Excuse me if this is a dumb Question, I would like to back up my movie clips in Dv.avi format to dvd discs and then transfer them when needed in the future to the PC to make a movie or whatever.
Is this normally done ?
are there any setbacks ?
Back up DV.AVI to DVD Disc ?
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Terry Stetler
- Posts: 973
- Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2005 3:34 pm
- Location: Westland, Michigan USA
It's not a dumb question if you don't know the answer 
Major setback:
"Normal" MPEG is intended as a distribution format, not a production format and there is a very large difference. MPEG video is very lossy, meaning after the later edit there are likely to be unsatisfactory artifacts.
The new HDV (high definition MPEG video) format is a production format; different in that it uses a whole different MPEG "profile" (higher quality internal settings) and a much higher bitrate than standard MPEG, but unless you have an HDV camcorder this option isn't really viable.
Backing up content and projects is important, and you should set up a consistant system before you get so much material that archiving it will become a time consuming ordeal.
I back up my projects and content to removable HDD's. Not external USB/IEEE-1394 drives mind you, but removables that slide into internal hot-swap IDE bays. The driver carriers (caddies) used in this kind of setup are very cheap, unlike external boxes. Internal SATA bay/caddies are another good alternative.
The cost/gig is very low and many, many projects can fit onto a single large HDD. Not to mention that with as little use as they get media failure is very unlikely.
Also important is good storage. Mine is a converted economy model gun safe I got for $50 at a yard sale.
The great thing about MSPro is that it supports this option by way of its PACKAGE function. PACKAGE will copy (or move) all components of a project to a specified folder as well as modify the project file to reflect this change.
By placing the target folder in the root of the archive HDD's I have instant access to the whole project since that bays drive letter is consistant from one of my systems to any other.
The other option is tape, which I also avoid. It's not random access and is far to slow.
Major setback:
"Normal" MPEG is intended as a distribution format, not a production format and there is a very large difference. MPEG video is very lossy, meaning after the later edit there are likely to be unsatisfactory artifacts.
The new HDV (high definition MPEG video) format is a production format; different in that it uses a whole different MPEG "profile" (higher quality internal settings) and a much higher bitrate than standard MPEG, but unless you have an HDV camcorder this option isn't really viable.
Backing up content and projects is important, and you should set up a consistant system before you get so much material that archiving it will become a time consuming ordeal.
I back up my projects and content to removable HDD's. Not external USB/IEEE-1394 drives mind you, but removables that slide into internal hot-swap IDE bays. The driver carriers (caddies) used in this kind of setup are very cheap, unlike external boxes. Internal SATA bay/caddies are another good alternative.
The cost/gig is very low and many, many projects can fit onto a single large HDD. Not to mention that with as little use as they get media failure is very unlikely.
Also important is good storage. Mine is a converted economy model gun safe I got for $50 at a yard sale.
The great thing about MSPro is that it supports this option by way of its PACKAGE function. PACKAGE will copy (or move) all components of a project to a specified folder as well as modify the project file to reflect this change.
By placing the target folder in the root of the archive HDD's I have instant access to the whole project since that bays drive letter is consistant from one of my systems to any other.
The other option is tape, which I also avoid. It's not random access and is far to slow.
Terry Stetler
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jjoshua
Thank you Terry.
I am definitely going to look into using a HDD for back up. Though at the present I'm only familiar with External drives. Am Interested to find out what you mean by "removables that slide into internal hot-swap IDE bays"
Do you mean regular internal HDDs ?
Now back to my first query, I think you misunderstood me ;
I wanted to know if I could back up my movie clips in DV.avi as data
on a DVD disc and not MPEG 2. meaning the content (raw footage)
would still be in DV format . and would probably be playable only
when transfered back to the PC.
I am definitely going to look into using a HDD for back up. Though at the present I'm only familiar with External drives. Am Interested to find out what you mean by "removables that slide into internal hot-swap IDE bays"
Do you mean regular internal HDDs ?
Now back to my first query, I think you misunderstood me ;
I wanted to know if I could back up my movie clips in DV.avi as data
on a DVD disc and not MPEG 2. meaning the content (raw footage)
would still be in DV format . and would probably be playable only
when transfered back to the PC.
Yes, of course you can, but you are limited to ~19½ minutes on a 4.7 Gb DVD or 37 mins on a dual layer. Render your DV avi files to this length and you can use any data file system that recognises your DVD writer. Personally, I use the data feature in DVD MF3 for this, but there are many Roxio, Nero etc utilities that'll do the same thing. I have a feeling that the CD-R feature in Win XP does not work properly with DVDs. It's a terrible gimmick anyway. On one of my 'puters, it has half-a-dozen files that it will neither record nor allow to be erased, not even when you disconnect the drive. The menu disappears, but these maverick files come back when the drive is reconnected. I've searched the registry to no avail. Bloody awful utility.
