Different behaviour of sound during transitions

[dani75]

Hello

I just noticed a strange behaviour of VS 11.5 on transitions , and I would like to share my experience on this forum.

I inserted 2 video clips on the timeline, the second of which having a soundtrack starting immediately with somebody saying some words. I then added a transition between the clips.
While playing the project in playback mode, I could hear:
1) the sound of clip1 until the beginning of the video transition
2) the sound of clip2, beginning with the said words, starting at the beginning of the video transition

Then I created a DVD with the "Share" step, and I was surprised that, either playing the DVD or playing the project through the navigation panel of the "create/edit chapter" function showed a different behaviour :
the beginning of the sound of clip2 was not recorded, and the expected words were truncated !

After investigation and test, I was able to demonstrate that, in all options of the "Share" step (create DVD, or video file, or project playback):
1) the sound of clip1 is heard until the end of the video transition
2) the sound of clip2 is truncated during the transition and is heard starting from the end of the video transition

In other words : for all steps except "Share", the sound heard during any transition is the one of the clip before the transition ; for "Share", the sound heard during the transition is the one of the clip after the transition. This is really confusing when trying to achieve a perfect smooth transition of both the video and the sound !

However I found an easy workaround :
using the "Split audio" option of the "Edit" step on clip2 forces the complete audio track of clip2 to be present even during the transition in all steps of VS during playback of the project.

Hope that this will be helpfull to anybody.

[Black Lab]

As you have discovered, VS is not a great audio editor.

[Ken Berry]

If you go into Audio view, you will see you can normally adjust the cross over at the transition point where not only the video but the audio overlaps. You can leave the first clip with its fade out (black line going down to zero, or even adjust that earlier. But you can ensure the start of the audio of the second clip is left horizontal. That way, the audio in the first clip would fade out whenever you wanted, but the audio in the second would actually start during the transition as you wish.

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi
Not sure if this will work but its worth having a go.
Disable smart render.

From Share--Create Video File¡Xselect a template
Under the Options button---- un-check Smart Render.

[dani75]

Thanks all for your answers.
To Black Lab: I consider it is a pity that VS offers all the sound functions we unprofessionnal people need, but they do not function correctly.
To Ken Berry: perhaps did you try what you suggest on a more recent version than mine ? On my VS11.5, when going in the Audio view, all crossover points are already horizontal and positioned to "high" (level 0.0), because I did not use of the fade-in/fade-out on my clips. Now, if I create manually a fade-out for the clip1 (it is difficult because it has to be created out of the transition area, and then dragged into it) I can reproduce in the Edit step the same behaviour of the audio of clip1 as in the Share step (e.g. endind as the transition starts), but the sound of clip 2 is still truncated !
To Trevor Andrew: your solution has no effect at all.
Conclusion:I think that the VS software should be better tested, an then a lot of end-user problems should be avoided. Currently VS is not a "WYHIWHG" software (What You Hear Is What You Get, which is an audio equivalent to the well known WYSIWYG concept - (What You See Is What You Get). I suspect some "sound" problems reported on this forum could be related to what I just discovered (I found an old topic posted by jparnold in 2008 about stuttering sound on a DVD during a transition). Perhaps it is worth to inform Corel about this problem?
Yours

[rpungin]

I have experienced very annoying sound problems related to transitions in VideoStudio 12 Pro.

When I put two clips on the timeline and overlay the end of the first with the beginning of the second, a transition effect is automatically inserted. Also the sound fade out of the first clip and fade in of the second clip is automatically introduced. The transition sounds perfect in preview mode. But when the movie is rendered (share->create video file), the sound of the second clip just pops up at the end of the transition instead of fading in.

This is clearly a bug in version 12. I did not have this issue in 11 or 11.5. I'll try to figure out how to contact Corel to fix this...

[Black Lab]

Have you tried manually adjusting the sound at the transition?

[jparnold]

I have found that when you apply transitions between clips it is best to fade OUT the sound from the first clip and fade IN the sound from the second clip.
I have noticed that if you don't the sound level INCREASES briefly during the (video) transition probably because you get the volume from the sound from the first clip PLUS the full volume from the sound from the second clip during the transition. Maybe if you apply normalise volume during rendering this may not be a problem - I have never tried that.

[dani75]

rpungin, I suspect that you experienced the problem I described hereabove a couple of monthes ago.
May I suggest you to try the workaround that worked in my case:
- first, using the "Split audio" option of the "Edit" step on clip2, you force the complete audio track of clip2 to be present starting from the beginning of the transition either in preview mode or when rendering the project.
- second, you adjust the fade-in for clip 2.
I hope this will work in your case (I can't try it, because I'm using VS11.5).

