Unfriendly forums

[2Dogs]

I've been feeling an increasing urge to buy an HD camcorder recently. It's just not right, we're supposed to be in a recession. Being so anal retentive though, I feel compelled to thoroughly research the subject before considering any purchases.

From everything I've read so far, the HDV format seems like the best bet, even though with the additional convenience of flash media or hard drive camcorders, tape-based camcorders are rapidly being phased out.

Nevertheless, the highest rated HD camcorder according to more than one source is the Canon HV30. It turns out that even some struggling indie film makers use them, admittedly with 35mm adaptors that enable them to create a reduced depth of field more like a film camera or expensive pro camera.

I actually discovered a forum devoted entirely to the HV20 and HV30, and spent a couple of days lurking about - but what a difference there was compared with the VS and related forums!

If you dare to post as a "newbie" on the HV30 forum, you appear to incur the wrath of the elders, who seem to favour fancy movie-related avatars. The tone of their posts generally puts me in mind of petulant pre-teen girls.

In answer to a query such as "what is the best editing program" there are simply endless responses to the effect "I use such-and such" with not a word of explanation or justification.

I don't doubt that there will actually be some sensible and useful information within the forum, but it's hard work filtering out all the junk.

Thank goodness for this group of forums, with a much friendlier and less pretentious group of users.

[sjj1805]

I've been feeling an increasing urge to buy an HD camcorder recently. It's just not right, we're supposed to be in a recession. ....

I say go for it!
With this recession business what is the best thing to do with our hard earned cash. Put it into a bank and the next time you pop to the bank machine you get a message "insufficient funds" - does that mean you or the bank!

So instead you book a holiday only to find the airline has gone bust

Glad to hear you are finding this Web Board friendly and like all other members of this Web Board I also keep a look out for ideas when upgrading equipment. Not just camcorders but also computers and other peripherals are constantly changing. Standard Def, High Definition, Blue Ray, AVCHD. Then computers we get Dual Core, Quad Core.
Operating systems XP, Vista and now we hear Windows 7 is in the pipeline. It is almost impossible to keep on top of the ever changing technology available and to ask "what is the best ....." is something that needs to be asked almost every other week because previous posts will already be out of date.

[2Dogs]

Well, I've gone for it!

I couldn't resist buying a Canon HV30 online for......$309, including shipping!

Can you believe that price? I'm certainly expecting to have to fight to get my order filled. It was one of those retailers that encourage you to buy all manner of accessories at less than competitive prices, and I resisted that temptation fairly easily.

I bought my Panasonic FZ8 super zoom compact digital camera last year from a similar New York based online store for $155 - the lowest price I've ever seen one go for. I had one heck of a time having them honour the order though. They initially cancelled it, after I declined to buy a "US spec" battery - as if there is even such a thing for a digital camera! In the end, it was only by making a complaint to the online search engine I used to find the retailer that got them to play ball. Needless to say the camera was a normal US spec model with a normal US spec battery. The retailer's online price for the FZ8 went up by over $50 after my order was confirmed.

So I'm ready for some e-mail sparring again - but can you believe just $309 for possibly the best consumer camcorder on the market? (even though it's probably the last of a dying breed of tape-based HDV cams)

If it works out of course, I'll have no option but to either upgrade one of my pc's or build a new one.

[skier-hughes]

Well, I've gone for it!

I couldn't resist buying a Canon HV30 online for......$309, including shipping!

Can you believe that price? - but can you believe just $309 for possibly the best consumer camcorder on the market? (even though it's probably the last of a dying breed of tape-based HDV cams)

If it works out of course, I'll have no option but to either upgrade one of my pc's or build a new one.

So it's now $2,309 for a new cam... that's a super price, a quick check here in the UK gives me prices ranging from 585UKp to 858UKp
http://shopping.kelkoo.co.uk/ctl/do/sea ... mform=true

[2Dogs]

My first pc, back in the 80's, a 486 with a 104Mb hard drive, cost me over ¢G2000! (though that included a daisy-wheel printer....)

The US is still so much cheaper than the UK for many things. Each year, I bring a few laser distance-measuring and laser alignment pocket tools to the UK with me, and also a few mid-range sailing ratchet blocks.

[2Dogs]

Well, it's "game on"!

As I expected, there was no confirmation of order email from the online seller, so I emailed them yesterday. I'd also checked for the transaction on my credit card, and nothing had gone thru.

Since there was no response to my email, I called this morning. They really big themselves up in their phone menu while you wait to speak to a representative, so I was encouraged that they placed a lot of emphasis on customer service.

After quite a few minutes of listening to some lovely piped music (not!) I got thru to a sales person. Although I didn't have an order number, I was able to give him my details and he was obviously able to see them at his end.

Then came the inevitable question that these "bait and switch" style sellers always ask. "Was there anything you needed to know about your camera?" to which I happily and cheerfully replied "no".

The agent then put my order thru, but it wasn't over. "Is there anything else we can help you with?". From me, "no thanks, I'm all set!". He then implied that I would need a battery and charger to go with the camcorder, and that I couldn't use it without one. "No, that's fine" I responded, knowing that the HV30 obliges you to charge the battery whilst it's in the camera - an inconvenience, but not something that makes a very over-priced non O.E.M. battery and charger essential.

The agent's manner was curt at best. They clearly don't really want to let an HV30 go for just $309, and would like to get a margin on some accessories, but as I see it, there probably aren't that many hard-nosed buyers that hold them to their great deal.

So I still think there's a chance I'll actually get the camera...... although I now think I should have got the agent to give me the order number. I'll give it a couple of days before I phone them again, and maybe play a bit dim too in my phone manner.

[2Dogs]

I would have edited my previous post to add the latest developments, but I don't seem to have that option, so I'm just adding this update.

I called the online seller again, since there was still no confirmation of my order.

After only about 5 minutes of waiting on the phone, I got thru to a sales agent, who actually gave me my order number, and then put me thru to another guy.

The first question from this agent was whether I'd ordered the 4 hour, the 6 hour or the 9 hour battery with the camcorder. When I told him I'd just ordered the camcorder with the battery that was supplied with it he told me that it was "sold out", and that there "probably wouldn't be any more in until after christmas".

When I asked, he did say that my original order would be honoured, on the original terms, when and if more units came in.

To me, this is just prima-facie evidence of the use of a classic "bait and switch" tactic by the seller. I submitted a report to the search engine who feature the seller with a five star "trusted seller" rating.

People need to stand up to these sort of tactics. I can well imagine less determined customers being persuaded to buy a range of less than competitively priced accessories so that they end up paying more for the camera than they might do with other sellers.

So right now, I think my chances of having the order filled are fairly remote.

[sjj1805]

Reminds me of when I bought my wife a laptop from a famous Nationwide High Street Store. "No thank you I do NOT want the extended guarantee"
(Gee I even fix computers for other people!)

One month later I check my Bank Statement and they had taken out a "Monthly Standing Order" for an extended guarantee.

Grrrrr

[2Dogs]

I trust you then arrested them officer!