VS11+ 'Blocky' output from DVD burn

RICO · Post by **RICO** » Fri Feb 26, 2010 11:42 am

First ever post so please bear with me !

For many years I'd used VS8, and laterly VS11+, to create simple slide shows from my still camera and simple video projects from my mini-DV camcorder but I'm now thoroughly frustrated with a problem.

I used to use a Panasonic NVGS10 camcorder with absolutley no problems until it died then changed to a Panasonic NVGS230. I upload via Firewire to VS11+ and create my project fine. Preview also good. However, after burning to TDK DVD-R (single layer) the rendered video is not very good. Areas of similar/identical colour appear 'blocky' as panning takes place. Frames appear jerky too. Why? I've not changed any settings since the last camcorder and if I view the footage directly from camcorder to TV it's perfect. Something is obviously happening in the render process. I've tried adjusting anything I can think of but still end up with a poor render overall.

If it's any help, when I updated my still camera from an old Fuji to a much newer Panasonic TZ1, I found that VS8 kept putting an annoying black line down each photo in the rendered slideshow - again it was fine before uploading when viewed directly from camera to TV. After many attempts to rectify I bought the newer VS11+ and all was magically fine on the first project attempt.

Does my camcorder have a similar problem where some sort of newer 'coding process' requires me to purchase a newer version of VS - such as X2 or X3 ?

Please note I only have access to the internet from work and therefore cannot access any 'patches' to upgrade or problem solve issues with the software.

Thanks in advance.

Black Lab · Post by **Black Lab** » Fri Feb 26, 2010 1:47 pm

I've not changed any settings since the last camcorder

And are the settings from the 2 cams identical? We need much more info to go on. Please read the following and supply the requested info:

http://forum.corel.com/EN/viewtopic.php?t=8959

extremekicks · Post by **extremekicks** » Sat Feb 27, 2010 5:25 pm

New Camera - Check settings and manual for additional info.

When rendered if you view via "whatever you use to view" does it still skip? or have your problem?

How many disks did you burn? Did you use a good / clean DVD?

Have you cleaned your burner lately? How much use does your burner / drive get?

Have you tried to just use the clip that is having problems and burn that on DVD?

How much RAM do you have? Do you have alot of transitions? effects? menus? etc.....

Take these steps and apply them. I'm sure you wil find your answer in there somewhere.

sjj1805 · Post by **sjj1805** » Sun Feb 28, 2010 10:27 am

Blockiness is normally caused by using a bit rate that is too low.
Jerkiness is normally caused by an incorrect Field order.

You say you have changed your camcorder, the settings for your new camcorder are probably different to those of your old, plus the recording format may be different. For example your old on e might have recorded in DV whilst the new one in MPEG4.

RICO · Post by **RICO** » Mon Mar 01, 2010 5:49 pm

Black Lab wrote:
I've not changed any settings since the last camcorder
And are the settings from the 2 cams identical? We need much more info to go on. Please read the following and supply the requested info:

http://forum.corel.com/EN/viewtopic.php?t=8959

Sorry for delayed reply. Checked settings for both camcorders (menus and in manuals) and both appear identical. Both miniDV too. Whole project is affected but as an example on one clip, here are clip properties :

FILE
FILE FORMAT: Microsoft AVI files - open DML
FILE SIZE: 219,851 KB
FRAME RATE: 25fps
DATA RATE: 3640.62 kbps

VIDEO
COMPRESSION: DV - TYPE 2
ATTRIBUTES: 24 BITS, 720x576, 4:3

AUDIO
COMPRESSION: PCM
ATTRIBUTES: 32.000kHz, 16 BIT, Stereo

And when trying to burn in VS11+ my project settings are:

MPEG FILES
24 BITS, 720x576, 25fps
Lower Field First
(DVD-PAL), 4:3
VIDEO DATA RATE: VARIABLE (max. 8000kbps)
AUDIO DATA RATE: 256kbps
DOLBY DIGITAL AUDIO, 48kHz 2/0 (L/R)

If I try in VS8 everything remains the same except:

VIDEO DATA RATE: 6000kbps comes up but I can increase to HQ 8000
LPCM AUDIO, 48kHz

I emphasise I only burn at lowest rate (usually 2x) and only ever go for max 60 minutes of footage per disc.

RICO · Post by **RICO** » Mon Mar 01, 2010 6:01 pm

extremekicks wrote:New Camera - Check settings and manual for additional info. Done - appear identical.

When rendered if you view via "whatever you use to view" does it still skip? or have your problem? Whether viewed on TV or on desktop monitor problem persists.

