UVS 11.5 crashes when editing AVCHD format

[rickasaurus]

Hello,
I have recently purchased a Panasonic HDC-SD9 camcorder which uses an SD card. It uses AVCHD format.

The problem I am having is that Video Studio 11.5 Plus crashes every time I try to edit the imported m2t file on the timeline. I have read other posts but none seem to have quite the same severity of problem.

Is it unrealistic to expect to be able to edit these files with a "normal" PC? I found that if I first convert to mpeg2 using the software provided with the camera, then I can edit in UVS 11Plus normally. Am I losing the "high definition" and surround sound by doing this conversion?

thanks for any advice
Rick

[Ken Berry]

Welcome to the forum!

Thank you also for filling in your system button. At the outset, I have to say that your computer -- while a good one for virtually anything else -- is not really up to the job of dealing properly with AVCHD. I have a similar computer (P4 3 GHZ with HT, 2 GB RAM, NVidia 7600GT graphics with 512 MB RAM) which until the end of last year was my main video editing computer. With that, I could just manage to edit AVCHD files using VS11.5+, but the problem was that they would not play back smoothly. I thought this was because the editing had not worked. But when I transferred the edited files to my HP laptop which has a Core 2 Duo 2.4 GHz with 2 GHZ RAM and an NVidia 8400GS card, they played back fine. I now have a Core 2 Quad 6600 for my video editing.

Moral of the story: you really need a more powerful computer, using at least a Core 2 Duo CPU and preferably a Quad, to handle AVCHD properly.

That being said, you could try editing the original AVCHD files using VS11.5+'s Smart Proxy function. On the Edit page, above the timeline and just below the digital clock to the bottom right of the preview screen, hover your mouse over the little icons there, and you will see that one will enable Smart Proxy.

In effect, that will create a temporary standard definition version of your high def files which you can edit normally, but the edits are applied to the high def files as well. But be warned: this is not for the impatient!! It takes quite some time for the smart proxy files to be generated. And rendering a new file will take probably four or five (or more) times real time with your computer... Then, as I have already said, you may have difficulty playing the edited files back smoothly on that computer.

As for the software which came with the camera, it depends on what type of mpeg-2 the AVCHD is converted to. It could be that it is converted to high definition HDV format, which is high def mpeg-2. However, I have to quickly add that I rather doubt it, though frankly, I just don't know...

But whatever the case, AVCHD is a high def version of mpeg-4 which is of course very highly compressed. So converting it to mpeg-2 of whatever type involves uncompressing it fairly considerably and making it a much larger file. Given that any conversion program is in effect going to have to invent that extra data out of the air, and that mpegs of all kinds are classified as a lossy format, you will certainly lose quality. And I would have to add that regardless of the exact mpeg-2 format it is converted to, it probably could not be regarded any longer as true high definition video.

[Ken Berry]

rickasaurus -- Just to give you some general idea of how demanding editing high definition video in general, and dealing with AVCHD video in particular can be, I have just rendered a 4 min 24 sec high definition 1920 x 1080 mpeg-2 into 1920 x 1080 AVCHD using VS11.5+ on my Quad 6600 machine (see my System button for further details). I did no editing to the original -- simply rendered it. It took 18 minutes 5 seconds to render i.e. over 4 times real time. To render that same clip into standard definition would take under half real time using the Quad.

Then, because I didn't happen to have any other readily available AVCHD clips just at the moment that I could edit and re-render, I put my new AVCHD clip produced above into the timeline twice (i.e. giving me a total of 8 min 48 of video). I then rendered this to a new 1920 x 1090 AVCHD clip with SmartRender enabled. It took a fraction under 4 minutes i.e. less than half real time to render the new AVCHD file which of course isn't bad. And the quality looks good to my naked eye at least.

I realise this was a rather slapdash experiment. But I thought it might at least indicate what is possible with AVCHD using a relatively powerful computer!

