Jerky Playback M2T files

[LEEPETER]

Hi

First of all I have searched the forum, believe Me I have searched til I am blue in the face( not a pretty sight)

I have a Panasonic SD1, which records m2t files.

I have a Core2 duo motherboard, E5200, 2.5, with 2meg of ram.

Running Win XP, SP3

Imports video files ok, shows as PAL 720 x 576, in the project.

After editing will output full size to Blu-Ray.

BUT, even after doing the tweaks in the VS manual, DMA etc.

Playback is still jerky.

I dont want to give up on the program, but I have had at least 3 months of this, nothing seems to work.

It has the potential to be the program I need/like, but its "doing My head in"

I am not the most patient of people, just ask the wife, but its getting a bit much.

Sorry to sound a complainer.


Regards.


Peter.

[Ken Berry]

First, can you confirm that you are capturing via Firewire, and that you do not have the camcorder set to downconvert the HDV original to standard definition DV/AVI on capture.

In a sense the project properties you cite -- which are most likely the default settings for the program, rather than for your video -- can be misleading. In effect, it is difficult to get VS to reflect project properties of HDV video (1440 x 1080, Upper Field First, 25 fps, mpeg layer 2 audio), so I simply ignore them. But my question about your capture format is relevant since those project properties you cite could in fact reflect a standard definition download from your high def camera...

If in fact you did download in high def format, the other thing you need to look out for when rendering is that you maintain the Upper Field First field order. I have noted that VS seems to change this to Lower Field First by default, and this could account for the jerkiness of your output.

Can you describe your workflow in more detail, please? Personally, with my own HDV, I do my edits then output in the original transport stream mpeg-2 (m2t) from the camera. I do this by cheating a little on one of the useful functions of VS, namely, in the Share Screen, by exporting back to the camera ("HDV Recording"). You don't even have to have your camera connected to use it. You simply select it and let it do its thing. It will eventually ask you to connect your camera, but you can simply stop the program there as the new file has already been created by that stage.

It amounts to a full render of your project i.e. SmartRender does not work. But you are maintaintaing your original high quality HDV settings, and I have never noticed any degradation (even though it must be there by the very nature of mpeg-2).

I don't have a Blu-Ray burner, so am not burning to Blu-Ray disc. But I can do a number of things with the new .m2t file I produce this way. I can convert it to a hybrid AVCHD disc on a standard DVD, which emulates a Blu-Ray structure. The quality is excellent if you set the AVCHD settings high. Or I can actually export to camcorder and connect the latter via HDMI direct to my HDTV. Or nowadays I either put the new video on a USB memory stick and put that into my Sony PlayStation 3 which is a great Blu-Ray player that is connected via HDMI to my HDTV. Or finally, I can simply stream the new video from my computer, which I have networked with the PS3.

Or, in your own case, you could use the new .m2t to burn to Blu-Ray!!
If you do this, let us know the result.

I find that doing it this way avoids any of the default pitfalls built into VS. By exporting to a transport stream .m2t, it can only use one set of properties and there is thus no chance for error.

[LEEPETER]

Hi

Files are recorded on SD card, I used to copy them using Panasonics HD writer that came with the camcorder, to the hard drive.

Now I just navigate to the m2t files & copy them to a folder on the "Video" hard drive, import from there into VS 12.

Never thought about upper/lower fields etc, I used to use DV tape & never had to bother changing for editing in premiere 6.5.

Its an whole new way of doing things for Me.

Regards.

Peter.

[Ken Berry]

Sorry, but I focused more on the extension you gave than the camera model. However, .m2t files are definitely HDV files (high def mpeg-2 filmed on a mini DV tape). Your camera in fact films in AVCHD (high def mpeg-4) format and the extension for that is .m2ts, not .m2t...

AVCHD is far more demanding of computer resources, though yours would appear to have sufficient resources for the job. I would note, however, that even more computer resources are required to play AVCHD smoothly than to edit it. So when playing and editing it, I would limit as far as possible any other functions the computer might be performing.

Apart from that, however, my other comments continue to apply -- particularly with regard to ensuring that your field order remains Upper Field First throughout...

[Frank Burch]

"But I can do a number of things with the new .m2t file I produce this way."