How many disks did you burn? Did you use a good / clean DVD? Tried several times on brand new TDK dvd-r - different disc each time.

Have you cleaned your burner lately? How much use does your burner / drive get? Cleaned every 3 months but only gets used about once per month if that. Should point that everything works perfectly, first time, when burning a stills slideshow to same discs.

Have you tried to just use the clip that is having problems and burn that on DVD? Yes, problem persists on one clip or all 60 minutes.

How much RAM do you have? Do you have alot of transitions? effects? menus? etc..... 2GB RAM - few transitions, only fade to black occasionally, no effects.

Take these steps and apply them. I'm sure you wil find your answer in there somewhere.

RICO · Post by **RICO** » Mon Mar 01, 2010 6:08 pm

sjj1805 wrote:Blockiness is normally caused by using a bit rate that is too low.
Jerkiness is normally caused by an incorrect Field order.

You say you have changed your camcorder, the settings for your new camcorder are probably different to those of your old, plus the recording format may be different. For example your old on e might have recorded in DV whilst the new one in MPEG4.

At a burn rate of 6000 (in VS8) or variable max 8000 kbps (in VS11+), do I not have enough ?

Always burn Lower Field First - thought that was correct for miniDV. Tried Upper once , just in case, but no joy.

If my new Panasonic camcorder records in MPEG4, I can't find that anywhere in the manual - says miniDV everywhere. If that is the case though, what should I do ?

Black Lab · Post by **Black Lab** » Mon Mar 01, 2010 6:47 pm

And how are you getting the footage from the cam to your computer?

RICO · Post by **RICO** » Tue Mar 02, 2010 8:55 am

Black Lab wrote:And how are you getting the footage from the cam to your computer?

Firewire

Black Lab · Post by **Black Lab** » Tue Mar 02, 2010 2:20 pm

And when you say "And when trying to burn in VS11+ my project settings are:" where are you getting these settings from?

RICO · Post by **RICO** » Tue Mar 02, 2010 5:09 pm

Black Lab wrote:And when you say "And when trying to burn in VS11+ my project settings are:" where are you getting these settings from?

On the final screen of the 'share' process, I click the cogwheel on bottom left for settings (or preferences - sorry can't remember exact wording without going back to look). All that information I've supplied you comes up automatically. It does give option to "Change MPEG settings" but all looks OK as is.

Black Lab · Post by **Black Lab** » Tue Mar 02, 2010 5:46 pm

Well, to be honest I have no idea. All your properties seem good and it looks like you are doing everything appropriately.

But one last question about your process. Are you going from the project in the timeline straight to Share>Create Disc? If so, try this other procedure: When your project is finished go to Share>Create Video File and make a DVD-compliant MPEG2 file. After that is created, watch it and see how it looks. If it looks ok, empty your timeline, then go to Share>Create Disc. Use Insert Media to add your MPEG2 to the burning timeline and burn your disc.

RICO · Post by **RICO** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 9:06 am

Black Lab wrote:Well, to be honest I have no idea. All your properties seem good and it looks like you are doing everything appropriately.

But one last question about your process. Are you going from the project in the timeline straight to Share>Create Disc? If so, try this other procedure: When your project is finished go to Share>Create Video File and make a DVD-compliant MPEG2 file. After that is created, watch it and see how it looks. If it looks ok, empty your timeline, then go to Share>Create Disc. Use Insert Media to add your MPEG2 to the burning timeline and burn your disc.

I was trying to create the disc straight away but tried your suggestion. I made the MPEG-2 file but, when viewing in the preview pane, noticed that blasted blockiness again. Therefore, I can only assume there is an issue with compression from avi. files to MPEG files before I even attempt to burn it. Any further ideas from anyone ?

skier-hughes · Post by **skier-hughes** » Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:53 am

Save out as a dv.avi file, take into another programme to do the mpeg conversion and test what that file looks like on your pc.
Remember to choose exactly the same settings as VS uses in its conversion.

How long is this movie?
How large is your mpeg file once made?

RICO · Post by **RICO** » Thu Mar 18, 2010 1:29 pm

Thought I'd update everyone on the progress of this issue. After many attempts to sort it, I bit the bullet and bought VS Pro X2 Ultimate. Installed it at the weekend and, even though I've had the same few problems as many others who've reviewed this software (trouble installing, erratic crashing, program hanging, slow render process) it's now on my machine. Tried my project and it has WORKED FIRST TIME

. No blockiness or jerky playback after rendering. Oh what relief.

Thanks to all that tried to help but I can find no other reason why this should work, only that it harks back to issues I mentioned in my first post with regards to stills projects. The older versions of VS are problematic with newer recording hardware - period.

Thanks again.