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi
Version 8 had a similar problem a long time ago, a fix was provided by Ulead.

I don¡¦t use X2 but a few suggestions.

Have you tried using a different transition.

Is it possible to disable the auto transition / fade insertion.
Then apply manually.

From preferences, have you set the audio fade default duration.
I usually set the transition duration and audio as the same.

Theres two posts going on here, are we saying that both VS 11 and X2 have a similar problem.??

[rpungin]

Have you tried manually adjusting the sound at the transition?

Yes I have tried to manually set the fade in the Audio view, but still the audio of the second clip comes in abruptly at the end of the transition. Again this only happens in the rendered file, not during playback of the project.

Even if your suggestion works, it still would be a pain to adjust the fade manually for each transition. There is clearly some sort of bug in rendering code because the sound is perfect during project playback.

I have found that when you apply transitions between clips it is best to fade OUT the sound from the first clip and fade IN the sound from the second clip.

This is precisely what I am trying to do. In fact VS version 12 automatically creates the fade out of the first clip and fade in of the second. The only problem is that there is a bug where in the rendered video the sound fade is broken. This is why I am posting about this in the forum.

rpungin, I suspect that you experienced the problem I described hereabove a couple of monthes ago.
May I suggest you to try the workaround that worked in my case:
- first, using the "Split audio" option of the "Edit" step on clip2, you force the complete audio track of clip2 to be present starting from the beginning of the transition either in preview mode or when rendering the project.
- second, you adjust the fade-in for clip 2.
I hope this will work in your case (I can't try it, because I'm using VS11.5).

Thanks for the workaround, but when I edit the video, I keep changing things and once you split the audio the video and audio become separate clips and if I drag the video around, the audio will not follow.

Adjusting fade-in still does not create proper fades in the rendered video.

Have you tried using a different transition.

Yes, I tried many different transition and the problem with the audio does not go away.

Is it possible to disable the auto transition / fade insertion.
Then apply manually.

In Settings -> Edit if I uncheck "Apply audio cross-fade automatically", it is still applied when I overlap two clips. So I guess there is either a bug with this setting or may be it only applies to default transitions when multiple clips are imported in the timeline at once (by dragging and dropping several source video files).

From preferences, have you set the audio fade default duration.
I usually set the transition duration and audio as the same.

Making changes to default audio fade and transition duration lengths does not make a difference.

Theres two posts going on here, are we saying that both VS 11 and X2 have a similar problem.??

I did not have this problem when I used VS 11. I only have this problem with VS 12 which automatically applies audio crossfades to transitions.

Here is some additional information:

The problem exists regardless of what format or codec is used to render the final video file.

I am providing two audio files. The first one is what is heard in the playback of the project preview. The second one is what is heard in the rendered file. Pay attention after the "Yee-haw" sound.

http://raphaelpungin.com/vs_audio_cross ... review.mp3

http://raphaelpungin.com/vs_audio_cross ... ndered.mp3

If I bring the two files in Audacity, you can see how the rendered file has the fade out at the end of the first clip and abrupt beginning of the second clip.



What is surprising to me is that I and the person who started this thread are the only people who experience this issue. Can someone else using VS 12 try this? Have two clips with sound. Overlap one with the other so that the transition and audio fade is automatically created. Render the video and listen to the audio during transition point. Compare what you hear in the preview and what you hear in the rendered file. Do you hear how in the rendered file the audio transition is not smooth??

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi Raphael

One thing that has become mandatory is the update of Direct X.
I notice that this has not been mentioned in this post. (Very Strange)
Although there is an auto windows update, it is essential that Dirext X is updated manually.
Have you done this?

See this post at the top of this forum

http://forum.corel.com/EN/viewtopic.php?t=35049

[Black Lab]

Thanks for the workaround, but when I edit the video, I keep changing things and once you split the audio the video and audio become separate clips and if I drag the video around, the audio will not follow.

Yes, the audio and video become separate clips, but the audio on the video clip is simply muted. If you move the clip, just unmute it, then you can split it again.

[rpungin]

What is annoying is that bug has not been fixed in X3. I just ordered a MacBook Pro and Final Cut Express. Bye Bye Video Studio...

[Ron P.]

What is annoying is that bug has not been fixed in X3. I just ordered a MacBook Pro and Final Cut Express. Bye Bye Video Studio...

You expected VS to be anywhere similar to Final Cut Express ? That's unrealistic, apples to oranges comparison, not only with the programs but also a PC vs Mac? Let's see FCE can be had for only $199 (US), yep pretty fair comparison. I wonder why they charge $100 more for it?