1. I have a registered copy of Ulead Workshop 2 and I think it is not working quite right, called Ulead/Corel, who say they no longer support the product. I had to uninstall Ulead Workshop a while back and it keeps asking me to register it even though it is. So, here I am. I have created a 5 minute Flash movie that I am converting to AVI and then burning onto DVD to play on TV. At this time it seems I have to burn two seperate files as only the menu movie will loop and not the intro. That's the first problem. Second problem is when setting the loop it is supposed to play up to a 254 minute movie and loop over again but it stops at 4 minutes 14 secs. I have tried to reset over and over but it is stuck at 4 minutes 14 seconds.
2. What is the best method and codec to convert Flash file to AVI to DVD with the highest resolution possible? When I create the Flash Movie file and then using MiniRiver's Flash to AVI converter it looks great on the computer, but once I burn it to DVD the resolution really sucks and the file is only about 100 meg so there is plenty of room left. I think it is being rerendered in the burn. I am trying to achieve near broadcast quality. I tried uncompressed but the file is then over 4 gig.
Any help and suggestions would be so appreciated. Also any ideas to create the best quality Flash video without using 29 different programs would be welcome as Flash has some nice text/object FX but not great transitions.
My system is a Dell 8300 P4 2 gig ram, IDE drive and two SATA 200+ Drives, ATI x150 video card.
Thanks so much, Randy
Workshop 2 Flash movie DVD problems
-
Ron P.
- Advisor
- Posts: 12002
- Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 12:45 am
- System_Drive: C
- 32bit or 64bit: 64 Bit
- motherboard: Hewlett-Packard 2AF3 1.0
- processor: 3.40 gigahertz Intel Core i7-4770
- ram: 16GB
- Video Card: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 645
- sound_card: NVIDIA High Definition Audio
- Hard_Drive_Capacity: 4TB
- Monitor/Display Make & Model: 1-HP 27" IPS, 1-Sanyo 21" TV/Monitor
- Corel programs: VS5,8.9,10-X5,PSP9-X8,CDGS-9,X4,Painter
- Location: Kansas, USA
Welcome to the forums,
What program are you using to create your Flash movie? You might check to see if it can output to an AVI, which will most likely be a RAW uncompressed, and quite large. For example I use a program called SwishMax, and SwishVideo. With SwishMax I can output to AVI or SWF, the latter being very compressed.
Then convert the RAW, avi to a DVD compatible MPEG-2, since this is what DVDs must use. This will provide you with the highest possible quality. Creating a Flash file, then converting it to a lesser compressed format such as MPEG-2 or AVI will result in quality loss. Flash video is intended to be streamed or viewed on the internet or PC, so the files are highly compressed.
The key is to minimize the times the file is recoded.
Also when creating your Flash file, what resolution and frame rates are you using? These should be set to meet the DVD specs. For PAL they should be 720 x 576 (Frame size) and 25fps (frames per second), NTSC should be 720 x 480 (frame size) and 29.97fps. Most Flash authoring programs use a much smaller frame size and a faster frame rate, again for internet usage.
What program are you using to create your Flash movie? You might check to see if it can output to an AVI, which will most likely be a RAW uncompressed, and quite large. For example I use a program called SwishMax, and SwishVideo. With SwishMax I can output to AVI or SWF, the latter being very compressed.
Then convert the RAW, avi to a DVD compatible MPEG-2, since this is what DVDs must use. This will provide you with the highest possible quality. Creating a Flash file, then converting it to a lesser compressed format such as MPEG-2 or AVI will result in quality loss. Flash video is intended to be streamed or viewed on the internet or PC, so the files are highly compressed.
The key is to minimize the times the file is recoded.
Also when creating your Flash file, what resolution and frame rates are you using? These should be set to meet the DVD specs. For PAL they should be 720 x 576 (Frame size) and 25fps (frames per second), NTSC should be 720 x 480 (frame size) and 29.97fps. Most Flash authoring programs use a much smaller frame size and a faster frame rate, again for internet usage.
Ron Petersen, Web Board Administrator
-
sjj1805
- Posts: 14383
- Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 7:20 am
- System_Drive: C
- 32bit or 64bit: 32 Bit
- motherboard: Equium P200-178
- processor: Intel Pentium Dual-Core Processor T2080
- ram: 2 GB
- Video Card: Intel 945 Express
- sound_card: Intel GMA 950
- Hard_Drive_Capacity: 1160 GB
- Location: Birmingham UK
Welcome to the Web Board
You seem to be having several "problems"
1. Registering.
You can still register the program here
The nag screen should include a "do not show this message again" option - just tick it with your mouse.
2. A first play video is what it says. It plays once and then takes you to the DVD Menu. If you want to see it again you would need to add it to your list of videos and then link to it from a menu button/menu text.