[b][i][color=red]Devil[/color][/i][/b]
[size=84]P4 Core 2 Duo 2.6 GHz/Elite NVidia NF650iSLIT-A/2 Gb dual channel FSB 1333 MHz/Gainward NVidia 7300/2 x 80 Gb, 1 x 300 Gb, 1 x 200 Gb/DVCAM DRV-1000P drive/ Pan NV-DX1&-DX100/MSP8/WS2/PI11/C3D etc.[/size]
[size=84]P4 Core 2 Duo 2.6 GHz/Elite NVidia NF650iSLIT-A/2 Gb dual channel FSB 1333 MHz/Gainward NVidia 7300/2 x 80 Gb, 1 x 300 Gb, 1 x 200 Gb/DVCAM DRV-1000P drive/ Pan NV-DX1&-DX100/MSP8/WS2/PI11/C3D etc.[/size]
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thecoalman
Just to add to the Devils post I only put about 15 minutes or so on a single DVD. DVD's are more prone to fail at the end of a burn. If your using these discs for archiving keep the original tapes, don't destroy the original footage. If the disc fails in the future it may be your only source of the original footage.
Affordanble terabyte drives should be on the consumer market within a year or two, they would be the ideal solution.
Affordanble terabyte drives should be on the consumer market within a year or two, they would be the ideal solution.
personal choice...
for me, the jury is still out regarding the backup of dv .avi's to dvd5 discs. I have done this for short videos under ~19 minutes, but my only concern is if the disc goes bad, you run the risk of losing the entire dv .avi content on that disc. If you have it on tape, a glitch or dropout in the tape isn't going to ruin the rest of the video (unless the tape goes haywire, and gets eaten up by your playback device).
But, as mentioned, you can certainly do the backups, and not filling up the entire disc is probably better to stay away from the outer edges.
btw, I also use MF3's dvd data utility.
But, as mentioned, you can certainly do the backups, and not filling up the entire disc is probably better to stay away from the outer edges.
btw, I also use MF3's dvd data utility.
George
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thecoalman
Re: personal choice...
Very true, there finding out the first commercial cd's that were made and the laser discs are now unplayable or barely playable. These were supposed to be permanent. The only thing to trust is multiple backups that you keep leapfrogging to the next best medium, I only use a DV tape once, it gets played once and then it gets archived. The best alternative is HD backup IMO, even if the drive fails physically in most cases you can still recover the material providing it wasn't corrupted when it failed. Even then partial recovery is possible. May cost you a fortune but you'll get it back.GeorgeW wrote: but my only concern is if the disc goes bad, you run the risk of losing the entire dv .avi content on that disc.
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jjoshua
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chloh
I do archive some important footage on DVD. I choose a more reliable brand at a bit more expense for this, and since the disc hardly gets played it is not likely to fail any time soon.
As preventive measures, I break the clip up into smaller chunks for safety. If any part of the disc is corrupted at least not all is lost.
However, with regards to this problem, I might add that just as what the other reply says about Tape being better, since the spoilt part can be skipped over, this can actually be done with DVD media as well. At least I have done this with CDR - using data extraction software like isobuster, which can extract sectors out of a disc even if parts of it is damaged. I have rescued video data from a CDR and edited out the bad bits, so I think the field is even in this respect. Especially since AVI files are not as fussy as compressed medium and partial files can still be played (I think).
I am wary of tape, as in my region tapes grow mouldy, get stuck, and always get eaten up by the rollers just when you need them most. I also have my original PC backed up to a Tape Drive and its practically useless now since my drive seems to jam and no one wants to repair it. It was pretty bad advice from a friend (what a friend) to get a Tape backup.
Cheers
P/S - a note of warning - backup avis on DVD will not play properly on the PC when reading direct from the disc - from my experience it hangs the system. You have to copy the files back to HD for it to play.
As preventive measures, I break the clip up into smaller chunks for safety. If any part of the disc is corrupted at least not all is lost.
However, with regards to this problem, I might add that just as what the other reply says about Tape being better, since the spoilt part can be skipped over, this can actually be done with DVD media as well. At least I have done this with CDR - using data extraction software like isobuster, which can extract sectors out of a disc even if parts of it is damaged. I have rescued video data from a CDR and edited out the bad bits, so I think the field is even in this respect. Especially since AVI files are not as fussy as compressed medium and partial files can still be played (I think).
I am wary of tape, as in my region tapes grow mouldy, get stuck, and always get eaten up by the rollers just when you need them most. I also have my original PC backed up to a Tape Drive and its practically useless now since my drive seems to jam and no one wants to repair it. It was pretty bad advice from a friend (what a friend) to get a Tape backup.
Cheers
P/S - a note of warning - backup avis on DVD will not play properly on the PC when reading direct from the disc - from my experience it hangs the system. You have to copy the files back to HD for it to play.