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Once my VSP project was done, I did ¡§Share/ Create file¡¨ as instructed in the Workflow to produce a compliant MPEG file. It took about 14 hours to render.

I then added the MPEG file at the ¡§Share/Create disc¡¨ step, added a simple menu (2Mb) and, at the ¡§burn dialog box¡¨, I checked the ¡§Create disc¡¨ and the ¡§Normalize audio¡¨ boxes.

Why did it re-render the entire MPEG file if already compliant ? It took another 14 hour to re-render even if the box ¡§Do not convert compliant MPEG files¡¨ is checked in ¡§Project Settings¡¨ screen)

Is it caused by the ¡§Normalize Audio¡¨ request? (as you suggest in your workflow , we should avoid re-rendering)

Is there another way to proceed to get a ¡§normalized audio MPEG file¡¨ before getting to the burn stage ?

Thanks?

Without knowing what your video files properties are, it is difficult to say why it took so long. It could be that your PC is not powerful enough, the video files in your project are highly compressed, you may be working with AVCHD video files, and a dozen other possibilities. However if your project is only 1 or 2 hours long, and using a standard definition like DV, it should not take 14 hours.

Since you had the boxed checked Do Not Convert MPEG compliant, and VS still rendered it, there is something in your video file or project that video studio seen as not being compliant. This could be the frame size, frame rate, as well as the audio.

I did ¡§Share/ Create file¡¨ as instructed in the Workflow to produce a compliant MPEG file.

Can you please right click on this MPEG file inside Video Studio (either in the timeline or in the library window) and copy ALL its properties here please. They we might be able to see what we are dealing with...

Thanks for your quick response to my query !

Yes it is a AVCHD file that I play on my Sony PS3 (my first copy directly burned from the VSP to a DL disc with Normalize, worked fine on my PS3).

Here I did a MPEG file to do future multiple copies of the video but ended up with VSX2 re-rendering it again, thus my query about if the fact that I checked the "Normalize Audio" box at the burn screen was the culprit.

Here are the properties: (by the way, I tried to copy properties here but don't know how, so this is a retype of the data):

NTSC HDMV
8 234 952 KB
5797.931 seconds
H.264 video, upper field first
173 764 frames
24 bits, 1920 x 1080, 16-9
29.970 frames/sec
VBR (max 17999 kbps)
Dolby Digital audio
278 300 701 samples
48000 hz
layer : none
bit rate 384 kbps

Thanks!

At the Share > Create Video File stage, what did you actually choose in the drop-down menu which appeared?

Ken,
I selected Share/Create Video file/AVCHD/NTSC - HD 1920 .

My understanding is that it should yield a 1920x1080p size in an MPEG file format that can be burned on a DVD 4.7Gb or 8.5Gb DL and that can be read only by a bluray player that can decode an AVCHD format (like Sony PS3 in my case). Right ?

The resulting video file should be a DVD compliant MPEG file but without "Normalized Audio". The only place where I can ask the VSX2 program to "Normalize the audio" is at the burn dialog box. Right ?

Thanks !

First, to correct a misapprehension, the resulting file is NOT DVD compliant. It is AVCHD, and burning it to a DVD does NOT produce a DVD -- it produces an AVCHD hybrid disc, which is quite a different beast. Just look at the file and folder structure on the burned disc, and compare it to a video DVD, and you will quickly see that. (NOTE: In saying this I am assuming that for the burning process, you chose Share > Create Video File > AVCHD, and not DVD. If you chose the latter, then VS would be down-converting your project to standard definition, and that would probably account for the long rendering time. Can you confirm what you chose as the burning option, please.)

That being said, the properties you gave above are those produced by using that Share > Create Video File > AVCHD option. But what were the properties of the AVCHD before you started editing it? There are many AVCHD cameras out there, and many of them use quite different bitrates -- some as low as 12 Mbps; others with a max. 16 Mbps; others around 18 Mbps; and now, some new models up to 24 Mbps. The video file you produced is 17.999 Mbps (i.e. 18 Mbps), but if your original video used a different bitrate, that would account for why it is completely re-rendered.

As for the time it is taking, if your project is around 96 minutes, as it appears to be, that is far too much to fit on even a dual-layer DVD and preserve any sort of decent high definition quality. I use those properties you gave for my own AVCHD hybrid discs (though using PAL), and I find that they produce an excellent quality disc, but with only 20 minutes fitting on a single layer DVD. In other words, using that bitrate but burning to a dual layer DVD, you should only be able to fit about 40 or 41 minutes of video on it.