3. A menu is a menu. If you want to watch the entire video you need to link to it with a menu button/text. Menus have a maximum duration which you appear to have now found!
4. DVD's are made from MPEG2 files not "avi" this is why the program is converting your video.
You seem to be having several "problems"
1. Registering.
You can still register the program here
The nag screen should include a "do not show this message again" option - just tick it with your mouse.
2. A first play video is what it says. It plays once and then takes you to the DVD Menu. If you want to see it again you would need to add it to your list of videos and then link to it from a menu button/menu text.
3. A menu is a menu. If you want to watch the entire video you need to link to it with a menu button/text. Menus have a maximum duration which you appear to have now found!
4. DVD's are made from MPEG2 files not "avi" this is why the program is converting your video.
-
Randy Southpaw
- Posts: 7
- Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2008 11:06 am
Thanks Vidoman and sjj1805, I appreciate the greeting, fast response, and feel I have finally found where I need to be.
Vidoman, I too am using SwishMax and love the potential of the product. Very easy to use. When I saved the SWF I turned off compression and saved it in Flash 8 format. That alone made a great difference from Flash 6. I have been having problems saving uncompressed files as I am using both vector and raster graphics, plus working on inserting a video here and there. I also went and made sure the quality setting was maxed.
I forgot to mention it but I have experimented with uncompressed, XVID, DIVX, MPEG2, etc before I take the file into Workshop 2. I love that prgoram but it's got a few limitations. I downloaded some trial versions of ULead's VidoeStudio11 and MediaStudio Pro 8 and noticed a great deal of flexibility there already. Just need to spend some time with them now.
Thanks for all the compression info, I've been trying to find that for quite a while.
sjj1805,
Thank you also to you but I'm not sure we're reading the same post. As I stated, my Workshop is already registered One thing I did notice searching my new trial downloads that there is a copy of a trial version of Workshop 2 I had on my computer. I thought that may be causing my problem. I think what I'll do is put a very short first play video on there and let it go to the main menu. In your reference to buttons, this is an auto play video only which needs to be looped and is not interactive at all. I'm not sure where you see I just found the duration button as I am trying to loop a five minute plus video, but I do see my error. It is not 254 minutes of video, but only 254 seconds. So, how may I automatically loop my over 5 minute video and if I break into segments how do I link them together.
I remembered running into that problem creating a professional guitar instruction video.
I appreciate it guys and look forward to a hopefully long and prosperous experieince here at the Corel board. Ya'll have a great weekend. Thanks, Randy Southpaw
Vidoman, I too am using SwishMax and love the potential of the product. Very easy to use. When I saved the SWF I turned off compression and saved it in Flash 8 format. That alone made a great difference from Flash 6. I have been having problems saving uncompressed files as I am using both vector and raster graphics, plus working on inserting a video here and there. I also went and made sure the quality setting was maxed.
I forgot to mention it but I have experimented with uncompressed, XVID, DIVX, MPEG2, etc before I take the file into Workshop 2. I love that prgoram but it's got a few limitations. I downloaded some trial versions of ULead's VidoeStudio11 and MediaStudio Pro 8 and noticed a great deal of flexibility there already. Just need to spend some time with them now.
Thanks for all the compression info, I've been trying to find that for quite a while.
sjj1805,
Thank you also to you but I'm not sure we're reading the same post. As I stated, my Workshop is already registered One thing I did notice searching my new trial downloads that there is a copy of a trial version of Workshop 2 I had on my computer. I thought that may be causing my problem. I think what I'll do is put a very short first play video on there and let it go to the main menu. In your reference to buttons, this is an auto play video only which needs to be looped and is not interactive at all. I'm not sure where you see I just found the duration button as I am trying to loop a five minute plus video, but I do see my error. It is not 254 minutes of video, but only 254 seconds. So, how may I automatically loop my over 5 minute video and if I break into segments how do I link them together.
I remembered running into that problem creating a professional guitar instruction video.
I appreciate it guys and look forward to a hopefully long and prosperous experieince here at the Corel board. Ya'll have a great weekend. Thanks, Randy Southpaw
-
Ron P.
- Advisor
- Posts: 12002
- Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 12:45 am
- System_Drive: C
- 32bit or 64bit: 64 Bit
- motherboard: Hewlett-Packard 2AF3 1.0
- processor: 3.40 gigahertz Intel Core i7-4770
- ram: 16GB
- Video Card: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 645
- sound_card: NVIDIA High Definition Audio
- Hard_Drive_Capacity: 4TB
- Monitor/Display Make & Model: 1-HP 27" IPS, 1-Sanyo 21" TV/Monitor
- Corel programs: VS5,8.9,10-X5,PSP9-X8,CDGS-9,X4,Painter
- Location: Kansas, USA
When working with video, all your vector images must be converted to raster. So this would also lead to some quality loss, ontop of the recoding.
