AVCHD Slide show

[Henny]

Hi Mitchell,

Same format as AVCHD which is a hybrid.

This is the BD5 or BD9 route? The same as AVCHD? What about bitrate and playing time?

To burn that type of disc I presume I need nero 9?


Thanks

[Ken Berry]

It was definitely me -- Steve AFAIK is still not into high definition video work... And the reason I advanced at the time is, I think, still valid: namely that an AVCHD hybrid disc is already quite a concession. One is supposed to burn an actual Blu-Ray disc, which gives you more options (and of course much more space). But a workable halfway house is the hybrid disc. Moreover, VS will give you a menu for it too -- which some other packages, which can burn hybrid discs, will not do. However, it will not do a motion menu. And it is rather pushing it to think it will give you the option to prepare an "AVCHD folder" (which in reality only really exists as a full Blu-Ray folder), much less an image file...

You will also note that I have been careful never to say that the hybrid disc uses a full Blu-Ray structure -- only that it is a Blu-Ray "like" or "type" structure, which it is...

[mitchell65]

Thank you Ken. I did do a search to try to find your original post but without success. I have used the Create BluRay Disc then create folders and it works fine. Of course, you need to watch the file size but it is a compromise after all. I use ordinary DVD-R discs.

To burn that type of disc I presume I need nero 9?

No any software that will burn a data DVD will/should work! It will produce a full BluRAy folder structure within the BDMV folder. Just select the Folder BDMV and burn that as data to a DVD disc. You do of course need a BlyRay player to play it but you can open the BDMV folder on your PC, than go to the Stream Folder and in there you will see the M2ts files. These will play in you PC player or they do in WinDVD9 and AVS Media Player and Windows Media Player. This is where you can check your video before burning to a DVD. This method burns to a disc very quickly as there is no rendering it is a straight data transfer.

[Ken Berry]

John -- this is is an 'old dogs, new tricks' post -- just to say thank you for the hint about using the Blu-Ray folder route. I had never tried that before, sticking mainly to AVCHD hybrid discs. I have to say that generally speaking, the latter have returned some excellent results in terms of quality, but of course you never know until you have actually burned the disc since that is the only option it has.

But in the past couple of days I have been grappling with a problem over a particular project, and tried to produce an acceptable output no less than 10 different ways -- well, that was the number of efforts I made to produce an acceptable file -- three of the ways repeated twice, just in case! All efforts failed. (I had tried converting it to an AVCHD file, but the result was awful, as it usually is. I hadn't tried the AVCHD hybrid disc route -- which usually is pretty good -- as I was out of DVD blanks this weekend and could not be bothered going out shopping. It has been in the high 30s here so instead of keeping away from floods, we are huddling inside air conditioned houses to keep away from the heat!! And for our American cousins, the high 30s are over 100 degrees fahrenheit...)

But I just tried the Blu-Ray folder route and got a perfect STREAM file which I can use as my final video, and use it the various ways I do -- including streaming it direct from computer to HDTV via my Sony PlayStation 3. Worked beautifully -- even if I have now watched this same wretched video some 15 or 16 times, let alone during the editing!! But such a joy, as always, to see it turn out the way it should!!!

The very slightest downside is that the end file is about 25% larger than a HDV file would have been (the project was originally HDV -- and that HDV end file would have been 1.31 GB whereas the Blu-Ray HDMV file is 1.76 GB) and twice the size of the AVCHD file (852 MB). But I suspect I could reduce that by using Dolby audio instead of the LPCM which seems to be the default.

I also remain a bit mystified by the fact that though I thought I had reset the burn properties to Upper Field First to match my HDV, the resulting file is LFF. However, the project involves a fair amount of panning and camera movement, yet it is perfect! Not the slightest flicker of wrong field order. So I am not quite sure what is going on in that respect.

But again, from one old dog to another, thank you!!

[mitchell65]

Well I am feeling good today! But I have to be honest. This BluRay route is NOT my original idea. I picked it up from a post on this Forum a little while ago but I cannot find it now. I remember Steve said he would move it to a "Tips" section so if you read this Steve could you point me in the right direction so that due credit can go to the originator. Not that I mind a little "Reflected glory". Makes an "old codger" feel good

[mitchell65]

Not the slightest flicker of wrong field order. So I am not quite sure what is going on in that respect.