So another possibility for why the burning process is taking so long is that VS is trying to squeeze your properties down to the point where it will fit on the disc. And AVCHD is always slow to render -- I find that it will normally take up to 4 times real time using my Quad 6600. Now, looking at your computer specs, I would have to say that it is simply not up to the job of dealing with AVCHD -- either editing it, nor playing it back smoothly. AVCHD is the most demanding format currently on the market, and you require at the very least a decent Intel Core 2 Duo (or AMD equivalent) to handle AVCHD properly. In other words, I believe your computer is probably struggling mightily, and the rendering time is a further reflection of this.

I might also note that while I endorse that workflow for standard definition DVD production, I ignore it for AVCHD discs. In other words, I do my editing, then jump immediately to the burning module (Share > Create Disc > AVCHD). In other words, I do not convert the project first to a file. I have not had a failure yet doing it this way but I guess it may not work for everyone.

Now the nub of your question is about normalising audio, but I confess that is something that I never do, and never see the need for it as I carefully modulate the original audio and any added background music and voice-overs during the editing process. Why do you feel you need to normalise audio in your own case?

(I am unable to comment on normalising the audio elsewhere as I have always understood it to be a part of the burning process... So hopefully someone else with more information might jump in here...)

The most powerful method of "Normalizing" audio is to export the entire audio track as a WAV file. Open the WAV file with an audio editor - a very powerful and FREE audio editor is Audacity
Normalize the Audio and save it as a new WAV file.
Open Video Studio and split the audio track.
Delete the Audio track which has now been split.
Import the new normalized track you created in Audacity.

Ken,
these are great comments and learning for me. One learning is that estimating the disc capacity required is not as obvious as I thought. Also I am new to posting so another learning is for me to be more precise in my initial post to help you nail-down the issue.

To answer your questions, yes I did chose Share > Create Video File > AVCHD, and not DVD. I should have mentioned that I don¡¦t have any HD or AVCHD camcorder or camera. My videos are usually about vacation trips and were made in the past mainly of photos with few brief videos of DVD quality 640 x 480 inserted.

This project is about my recent photo safari trip in Africa and is a collation of many high resolution photos (to retain HD quality even with Pan & Zoom) and a lot of 640 x 480 videos from two different digital cameras (my son¡¦s and mine).

My project properties are therefore the usual NTSC 720 x 480 16:9 throughout the EDIT phase and editing went well. Now with VSProX2 features, I decided to produce both a DVD burn (to show my video at friend¡¦s places that don¡¦t have a Bluray player) and an AVCHD burn for my Sony PS3+Plasma.

Also I was historically using ¡§Normalize Audio¡¨ to even out differing volume levels from multiple sources like videos from different cameras, music from CDs and internet, and audio mixes made during editing, and therefore avoid adjusting level frequently on remote control during playback ; I will give it a try manually.

My son is currently upgrading his computer to ¡§bleeding edge¡¨ technology and I will inherit his Core 2 Duo, so that should help considering your suggestions re. AVCHD rendering. Thanks !

Some more questions to help clarify further:

(1) to produce full AVCHD quality , can I use as a rule of thumb that I should instead break my project into 2-3 projects that will each fit on 20-40 minutes disc depending on media used (single or dual layer) ?

(2) I guess I have no other choice than staying with the same project properties since I have no AVCHD input material in my project ? Right ?

(3) Does VS produce 1080 p (or i only); how can I know it is 1080p as VS mentions only 1920 x 1080 ?

(4) can VS produce AVCHD at 720p to avoid up-conversion to 1080, then down-conversion by my PS3 or Plasma to its native 720p (768) ?

(5) each ¡§rendered+DVD authored¡¨ video should not exceed 4.38 Gb to fit on a 4.7Gb single layer disc (as reflected by the two numbers of the required disc capacity bar at the SHARE step, the latter number being in brackets) and 7.96 GB to fit on a 8.5 GB dual layer ?

Once again a big thank you. I am really impressed with the quality and professionalism of the Forum !

Steve,
many thanks for the hint and the link to Audacity ! ( I have Nero Wave Editor: is it similar or is Audacity better from your experience ?)!

Could you give me more details (baby steps) on how to export the entire audio track as a WAV file in VS ? I did extract video on a couple of clips during editing but how do you do it on an entire VSP project that includes music , voice...etc ?

Is it thru the SHARE/ Create sound file feature ? If so , how do you re-insert the new normalized sound file afterwards to produce a DVD authored disc ? ...and what about if I want to produce an AVCHD disc ? Same process ?

Thanks !

Yes, Share>Create Sound File will create a WAV file that you import into Audacity or Nero Wave Editor to make your adjustments. Save it as a WAV file.

Then back in VS go to the Audio tab and click on the folder icon to insert that WAV file into your library.

I am not sure I can answer all your questions, but here goes:

Some more questions to help clarify further:

(1) to produce full AVCHD quality , can I use as a rule of thumb that I should instead break my project into 2-3 projects that will each fit on 20-40 minutes disc depending on media used (single or dual layer) ?

