning shots makes me wonder if you have somehow or other switched the Field Order. Your original video will be Upper Field First, and you must maintain that when your create a DVD. Otherwise, you get the sort of effect you are talking about.

As for the AVCHD discs you mention, you don't say what properties you used or how long the video was that you were fitting on a disc. I have found that using the highest quality bitrate permissible on such discs (around 18 Mbps), it gives extremely high quality video equivalent to Blu-Ray, but I can only fit about 20 minutes of video on a single layer DVD.

Now with your original video being only 1440 x 1080, I assume its bitrate would be around 15 Mbps. And if you use that bitrate, it should give you equivalent quality to the original, but you could probably fit closer to 30 minutes on a DVD.

Basically, though, the more you squeeze onto a DVD, the lower the bitrate will need to become, until you are getting down around DVD quality, and the less acceptable image you describe.

[Chris B]

Ken,

Thanks for responding. That's a good point about the upper/lower field first. I had not thought to check it, but remember it defaulting to lower field first when creating video files and, I think, regular DVDs. According to X4 – using right-click/properties -- the MTS files are natively 16 Mbps (variable). I had gone with the default settings for AVCHD and they are set to 16 Mbps (max) variable. (How do you get around 18 Mbps, by the way?) Also, the quality setting slider was set to 90 and it was on upper field first. The video was about 42 minutes and took up about 3.5 GB (or 3.76) on the disc.

For the AVCHD, perhaps I should lower the resolution down to 1440x1080 to more correctly match the original footage? I think I will try the higher field first setting change for video files and standard DVDs to see if there is a quality improvement.

[Ken Berry]

(How do you get around 18 Mbps, by the way?)

You can either select Share > Create Video File > AVCHD (1920 x 1080) where 18 Mbps is the default; or else Share > Create Video File > Custom. Then you select, under Save as File Type: "MPEG Transport Stream", then Click Options, and select the third tab (Compression). Then you select H.264 as the video format, and manually vary the bitrate to 18 Mbps (it will only go as high as 20 Mbps). And on the second tab (General), you can select, as Frame Size, either 1920 x 1080 or your original 1440 x 1080.

[Chris B]

OK. Well, I tried making some more DVDs and I guess I will have to accept that the quality of standard DVDs is mediocre when it comes to panning or sustained movement, like girls running in a soccer game. That's annoying, but so be it. What I don't understand and am quite frustrated about is that my AVCHD videos are, as best I can tell, no different in quality.

I tried upping the bitrate to 18 Mbps, as Ken suggested, and checked to make sure the upper field first option was being used (it looks to be the default). My original footage is upper field first. I also have chosen the “Do not convert compliant MPEG files” option. The defaults for AVCHD seem quite good in theory. But, after trying both 1920x1080 and 1440x1080 (which matches the original Sony MTS footage) and allowing the default 90 percent quality slider choice, my AVCHD DVD video looks essentially identical to my standard 6,800 or 9,800 bitrate DVD video outputs, which are set to 720x480. How can this be?

Now, I have not recently tried the two-pass conversion option because I never noticed it helping with standard DVD video and it take so darn long to finish. I could be wrong, but I doubt the quality improvement would be that significant here.

In case it matters, the video is about 42 minutes and, I guess, barely fits on the disc. Also, I cannot change the frame rate; it is permanently set to 29.97. If there is anything else that might give someone insight into this problem, please ask.


A secondary issue I am having deals with aspect ratio. I am shooting in 16:9 and creating DVDs in 16:9 ratio. However, it seems that both my standard DVDs and AVCHDs are playing at 4:3 ratio on my Blu-ray player or, on the standard DVD player, at something that ends up stretching the horizontal to the edges, but not the vertical. In the latter case, it makes the people look wider than they really are. I don't think I had this problem in X2. Now, every disc I create does not seem to want to go to full screen 16:9. I either have the full letter box effect all around the video or on the top and bottom. Interestingly enough, some of the DVD menus are full screen. Has anyone else had this problem?

Hope that's not too much for one post. Thanks, in advance, for any help.