Are you embedding video files in your Swish Project? If so the video quality will also be degraded, Swish must encode that to FLV or SWF, which is more compressed than the original video clip. Now you need to recode this to DVD MPEG-2, quality hit #2. Normally when using video clip formats such as DV (avi), or MPEG-2, a second recode is not really noticeable. However whenever you start with a very highly compressed video file format, such as FLV, SWF, DivX, MPEG-4, each recode may degrade the quality where it is noticeable. Part of this also is attributed to the encoders used. Pro's use very expensive (you could buy a house for less) encoders and get away with multiple recodes without the quality suffering. However for us consumers the encoders just are not capable of that. So start large (RAW uncompressed AVI, or DV) and end at the smallest, compressed state that you're going to need (MPEG-2 for DVD,)DivX, Xvid, MPEG-4, SWF, FLV (for internet or PC viewing).
My analogy to this would be using a piece of aluminum foil. When you start with a RAW piece it is very smooth and crisp. Start folding or wadding it up. The more you fold (compress), the less smooth. If you start with a piece that is already folded several times (compressed) and then unfold it, it simply can not be as smooth as the original.
Video or image compression (codecs) work about the same way, except it discards parts of the images. In video, the only full image frame is considered an "I" frame. It contains all the details. There are subsequent frames called B and P frames. They will only contain parts, changes to the I frame. Full uncompressed video has only "I" frames, so all the detail is there in every frame. However any compression will use some algorithm to discard parts of the "I" frame, and then hold the remaining parts in the "B" and "P" frames.
So with that said, if you start with a highly compressed video clip, that has very few "I" frames, and then convert it to a lessor compressed format, the program must try to create the details that are not there. It must guess at what should be there, which most of the time the guess is not a good one.
This requires using a NLE such as VS or MSP:
This takes a little or a lot of work, but I would suggest creating your "Flash" project using your vector/raster images, and titles. You can then export to a SWF file. Then use the SWF files in the overlay track(s). I'm suspecting that you're after some "flashy" titles/subtitles or effects.
I done a quick comparison using the "heart" preset and a title, exporting the project to uncompressed AVI and to SWF7. There did not seem to be any noticeable difference in quality when they were inserted into VS. The major difference was the file size. The clip was around 5 secs, and the file sizes for AVI was about 195meg, for the SWF file 5.5k. So you can see the compression that is occurring. Now I did not render the VS project to an MPEG-2 video file, which would have recoded the SWF. This may have caused some loss in quality on the SWF file..
EDITED
Well out of curiosity, I did render a short VS project to MPEG-2. First using the SWF file in the overlay track, then using the uncompressed AVI exported from Swish. The video using the SWF did show a loss in quality of the text, where the AVI did not.
Are you embedding video files in your Swish Project? If so the video quality will also be degraded, Swish must encode that to FLV or SWF, which is more compressed than the original video clip. Now you need to recode this to DVD MPEG-2, quality hit #2. Normally when using video clip formats such as DV (avi), or MPEG-2, a second recode is not really noticeable. However whenever you start with a very highly compressed video file format, such as FLV, SWF, DivX, MPEG-4, each recode may degrade the quality where it is noticeable. Part of this also is attributed to the encoders used. Pro's use very expensive (you could buy a house for less) encoders and get away with multiple recodes without the quality suffering. However for us consumers the encoders just are not capable of that. So start large (RAW uncompressed AVI, or DV) and end at the smallest, compressed state that you're going to need (MPEG-2 for DVD,)DivX, Xvid, MPEG-4, SWF, FLV (for internet or PC viewing).
My analogy to this would be using a piece of aluminum foil. When you start with a RAW piece it is very smooth and crisp. Start folding or wadding it up. The more you fold (compress), the less smooth. If you start with a piece that is already folded several times (compressed) and then unfold it, it simply can not be as smooth as the original.
Video or image compression (codecs) work about the same way, except it discards parts of the images. In video, the only full image frame is considered an "I" frame. It contains all the details. There are subsequent frames called B and P frames. They will only contain parts, changes to the I frame. Full uncompressed video has only "I" frames, so all the detail is there in every frame. However any compression will use some algorithm to discard parts of the "I" frame, and then hold the remaining parts in the "B" and "P" frames.
So with that said, if you start with a highly compressed video clip, that has very few "I" frames, and then convert it to a lessor compressed format, the program must try to create the details that are not there. It must guess at what should be there, which most of the time the guess is not a good one.
