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Hi all,

Playback on my cam, after sending an HDV project back to the camcorder from a rendered Transport Stream file, is sticky (pause, brief blue screen). Everything works fine until it is time to move the project back to the camcorder, and then while I'm monitoring the recording progress I see the sticky moments happen on my camcorder LCD screen. However, those sticky moments are not present on the rendered transport stream file, so the culprit does not appear to be in the rendering process.

I have plenty of computing power, disk space and memory. This is VS12. Having the rendered file in HD is great, and I have tried on successive times to transfer it again to my cam, and the sticky thing still happens, sometimes in the same places.

I do notice that during the recording process, the computer is so busy with the task that the dialogue boxes for the recording process in VS12 are unresponsive. If I leave it alone until it's done, it finishes the sticky recording and then finally becomes responsive. But if I ever want to abort the recording mid-stream, I have to turn my camera off. That does not bother me necessarily--if the recording was not sticky, I wouldn't mind just letting my computer be unresponsive while it did the work. But this "holding of breath" while it does the sticky recording might be a clue to something.

I am prepared to try two other remedies, but I wanted to see if anyone on the board knows of a particular gremlin in this process that I might be missing. Please let me know if so, and I will be most grateful.

(My two remedies in the meantime will be 1) to clean my cam's heads, and 2) maybe try next time with a smaller filie--this project is about an hour of recording or 11GB).

Thanks for your counsel.

Hi,
I'm testing this now and will get back to you.
Be patient, This will take awhile to convert 13Gigs of HDV back to TS format. Write back to the tape & then test/playback to verify a good write back.

I'll post back the results, and/or suggestions.

I have a sinking feeling in my gut that etech's experiment will turn out to be positive, since he has a Sony camera, and the export process will probably work just fine. But Calstvns, let me guess: you have a Canon...? And the sinking feeling I have is because I have a Canon, and until now I had forgotten to test exporting edited HDV back to my Canon HV20 with X2.

You may or may not have known that this did not work with VS11/11.5+ either, yet it worked just fine with VS10+ with a special Canon patch which was released to fix the same error. I speculated more than once with VS11.5+ that the programmers had simply forgotten to write in the code of that VS10 patch into the code of VS11.5+. But again I have the sinking feeling that they simply did that again, despite the discussion of it here on more than one occasion...

I'll try it myself a little later and get back to you, but I think I know what the result is going to be. But boy! Am I glad I still have VS10 installed on this computer! I have just checked and found that at least I can still, in X2, save a project in VS10 format...

Thanks for your input, both of you so far. Etech, I will await your results.

Ken, my cam is a Sony HDR-HC3. So it's unlikely that any of the issues you saw that were related to your Canon are the same with me, unless the problem occurs across the brands.

So, Etech, if you find an issue with your experimentation, and if you have a Sony, it might really be helpful. And, I cannot find a Sony head cleaner in my town today, so will have to wait several days to see if that's the problem. (The momentary blue screen behavior is so very much reminiscent of a dirty heads issue).

If it is dirty heads, I'll slap my forehead over the dumb-obvious-answer thing, kind of like when I called a tech over my TV and it was unplugged. But I appreciate learning from you whether there may be other issues here. If it is just the heads, we'll all have a lesson here about the need for good maintenance, making this a good thread for future folks to search-and-learn.

In the meantime, I'll learn from your input and research, and wait for my head-cleaner to arrive from buy.com.

Thanks again,

Well, it's probably bad news for all of us! I have just run an experiment. I made a fairly short project with several HDV clips from my Canon HV20, added transitions, a bit of music, and colour mattes at beginning and end. Then, with the HV20 connected via Firewire and switched to PLAY position, I chose Share > HDV Recording in X2. The rendering went quickly then the little export preview screen appeared, asked me to select Next, thought about things for a while, then instructed me to press the REC button to begin the export.

Then, unfortunately - it sounds exactly as though you experienced - the exporting seemed to work for a few seconds -- I could see the new video on the camera screen. But then there was a blue screen for a second or two, then the export would continue for a few more seconds, then another blue screen, and so on. The timing of the successful bits and the blue screens varied. Playback in the camera reflected the foregoing for the length of the exported project.

So it sounds as though this may be a certifiable bug not limited this time to only Canon cameras, but (at least) Sony as well...

FWIW, with VS11.5+, with the HV20 it would begin the export for a second or two, but then the first blue screen would bring the whole process to a halt. Always.

Also FWIW, I saved my X2 project in VS10 format, opened VS 10 and the project, and went through the same procedure described above. But this time it worked perfectly!

Not a good one, Corel!

I'll play the optimist for a bit longer. You still did this with your Canon, and it will be interesting to see if Etech gets an OK test with his Sony. That would confirm my optimism (though it would remain bad news for a Canon owner), and I can maybe clean my heads and get the Sony to work.