- Chris

[Ron P.]

If your making DVDs, which are not high-def, they are standard-def, the Frame Sizes, and frame rates are locked into the the International DVD Specs. No getting around it. While there are several acceptable variances, they do not exceed the maximum of 720 x 480, and 29.97, and 10,000kbps for NTSC video. Down-res or scaling down a high-def video to standard-def, should still produce a very high quality DVD.

If you have a lot fast movement in your video, then using the Variable Bitrate (VBR) AND the Two-pass should provide you with a little better quality. It will apply the higher bitrates for the fast motion parts, and the lowest bitrates for the static, or no movement parts. What results is really an average bitrate being applied. The "big boys" of Hollywood use multi-pass encoders that can do around 20 passes, however you could purchase a nice house for about the same money.

For video clips in the editor, on the main video track, try checking the box beside Distort Clip on the attribute tab. Then right-click on your clip, select Fit to Screen, followed by the Keep Aspect Ratio. This may not work properly, as what it seems to me is that it distorts the video to fit the preview monitor screen, which you can resize to all kinds of different sizes just by moving it and other components of the interface.

Are you using the template menus background video/images? If so these should fit your 16:9 projects. If you are importing your own, there should be a button beneath the menu area where you imported your background, that will stretch (or shrink) your image to fit the screen.

[Black Lab]

Much of your problem with the poor quality on fast moving or panning is due to "rolling shutter". Your cam uses CMOS sensors, which are notorious for this. One way to minimize the problem is to increase your cam's frame rate, if possible.
You can read more about it here: http://www.dvxuser.com/jason/CMOS-CCD/

[Chris B]

Ron,

Wow! 20 passes is an incredible number. I wonder how long that takes, even on high-end computers. I guess I will make do with the two-pass option that Videostudio provides. Also, yes, my menus normally do fit the entire screen – it's the video footage itself that is not behaving as I think it ought to. I understand that standard DVDs won't look that good, but I don't get why my AVCHD DVDs don't look any better to me on a Blu-ray player. It's very annoying. I wish I had another Blu-ray player to test it on.

Black Lab,

Thanks for the link. I could only view some of that site's examples because some of the site's links appear dead, but I don't think my problem is well-explained by any of the explanations I saw. Perhaps it is a variant of one of those listed problems that I am experiencing. I'll have to look into increasing the camcorder's frame rate, assuming that is possible.

[joneisele]

Hello everyone and Chris B. I am experiencing a similar issue. I have a new Sony camcorder that records in AVCHD format. I used VSX4 to render a short 8 minute movie in the same format as the first clip (AVCHD) and copied it to my PS3. When I play this movie it looks good even on my 55" high end LCD.

When I use VSX4 to burn a DVD using that same 8 minute AVCHD movie and play it on the same system, the quality falls off a cliff. It looks terrible and has unusual digital artifacts along the lines of what Chris was describing. I realize that DVD video is of lower quality, but we are talking night and day here.

If the issue is just DVD quality video (vs. HD AVCHD), why do the DVD movies I play look so good? I have a fairly high end Yamaha AV receive; and the PS3 upscales DVD's to "near HD" quality.

Is it possible VSX4 is the culprit and does a poor job of conversion? Small world with Chris' experience, I'm trying to put my daughter's school project on DVD's for some relatives to watch and the quality is just appalling.

[Black Lab]

why do the DVD movies I play look so good?

Are you talking commercial DVDs? Comparing home-burned DVDs to commercially produced DVDs is like comparing a Volkswagon to a Ferrari. They look similar, but are made in completely different ways.

[joneisele]

Yes, I was referring to commercial DVD's like you buy or rent from Netflix. I can imagine the manufacturing process is different. Why do DVD's look so good compared to home movies (when the original home movie HD format looks good)? I'm curious to understand why and if we can do anything here.

PS I tried burning a DVD with a trial version of Adobe Premier Elements 9 and while it looked a bit better than VSX4, it was still low quality looking.

[joneisele]

Making more sense now ...

http://www.hightv.de/showthread.php?t=3400