This requires using a NLE such as VS or MSP:
This takes a little or a lot of work, but I would suggest creating your "Flash" project using your vector/raster images, and titles. You can then export to a SWF file. Then use the SWF files in the overlay track(s). I'm suspecting that you're after some "flashy" titles/subtitles or effects.
I done a quick comparison using the "heart" preset and a title, exporting the project to uncompressed AVI and to SWF7. There did not seem to be any noticeable difference in quality when they were inserted into VS. The major difference was the file size. The clip was around 5 secs, and the file sizes for AVI was about 195meg, for the SWF file 5.5k. So you can see the compression that is occurring. Now I did not render the VS project to an MPEG-2 video file, which would have recoded the SWF. This may have caused some loss in quality on the SWF file..
EDITED
Well out of curiosity, I did render a short VS project to MPEG-2. First using the SWF file in the overlay track, then using the uncompressed AVI exported from Swish. The video using the SWF did show a loss in quality of the text, where the AVI did not.
Ron Petersen, Web Board Administrator
-
Randy Southpaw
- Posts: 7
- Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2008 11:06 am
Vidoman,
thank you so much for the so needed info and the experiments you're doing on my behalf. Can you recommend any books, tutorials, or any other type of instructional material I can study to learn more about this.?You've given me great insight into things I have not accidentally encountered and it seems I am missing a great deal of info. I have noticed the b & I settings in the codecs settings but wasn't sure what to do about it. To bad there is not a codec out there to adjust the quality to size ratio as there is plenty of room on the DVD left over after a 100meg burn. As you know you can convert uncompressed straight from Swish. What a waste. I know I did get one drop dead gorgeous result from one AVI file but when I took it to DVD it was just fair.
What I am doing is creating an info and advertiser DVD for the restaurant I am working at. I have attained some excellent resolution in a few of the AVI converts but lose it when burning to DVD. I am displaying it on a 16:9 HD flat screen tv at the restaurant. The picture I would rate fair to fair minus. I have watched the DVDs on my computer and there is a greatly noticeable reduction in quality taking it to the DVD where it is sharp and clear on the computer after converting SWF to AVI.
If you were to do this project what course would you take using what tools(programs) just out of curiosity? Per se, if you were to create this using video editing programs as opposed to Swish. And what would you recommend as the better DVD burning/authoring program for the PC?
Once again I thank you for all the info. Even if it doesn't help this project I am already more knwledgeable with what you've shared.
Thanks Vidoman,
Randy
thank you so much for the so needed info and the experiments you're doing on my behalf. Can you recommend any books, tutorials, or any other type of instructional material I can study to learn more about this.?You've given me great insight into things I have not accidentally encountered and it seems I am missing a great deal of info. I have noticed the b & I settings in the codecs settings but wasn't sure what to do about it. To bad there is not a codec out there to adjust the quality to size ratio as there is plenty of room on the DVD left over after a 100meg burn. As you know you can convert uncompressed straight from Swish. What a waste. I know I did get one drop dead gorgeous result from one AVI file but when I took it to DVD it was just fair.
What I am doing is creating an info and advertiser DVD for the restaurant I am working at. I have attained some excellent resolution in a few of the AVI converts but lose it when burning to DVD. I am displaying it on a 16:9 HD flat screen tv at the restaurant. The picture I would rate fair to fair minus. I have watched the DVDs on my computer and there is a greatly noticeable reduction in quality taking it to the DVD where it is sharp and clear on the computer after converting SWF to AVI.
If you were to do this project what course would you take using what tools(programs) just out of curiosity? Per se, if you were to create this using video editing programs as opposed to Swish. And what would you recommend as the better DVD burning/authoring program for the PC?
Once again I thank you for all the info. Even if it doesn't help this project I am already more knwledgeable with what you've shared.
Thanks Vidoman,
Randy
-
Ron P.
- Advisor
- Posts: 12002
- Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 12:45 am
- System_Drive: C
- 32bit or 64bit: 64 Bit
- motherboard: Hewlett-Packard 2AF3 1.0
- processor: 3.40 gigahertz Intel Core i7-4770
- ram: 16GB
- Video Card: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 645
- sound_card: NVIDIA High Definition Audio
- Hard_Drive_Capacity: 4TB
- Monitor/Display Make & Model: 1-HP 27" IPS, 1-Sanyo 21" TV/Monitor
- Corel programs: VS5,8.9,10-X5,PSP9-X8,CDGS-9,X4,Painter
- Location: Kansas, USA
Most of the knowledge I've gained came from this forum, and some incidental material such as Charlie Hills Getting Results with.. VS9 and MSP8. Both VS9 and MSP are phased-out, but the material covered is great.
The problem with creating your entire video in Swish or any other flash authoring program, is that they are intended to produce animation, for the web, not for DVD. As you discovered your video looked great on your PC, however not so much on the DVD.