To obtain full AVCHD quality, I would make the obvious comment that you need AVCHD or HDV input, which you don't have. The old saying about making silk purses from sows' ears applies to video editing. Regardless of the format, you will never get better quality video than that of the original format. In your case, your still photos might be high quality and would translate well into high definition video. But your original video, while probably good quality on your computer, are in fact NOT DVD quality because they do not conform to the international DVD standard, which requires video to have a frame size of 720 (or 704) x 480 for NTSC or proportional fractions thereof. So 640 x 480 is outside that definition. At best, on conversion to AVCHD, you will be getting standard definition video upscaled to AVCHD, but I would not personally be expecting all that much of the end result.

That being said, if your son does get a high def camera, and you continue to produce AVCHD hybrid discs, and want the highest qualiyt, then yes, you would need to split any longer projects into chunks that will fit on single and dual layer DVDs at the highest quality bitrate setting -- so roughly 20 minutes for a single later DVD, and roughly twice that for a dual layer disc.

But if you have a PS3, why not do as I now do and simply buy a network cable of suitable length (I use 25 metres) to connect the PS3 (which sits under my HDTV in the lounge room) to my computer in my home office. Using Nero Media Home or WMP as a server, I can play edited video of whatever length direct from the computer to the HDTV via the PS3 i.e. no need even to burn to a hybrid disc, and no length restrictions.

(2) I guess I have no other choice than staying with the same project properties since I have no AVCHD input material in my project ? Right ?

Right. And as I say, it does not matter anyway. Editing with a particular set of project properties does not do anything to the video itself until you get to the rendering stage. And for the newbies, it is simplicity itself to simply choose Share > Create Video File > Same as Project Properties. But if you want a different format, you simply choose that format at the Share > Create Video File stage, and that is where the new properties are applied, not before.

(3) Does VS produce 1080 p (or i only); how can I know it is 1080p as VS mentions only 1920 x 1080 ?

VS can produce 1280 x 720p, but I don't think it can produce 1920 x 1080p, only i. However, I am not absolutely certainly of the latter. I have never tried and am only going on another thread or two here which suggests that the latter is not possible with VS. In any case, my 1920 x 1080i hybrid discs and networked AVCHD looks pretty fabulous on my 1920 x 1080p HDTV. While I am prepared to accept there might be an even better look if the input were also 1080p, I am not sure my eyes would be up to readily picking the difference...

(4) can VS produce AVCHD at 720p to avoid up-conversion to 1080, then down-conversion by my PS3 or Plasma to its native 720p (768) ?

I don't think so -- am currently in China and don't have VS on my current computer, so I can't check. But from memory, I don't recall a 720p option in AVCHD settings... Hopefully, though, someone will jump in here if I am wrong...

(5) each ¡§rendered+DVD authored¡¨ video should not exceed 4.38 Gb to fit on a 4.7Gb single layer disc (as reflected by the two numbers of the required disc capacity bar at the SHARE step, the latter number being in brackets) and 7.96 GB to fit on a 8.5 GB dual layer ?

As Steve explained a couple of days ago, a 4.7GB disc *is* a 4.3 GB disc. It all depends on how you count the bits and bytes!! So yes, if burning to a DVD, the input video, whether standard definition or high definition, cannot in the end result exceed 4.3 GB -- unless you use a program like Nero Recode or DVD Shrink which will reduce a project size to fit within that limit (and do a good job of it too)...

Thank you Ken !
Got it ! With your comments I am starting to piece it all together now !

Ken,
I like your suggestion to get my PS3 in my network and have a full copy of an AVCHD version of my final video on it instead of multiple discs burned.

I got my PS3 hooked up on my network but how can you make a readable AVCHD file with VSProX2 , that is, one AVCHD file that includes DVD menus + DVD authoring ?

I tried ¡§Create file ¡V AVCHD¡¨ and the resulting MPEG file does not obviously include the DVD authoring step. I tried ¡§Create disc-AVCHD¡¨ and though it includes the DVD authoring step, the ¡§Create image file¡¨ and ¡§Create AVCHD folders¡¨ are both greyed out at the burn dialog box.

How do you produce a PS3 readable AVCHD file with VSProX2 without burning a disc ? (By the way , I did post a similar question on May 17th but did not get any reply posted yet)

Thanks again !

Unfortunately, I don't think you can produce the equivalent of an AVCHD/Blu-Ray disc image or folder which is readable by anything. It is undoubtedly on the horizon, and probably being worked on as we speak. But as far as I am aware, it is not yet available. But if anyone has better information than this, I too would love to learn about it...!

So using the PS3 network option, you have to content yourself with just playing the edited AVCHD files individually chosen from the list of video files presented by the PS3 Video option. I don't find this a major inconvenience, though acknowledge that that may just be me...