Optimism does feel better, but reality might be something else. And if we really have a certifiable bug, regardless of what cam one uses, then I hope Corel sees this thread and addresses the issue.

My work-around might be to use v10, as you have. Thanks for that tip. Not exactly satisfying, but gets the result for me and you, but leaving users without an old copy of v10 to struggle.

Etech, I look forward to hearing how your test went.

It also worked for Sony cameras in VS11/11.5+...

Damn!. looks like no reason to move to X2! for me anyway.

Hi, Ken:

I'm trying the idea of using v10 as a work-around, since you say it will write back a rendered HD_TS file to my Sony just fine.

Maybe you know the quirks I need to satisfy, because I'm not succeeding. When I try to load the file into the clip library, v10 alerts me that the file is "not editable" and asks if I want to "pre-process it." I said "no" at first, thinking maybe it will let me put the clip in the library anyway, even though it is uneditable. But my "no" answer just aborts the whole idea and nothing is imported. So then I say "yes" instead and it renders a new file (leaving the old one alone, thankfully) and this file it does add to the clip library.

Now, however, this file does not have sound, though it appears to be HD. And when I try to export, I get a message that says I need a file that is prepared for an HD cam in order to write it to an HD camcorder.

Clearly my original file, created in v12, is not compatible with v10, and v10 wants to process it in a way that no longer allows it to be recorded on to my cam.

What to do? Any advice?

Calstvns,
I'm using a Sony-HC3. I bought a Sony tape cleaner ( Cat# PDVM-12CL ). I've never had to use it yet. Maybe it's time
I suggest only using a Sony Tape Cleaner. I only use Sony tapes and even use some of the Premium HDV ones when I can get them on sale.
I usually write-back to the Sony Premium Tapes (Blue-Wrapper).

It didn't work correctly.
First, when exporting to tape I've usually always had to disable smart-render for a clean write back to tape without any hiccups.
I exported 11.5 gig's of video to HDV (60i) transport stream.
It played for a few minutes then the screen seems to lose focus and I would get a jump in the tape. Then play again, then jump etc.
Same problems as Ken reported.

I think we need help from tech support for this one.

Referencing VS10+ if you try to load a transport stream video it will ask you to convert to an editable format, when you answer "Yes" VS10+ should make a copy of the original TS file and convert it to PS (program stream) format for editing.
But, to write back to tape the video file must match the TS format exactly or you will get hiccups in the write back.. So then VS10+ will convert it back again to the TS format to write back to tape.

So as I surmised, it sadly seems that the problem in VS11/11.5+ has now become generalised and covers at least both Sony and Canon cameras. And yes, etech, I agree that we will need to draw it to the attention of Corel.

Just to let you know, I have now informed Corel of the contents of this thread, and asked that a fix be worked into any future update patch. I did this direct to one of the software developers, rather than just a fault notice to Corel's Tech Support. Hopefully, that might get some more focused attention.

Thanks again for all the help. Will one of you draw this to Corel's attention?

Regarding using v10 as a work-around, please see my last post. As I mentioned there, v10 processes the file, and then that file becomes editable. However, in that form, the routine sees that I have a HD camera and considers the new "processed" video file unacceptable for an HD cam, and then I'm stuck again.

Well, On a good note, off topic of this one.
I did import a full DL AVCHD disk all encoded at 15MBS CBR w/Dolby 5.1 @ 448kbs
The program did smart render all the videos into one large AVC/H264 file 8gigs. Took about 40-45 Minutes, my video disk is pretty fragmented.

The new 8 gig file is not corrupted and plays on all my players. VS12 did not change any of the encoder settings. I used the mpeg optimizer feature.
Also like to add that all the avc/h264 videos had the same video/audio properties which makes smart render work.

I just had VS12 convert this 8gig avc/h264 file to a standard HDV (hd-mpeg2) video to write back to tape.
Now I have an 11.5gig HDV video in TS format so I'm playing around with it trying to get a program to write it to tape.

This is not the same file I originally converted to write back to tape (previous post). This is another conversion. The first one was HDV source video.
Figure I'd also see how the quality was going from avc/h264 to HDV (hd-mpeg2).

Calstvns -- I normally just use a project file. In other words, I open my project saved in VS10 format and go to Share > HDV recording from there. In other words, I do NOT first render that project into a single new HDV file. And that workflow always works (as long, of course, as the project is in VS10 format).

However, I have found that if I use an edited HDV file, and regardless of whether it is one which VS has produced as part of a normal render (Share > Create Video File > DVD), or whether it is already one which has been produced as a by-product of the export to camera process (i.e. in acceptable transport stream mpeg-2), the export process still requires it to be fully rendered again. I have not noticed any visible degradation in quality, however, in this second render.

If you get a warning message that something can't be done when the first little preview/recording screen appears, click Next anyway... At least that is what I have found.