When you inserted your video clip into Swish it immediately recoded it. This must be recoded to MPEG-2 format for the DVD. While Swish does a great job for the web stuff, it really can not handle much higher resolutions that are for viewing on TV.
Now since your project is to be viewed on not only a TV, but a High-Def TV, you should be using a video editing program that is capable of outputting HD video such as 1080 or 1080i. The "i" just means interlaced, whereas the absence of the "i" indicates progressive scan or Frame based, non-interlaced video. VideoStudio 11+ is a good NLE, that has a simple user interface, and you can produce some great videos with it. VS12 will probably be released in the very near future, which promises even more than it's predecessor. With NLE's such as VS, you can place your actual video clip(s) into the main video track, place your "flash" creations in any one of the 6 overlay tracks, synch it up to match the video or whatever. You can use Dolby 5.1 surround, and then it even includes a DVD authoring component (what we call the burn module) to burn your composition to DVD, even HD or Blu-Ray.
DVD WS2 is a DVD authoring program, and probably no video editing capabilities. I'm not sure, because it is one of Ulead's programs I have not purchased. It has been considered one of the best in the market for constructing DVDs. I'm also not sure if it has the capability of producing HD menus, probably due to the program being several years old, it can not.
DVD MovieFactory 6+ and the soon to be released DVD MovieFactory 7 Pro are capable of using the HD video file formats and producing HD, Blu-Ray DVDs.
Again since you are producing a DVD for commercial purposes, I would really consider using a video editing program for this. Flash is an extra tool to use. If you look at my Sig you'll see some of the other programs that I may use in a video production, and I'm just a home video hobbiest. Don't limit your creativity by using just one program for a production.
The problem with creating your entire video in Swish or any other flash authoring program, is that they are intended to produce animation, for the web, not for DVD. As you discovered your video looked great on your PC, however not so much on the DVD.
When you inserted your video clip into Swish it immediately recoded it. This must be recoded to MPEG-2 format for the DVD. While Swish does a great job for the web stuff, it really can not handle much higher resolutions that are for viewing on TV.
Now since your project is to be viewed on not only a TV, but a High-Def TV, you should be using a video editing program that is capable of outputting HD video such as 1080 or 1080i. The "i" just means interlaced, whereas the absence of the "i" indicates progressive scan or Frame based, non-interlaced video. VideoStudio 11+ is a good NLE, that has a simple user interface, and you can produce some great videos with it. VS12 will probably be released in the very near future, which promises even more than it's predecessor. With NLE's such as VS, you can place your actual video clip(s) into the main video track, place your "flash" creations in any one of the 6 overlay tracks, synch it up to match the video or whatever. You can use Dolby 5.1 surround, and then it even includes a DVD authoring component (what we call the burn module) to burn your composition to DVD, even HD or Blu-Ray.
DVD WS2 is a DVD authoring program, and probably no video editing capabilities. I'm not sure, because it is one of Ulead's programs I have not purchased. It has been considered one of the best in the market for constructing DVDs. I'm also not sure if it has the capability of producing HD menus, probably due to the program being several years old, it can not.
DVD MovieFactory 6+ and the soon to be released DVD MovieFactory 7 Pro are capable of using the HD video file formats and producing HD, Blu-Ray DVDs.
Again since you are producing a DVD for commercial purposes, I would really consider using a video editing program for this. Flash is an extra tool to use. If you look at my Sig you'll see some of the other programs that I may use in a video production, and I'm just a home video hobbiest. Don't limit your creativity by using just one program for a production.
Ron Petersen, Web Board Administrator
-
skier-hughes
- Microsoft MVP
- Posts: 2659
- Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2005 10:09 am
- System_Drive: C
- 32bit or 64bit: 64 Bit
- motherboard: gigabyte
- processor: Intel core 2 6420 2.13GHz
- ram: 4GB
- Video Card: NVidia GForce 8500GT
- sound_card: onboard
- Hard_Drive_Capacity: 36GB 2TB
- Location: UK
-
Randy Southpaw
- Posts: 7
- Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2008 11:06 am
Vidoman,
again thank you. I guess some people don't have the patience to read all of that we have discussed. Hahahaha!!!! Anyway, I burned another DVD last night and took it to the restaurant and it came out pretty good. Actually the Flash to Avi converted rather good to DVD. I'm just trying to achieve near broadcast quality. I realize it's a far cry from what I've got but I am getting closer.