I thought I read somewhere that field order on a full BlyRay file made little difference!

[erdna]

I reported this upper/lower story a copple ofmonths ago (june 10). I tested this quite intensively also using electronic testpatterns. Nobody ever confirmed my results, but I am happy with my AVCHD video's, and my belief that VS12 is selecting the field order when it has to process interframe video codecs (HDV, AVCHD, Blu-rAY...). I did not check what happens with DV (intraframe) which could potentially also provide the field order from the Video Info Header

[mitchell65]

Thanks for that erdna but did you come to a conclusion as to whether with BluRay it makes any difference if it is UFF or LFF?

[erdna]

I cannot report on this. I don't have a blu-ray burner, and I don't feel it's reliable to verify the BDMV m2ts file on a PC SW player. I like to see the results on my TV and stand alone BD player, with different settings (1080i, 1080p, freeze mode...)

[mitchell65]

I also remain a bit mystified by the fact that though I thought I had reset the burn properties to Upper Field First to match my HDV, the resulting file is LFF.

I have just checked one of my "Stream" files (MTS) and that held the UFF that I set it to. My original clip was UFF. I set the burn to 1440 x 1080 as I read somewhere that this was the standard but my camera saves to 1920 x 1080. I might try that later to see if it works on my NEW BLU-RAY PLAYER THAT WILL ARRIVE TOMORROW ( I hope)

[Henny]

NEW BLU-RAY PLAYER THAT WILL ARRIVE TOMORROW

Mitchell, I hope it does and if so, enjoy it!

I am happy too, because my problem is solved.
Remember the link I included in a post on Saterday 21 about the different folder structure of BD and AVCHD discs? It pointed in the right direction.
I burned the AVCHD disc on a RW disc (so I can re-use it) and copied the folders to my Hard Disk. (needed first to patch my XP explorer in order to view UDF 2.5 files). Then deleted the AUXDATA folder, and with ImgBurn burned the BDMV folderset to a DVD. And see what? It played nicely.
Conclusion: VS X2 leaves the AUXDATA folder included, but formally this is not correct. Some BD players are more forgiving than others. The Samsung BD-P1500 apparently sticks to the formal specification and in such a case does not see the disc as an AVCHD hybrid.
Many thanks to all of you for your stimulating contributions!

[Henny]

Just a few additional things.
The original topic was about slideshows. For video I'll stick to SD, since I am quite happy with the quality of my Panasonic 3CCD GS 400.
But for slideshows what settings would be best? Should I work frame based, or select UFF during the compression phase? Anything else I have to pay attention to?

Just select the Folder BDMV and burn that as data to a DVD disc.

So, Mitchell65, not the 'CERTIFICATE' folder?
Thanks.

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi Henny

I have the same camera and get excellent video results.
For slide shows I use the same workflow as for the video¡¦s using the same settings.
Results are again excellent.
Rendering to DV-Avi then to Mpeg2 DVD seems to produce better results, rather than directly to Mpeg 2.

Working in widescreen my images are 2048 x 1152 having been edited in Photoshop.
This is 16:9 ratio and fills the screen.

What is the size of your images?

I have started using Frame Based where my shows are purely images (No Video)

Having installed X2 I will be testing the HD slide show options, but as I say I had very good results with SD and Mpeg2 DVD.

[mitchell65]

So, Mitchell65, not the 'CERTIFICATE' folder?

No it is empty anyway!
And Trevor is quite right. Frame Based for image only slideshows. The image sizes that Trevor gives are fine but you might want to read this thread by Steve Jones:
http://forum.corel.com/EN/viewtopic.php?p=119526#119526

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi John

The standard frame size for widescreen Pal is 1024 x 576px (square pixels)
The standard size for 4:3 Pal is 768 x 576 (square pixels)

I use 2048 x 1152 being double the size. (widescreen)
This allows for Pan & Zoom maintaining quality.

Basically you can use any size you like, The minimum being the frame size.

If you keep your images to the ratio 16:9 then the image will fill the frame. No borders.
Same goes for normal video, 4:3.....

When we look at NTSC, the frame sizes are different, but using images of 16:9 or 4:3 ratio will fill the screen.

High Definition hasn¡¦t changed anything regarding still images, we just use larger images, but that¡¦s what the newer cameras produce, larger images.