I have some trouble with the m2t file. After editing I make a file "same as". But perhaps this is superfluous? Strangely, even though it's "same as" it takes a long time to "render" (why does it have to be rendered?). Then "Share" and "HDV recording". Here again rendering takes a long time. Then, recently, I got a message "camcorder not on". So I clicked "OK". The file disappeared. When I tried to put it back on VS I got a message "This file cannot be edited". I started getting hot under the collar: Damm you I don't want to edit! But if you click on OK the file disappears. Finally I realized you have to be on "Share", then you can get the file back, but a message comes up "Do you want to render this file so that it can be edited?" You have to click OK even if you only want to record back to the camera.

[Ken Berry]

Unless you are using SmartRender, a full render takes place, regardless of 'same as' and regardless of how many or how few edits you made. And a full render always means a lot of time, and much longer than standard definition renders.

After HDV recording, the file is in fact saved in whatever folder you designated, and if you did not designate one, then in the Corel default working folder.

And the reason it goes through all that business of 'parsing' (as opposed to rendering) the file all over again is that you have output a transport stream version of the file, and VS cannot deal directly with transport stream. It can output in that format, yes, but it cannot edit in it. So, your camera films in transport stream but during the capture process, it is automatically converted to program stream for editing, which VS can of course deal with. But on export to camera, it is converted back to transport stream. So if you want to open and edit that file, it has to be parsed again and converted back to program stream!

[Frank Burch]

Yes, thanks Kenn, that's clear. So I suppose there is no need to make a 'same as' file unless you want to make a DVD.
Incidently, since you are a site administrator, I was originally registered as Gisela Richter, but after making a chance on my profile I was unable to log in again, so I had to re-register, this time in my real name. 'Gisela Richter' should be deleted, but I suppose it does not matter.

[Ken Berry]

Yes, that is so about 'same as...'

And regarding 'Gisela', I could perhaps have reactivated it, but as you say, it does not really matter... I confess I *had* been wondering about the 'Wombat' signature which I recalled as being 'Gisela's'...!

[LEEPETER]

Hi

Worked out a solution, first converted m2ts files on hard drive to MPEG2-HD,

Found I couldn't import the audio, "file mismatch"

Imported the original audio to the music track, fine.

Result, very tiny amounts of jerkiness, hardly noticeable.

A lot easier to edit.

Had a problem with Blue-Ray drive, turned out to be a SATA cable fault.

Just burnt disc of a 7 minute project as a test.

Plays fine in My Blu-Ray player, HDMI to a 42 inch Toshiba, well pleased.

The real test will be when the Critic (Wife) watches it.

Adds to the total time but worth the effort IMO.

Converted files thru Procoder 3, batch.

Regards.


Peter.

[Frank Burch]

I don't know much about AVCHD except that I will avoid it as long as possible. But if I had your problem I would be looking at some other editing software. For non-professionals the most reputed seem to be Adobe Premier Elements and the German programme Magix Video Deluxe which comes in 3 versions from basic to premium pro with more bells and whistles than the Rio canaval.
In fact the first thing I say to anyone who buys a camcorder is "why on earth did you get a AVCHD version? But it is true that HDV seems to be on the way out, probably because AVCHD cameras are cheaper to produce?

[LEEPETER]

I wanted the camcorder ever since it came out, but was unaware as I

suspect a lot of people were, about the implications of AVCHD.

Another problem is I have Premiere Elements 8, and it has the same

trouble as VS.

I am thinking the next step is increasing the RAM to 4 gigs.

I have bought another Motherboard, to go with My RT.X100, this capture

card is no longer being "supported" with new validated motherboards, but

I have been looking at its forums waiting to see what other people are

using with success, and have found a new board, that is highly

recommended to work.

I think its likely, when its built that I will transfer everything video related

to the new "Editing" machine with Quad core.

I have always had a seperate system, but I built this comp after a

motherboard failure, then got the camcorder, thinking "modern" machine,

it will work.

Sorry for the ramble.


Regards.


Peter.

[Van Rouge]

I have experienced all these problems and have now settled on the Magix program for editing and VS for creating bluray discs from the rendered Mpeg 2 movies.

Once I found all the correct setting to use the resulant bluray plays as good as the direct camera to TV quality. It make my previous DV videos look out of focus!

I find the Panasonic SD9 camera great, it uses a small battery which lasts over two hours per charge and saves the flim on an SD card which reads straight into the computer.

[Frank Burch]

Which Magix programme are you using? Can you give us any comments on it?

[Black Lab]

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Thanks.

[Van Rouge]

My Apologies. It is just so frustrating that VS has these problems

Ray Morris