No, no, I am not only using Swish and DVD WorkShop and I apologize if I misled you. I was only trying to work out the bugs that I was encountering with those two programs. Actually I bypassed WorkShop and went to my Pinnacle Ultimate 12 to burn the DVD and got a fairly good result. Plus I'll incorporate many of the video transitions there that are not available in Swish. (Here that Swish, are you listening? Hahahaha!!!) I'll try and post it online, say Mondayish so you can view it. I only meant that I was working with a minimum of programs for the burn to DVD after the conversion. Of course I am using Photoshop for the photo work, I used ImageReady for a little animation, and edited some video clouds in Premiere and Pinnacle Ultimate Studio 12. I didn't mention any audio here as it is only a visual thing but if it had audio I use Cakewalk Sonar Production and Soundforge just to name a few.
Another thing I did notice getting back to the Flash, as I mentioned burning to DVD I felt there was too much compression in the DVD burn going on there and there has to be a program/codec to adjust compression to match the size of the files on the DVD. I did an uncompressed test and the five minute flash movie came out to over five gig. My computer wasn't too happy about that.
As I mentioned I watched the DVD on my computer after the burn and it lost way too much quality and I even noticed watching on Cyberlink Power DVD that the quality was so much better than watching it on say Roxio's DVD Player. I was surprised at the difference. I didn't mention it but my movie size in Swish was around 800x600 so it's a pretty good size, and I have been experimenting with 1024x768. The programs and my computer is not appreciating that much.
I did have to trick Pinnacle into playing the Flash video over and over again by adding a tiny menu link in the bottom corner of the screen like an obnoxious watermark. I guess I'll create a logo for myself and that'll be that. I don't know if there is a menu length limitation as there is in WorkShop 2 but I promise you I'll find out. At least I did get past Workshop's 4 minutes and 14 second menu limitation. And I added a very short video file to make Pinnalce think there was a video to be played. Worked great. Played flawlessly all night long and the customers loved it.
One of the main reasons I am using Swish is the wonderfully simple manner in creating complex effects. I'm sure you enjoy that too. It is so time saving as opposed to creating the effects from scratch. Anyway, I've got to sing in a few hours at a function so I best get out here and get some rest. Later and thanks. Have a great holiday, Randy
again thank you. I guess some people don't have the patience to read all of that we have discussed. Hahahaha!!!! Anyway, I burned another DVD last night and took it to the restaurant and it came out pretty good. Actually the Flash to Avi converted rather good to DVD. I'm just trying to achieve near broadcast quality. I realize it's a far cry from what I've got but I am getting closer.
No, no, I am not only using Swish and DVD WorkShop and I apologize if I misled you. I was only trying to work out the bugs that I was encountering with those two programs. Actually I bypassed WorkShop and went to my Pinnacle Ultimate 12 to burn the DVD and got a fairly good result. Plus I'll incorporate many of the video transitions there that are not available in Swish. (Here that Swish, are you listening? Hahahaha!!!) I'll try and post it online, say Mondayish so you can view it. I only meant that I was working with a minimum of programs for the burn to DVD after the conversion. Of course I am using Photoshop for the photo work, I used ImageReady for a little animation, and edited some video clouds in Premiere and Pinnacle Ultimate Studio 12. I didn't mention any audio here as it is only a visual thing but if it had audio I use Cakewalk Sonar Production and Soundforge just to name a few.
Another thing I did notice getting back to the Flash, as I mentioned burning to DVD I felt there was too much compression in the DVD burn going on there and there has to be a program/codec to adjust compression to match the size of the files on the DVD. I did an uncompressed test and the five minute flash movie came out to over five gig. My computer wasn't too happy about that.
As I mentioned I watched the DVD on my computer after the burn and it lost way too much quality and I even noticed watching on Cyberlink Power DVD that the quality was so much better than watching it on say Roxio's DVD Player. I was surprised at the difference. I didn't mention it but my movie size in Swish was around 800x600 so it's a pretty good size, and I have been experimenting with 1024x768. The programs and my computer is not appreciating that much.
I did have to trick Pinnacle into playing the Flash video over and over again by adding a tiny menu link in the bottom corner of the screen like an obnoxious watermark. I guess I'll create a logo for myself and that'll be that. I don't know if there is a menu length limitation as there is in WorkShop 2 but I promise you I'll find out. At least I did get past Workshop's 4 minutes and 14 second menu limitation. And I added a very short video file to make Pinnalce think there was a video to be played. Worked great. Played flawlessly all night long and the customers loved it.
One of the main reasons I am using Swish is the wonderfully simple manner in creating complex effects. I'm sure you enjoy that too. It is so time saving as opposed to creating the effects from scratch. Anyway, I've got to sing in a few hours at a function so I best get out here and get some rest. Later and thanks. Have a great holiday, Randy
-
sjj1805
- Posts: 14383
- Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 7:20 am
- System_Drive: C
- 32bit or 64bit: 32 Bit
- motherboard: Equium P200-178
- processor: Intel Pentium Dual-Core Processor T2080
- ram: 2 GB
- Video Card: Intel 945 Express
- sound_card: Intel GMA 950
- Hard_Drive_Capacity: 1160 GB
- Location: Birmingham UK
When you re-installed the program your COMPUTER doesn't know you registered it with the Ulead/Corel website hence it asks you to register it.Randy Southpaw wrote:1. ...... I had to uninstall Ulead Workshop a while back and it keeps asking me to register it even though it is. ......
sjj1805 wrote:......
The nag screen should include a "do not show this message again" option - just tick it with your mouse.....
Yes we are reading the same post - I think you misinterpreted my reply.Randy Southpaw wrote:Thanks Vidoman and sjj1805, I appreciate the greeting, fast response, and feel I have finally found where I need to be.
........
sjj1805,
Thank you also to you but I'm not sure we're reading the same post. As I stated, my Workshop is already registered ......
Randy Southpaw wrote:Vidoman,
again thank you. I guess some people don't have the patience to read all of that we have discussed. Hahahaha!!!! ......
800x600 is NOT a valid DVD format - if it was it would be much closer to a 4.3 screen size than a 16.9 (widescreen) screen size - so here again you would cause deterioration simply by stretching it sideways to such a degree.Randy Southpaw wrote:....... I didn't mention it but my movie size in Swish was around 800x600 so it's a pretty good size, and I have been experimenting with 1024x768. The programs and my computer is not appreciating that much. ....
PAL.
4x3 --- 768 x 576
16x9 --- 1024 x 576
HD (Progressive) --- 1280 x 720
HD (Interlaced) --- 1920 x 1080
NTSC
4x3 --- 720 x 480
16x9 --- 864 X 480
HD (Progressive) --- 1280 x 720
HD (Interlaced) --- 1920 x 1080
-
Randy Southpaw
- Posts: 7
- Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2008 11:06 am
Uncompressed AVI not playing
Ok, I appreciate all the insight into video but now i am having another problem stemming from same. I have converted SWF movie into uncompressed AVI and it will not play or import into any of my programs (ie: Adobe Premiere & Aftereffects, Pinnacle Studio Ultimate 12, Ulead DVD Workshop 2, Ulead Mediastudio Pro, Ulead VideoStudio 11, Sony Vegas, etc, etc, etc. Also none of my media players ie: Winamp, Windows Media 11, Quicktime, Cyberlink, Roxio, etc. BUT, it will play in EffectsMatrix Total Video Player. I have tried converting to uncompressed AVI using Swish and Miniriver converters. Converting using Xvid, Cinepak, etc. works great but I am not happy with resolution quality. What does Effectmatrix have that none of the other programs/players don't? One more thing, the SWF movie files are 30meg and after converting are over 3 gig. Anyone, please.
Thanks, Randy Southpaw
Thanks, Randy Southpaw
-
Ron P.
- Advisor
- Posts: 12002
- Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 12:45 am
- System_Drive: C
- 32bit or 64bit: 64 Bit
- motherboard: Hewlett-Packard 2AF3 1.0
- processor: 3.40 gigahertz Intel Core i7-4770
- ram: 16GB
- Video Card: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 645
- sound_card: NVIDIA High Definition Audio
- Hard_Drive_Capacity: 4TB
- Monitor/Display Make & Model: 1-HP 27" IPS, 1-Sanyo 21" TV/Monitor
- Corel programs: VS5,8.9,10-X5,PSP9-X8,CDGS-9,X4,Painter
- Location: Kansas, USA
Did you use MiniRiver for the SWF-->AVI conversion? It may use some funky algorithm that is not recognized by all those programs. I would think that out of all those listed, at least one would accept it.
Raw avi is still just a container that was derived from the RIFF format, part of MicroSoft's Video For Windows (VFW) technology. There still needs to be some codec involved, and I would surmise that MiniRiver uses Indeo (Cinepak), or MJPEG (Motion JPEG), that are very old codecs, and not found many current PCs. I know that Indeo used to be free, however now you must purchase it.
As far as the file size explosion, this is not surprising. SWF is a very, very, highly compressed format. Converting that to the very least compressed format, such as "avi" the file size will blossom. Then the probably arises can your PC and the NLE handle manipulating such a large file size. A 3 gig file size is not that large, and your PC should be able to deal with it quite easily.
I again think that since you're wanting to put this on a DVD, do not convert it to "avi", but to MPEG-2 if possible. The quick read I done on MiniRiver, it provides almost no control over the MPEG-2 conversion, it's pretty much fixed. I think since your going from Highly compressed to uncompressed then having to compress it again to another format (MPEG-2) to be edited and burned onto DVD, your quality expectation is just not going to happen...
Raw avi is still just a container that was derived from the RIFF format, part of MicroSoft's Video For Windows (VFW) technology. There still needs to be some codec involved, and I would surmise that MiniRiver uses Indeo (Cinepak), or MJPEG (Motion JPEG), that are very old codecs, and not found many current PCs. I know that Indeo used to be free, however now you must purchase it.
As far as the file size explosion, this is not surprising. SWF is a very, very, highly compressed format. Converting that to the very least compressed format, such as "avi" the file size will blossom. Then the probably arises can your PC and the NLE handle manipulating such a large file size. A 3 gig file size is not that large, and your PC should be able to deal with it quite easily.
I again think that since you're wanting to put this on a DVD, do not convert it to "avi", but to MPEG-2 if possible. The quick read I done on MiniRiver, it provides almost no control over the MPEG-2 conversion, it's pretty much fixed. I think since your going from Highly compressed to uncompressed then having to compress it again to another format (MPEG-2) to be edited and burned onto DVD, your quality expectation is just not going to happen...
Ron Petersen, Web Board Administrator
-
Randy Southpaw
- Posts: 7
- Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2008 11:06 am
Hey,
thanks again.
1. I've converted to uncompressed using Miniriver AND also tried it uncompressed directly from Swish. I've got a feeling it may be the size of my starting file causing some of the problems. I have done an experiment and splicing the SWF in half creating two files and then converting them seperately, which of course didn't work. I think I'll try it even on a few more smaller files, see what happens. And I left the compress SWF box in Swish unchecked.
2. I also, as you suggested tried mpeg2 and compared it against AVI, and the AVI on the burned disk quality was better. Now, the mpeg2 codec I have may not be of high quality so that may be the problem and as you said it cannot be adjusted.
3. It seems the best rsults is from XVID codec, though it looks pretty good, it still is not good enough.
4. I think what I may end up doing is just creating the vector graphic effects in Swish and then creating everyting else in my video editing programs. It will mean a lot more bookkeeping and organiztion but if that's what it takes that's where I'm at right now. I appreciate your help and I've still got that file coming to you. Oh, everyone at the restaraunt seems to love it but us tweakers are almost never happy, right? Hahahaha!!!
Hey, if you want I could upload the whole SWF file to my webpage if you'd like to see it. It's about 30 meg but I could ftp it. Let me know.
Thanks again,
Randy
thanks again.
1. I've converted to uncompressed using Miniriver AND also tried it uncompressed directly from Swish. I've got a feeling it may be the size of my starting file causing some of the problems. I have done an experiment and splicing the SWF in half creating two files and then converting them seperately, which of course didn't work. I think I'll try it even on a few more smaller files, see what happens. And I left the compress SWF box in Swish unchecked.
2. I also, as you suggested tried mpeg2 and compared it against AVI, and the AVI on the burned disk quality was better. Now, the mpeg2 codec I have may not be of high quality so that may be the problem and as you said it cannot be adjusted.
3. It seems the best rsults is from XVID codec, though it looks pretty good, it still is not good enough.
4. I think what I may end up doing is just creating the vector graphic effects in Swish and then creating everyting else in my video editing programs. It will mean a lot more bookkeeping and organiztion but if that's what it takes that's where I'm at right now. I appreciate your help and I've still got that file coming to you. Oh, everyone at the restaraunt seems to love it but us tweakers are almost never happy, right? Hahahaha!!!
Hey, if you want I could upload the whole SWF file to my webpage if you'd like to see it. It's about 30 meg but I could ftp it. Let me know.
Thanks again,
Randy
-
Randy Southpaw
- Posts: 7
- Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2008 11:06 am
Hey Ron,
new develpoment. Ok, I took the individual scenes in Swish and then saved uncompressed both in Swish and miniriver and then went and burned with Pinnacle Studio Ultimate 12 (newest version). Taking the file into Pinnacle was 900 meg. Burning to disk took it way down to 17 meg, so Pinnacle is compressing the begeebees out of the files. I have it set to best quality but I think it's not doing much. So, that's where I'm at right now. As it seems now though I did learn I will have to create and save individual scenes and then create the whole movie in the video editing program. Later.
Thanks Again,
Randy
new develpoment. Ok, I took the individual scenes in Swish and then saved uncompressed both in Swish and miniriver and then went and burned with Pinnacle Studio Ultimate 12 (newest version). Taking the file into Pinnacle was 900 meg. Burning to disk took it way down to 17 meg, so Pinnacle is compressing the begeebees out of the files. I have it set to best quality but I think it's not doing much. So, that's where I'm at right now. As it seems now though I did learn I will have to create and save individual scenes and then create the whole movie in the video editing program. Later.
Thanks Again,
Randy