[rickasaurus]

Ken, thanks for your fast and very comprehensive reply, and your kind welcome. I suspected that might be the answer, but was hoping it was not. I guess I have to start considering a new PC if I want to be serious about editing AVCHD.

Is your current system configuration ideal for that? If you were getting a new machine now, would you make any changes?

Thanks for the tip on Smart Proxy. I had not realised how it was used. It certainly works OK, but as you have said, it takes a lot of time to render the proxies. I just did a test of only about 30 seconds and it took a couple of minutes, so a decent size clip will be quite some time. Anyhow, at least it will get the job done until I can upgrade my computing power!
thanks again
Rick

[Ken Berry]

No -- my current Quad computer was specially built for me by a firm in Sydney as a multimedia computer, with a special emphasis on video editing, and it is only slightly over 4 months old. So no, I wouldn't make any changes... (Although I just might be tempted by the recent Quad 8800 processor!!!)

Glad to know at least Smart Proxy will help out till you make the leap!!

[rickasaurus]

Hi Jerry,

Thanks for the information on the Sony Vegas. I downloaded a trial version, but unfortunately still do not have success. It works fine on mpg and avi video files, but as soon as I try to import an m2ts file, Vegas crashes.
I am away from home this week and so using my laptop to do the test, so maybe it is not powerful enough. I will try it on my desktop when I return.

But the strnge thing for me is that I cannot even import those files. I dont get the chance to start editing. According to the software info, it claims to have added support for Panasonic AVCHD.

Perhaps Ken is right, I have to invest in more power!
Rick

[Ron P.]

Thanks for the information on the Sony Vegas. I downloaded a trial version, but unfortunately still do not have success

Thanks for adding that. I would not put much stock in Jerry's post. He is disgruntled with Corel, due to them dropping MSP. So he seems to pop in and post "advertisements" for the competitors, trying persuade others not to use Corel's products..

[rickasaurus]

Oh, MSP is being dropped? I was thinking of upgrading my MSP6.5 to MSP8, because I much prefer the facilities and interface over UVS.

Does that explain whay I cannot find anywhere on the website how to buy an upgrade?

I saw some discussion that UVS maybe upgraded to be more like MSP. Is it likely in the near future? It is important to my decision whether to persevere with Video Studio re this AVCHD issue, or look for an alternative.
thanks
Rick

[Ron P.]

Yes Corel is not going to continue developing MSP, or WS2. It would appear that they may be moving VS towards the direction of what MSP is. However that remains to be seen. According to what's been posted about VS12 (Japan), it is capable of transitions in the overlay tracks, and by sliding one clip so that it overlaps the preceeding clip, automatically creates a transition, which is exactly how MSP-8 functions.

It does not have the near the number of tracks, or the ability to use nested time-lines. I don't know if VS12 will have motion-paths, which would really help push the product. In my opinion that has been a big shortcoming of VS.

Sadly they removed the upgrade pricing from MSP, so it would appear that the only way to purchase it now, is by paying the full price. In my opinion that is very, very rude of Corel to treat existing users of their product(s). If you are real interested, you might try calling them and see if they would negotiate a deal..

MSP does not and will not support AVCHD.

[rickasaurus]

That's too bad. I really like MSP for many reasons including the ones you mentioned: moving paths, being able to overlap video clips etc., as well as additional audio overlay tracks.

One advantage I noticed with the Sony Vegas is that there is the facility to add both an additional video and audio overlay track.

Well if MSP will never have AVCHD support, then I might as well forget it as an option for me.

Is there any product which is similar to MSP? I guess I will just have to keep looking. In the meantime, it seems my best option is to continue with UVS11 and use the Smart Proxy feature to get the editing done on my AVCHD clips, and hope that the next version of UVS is a good one.

I have been using ULEAD products, both video and still for many years, and would prefer to stick with them if possible.

thanks again for all your advice.
regards,
Rick

[cplavan]

I'm having the same problem but I have a Quad 6600 with 4 gig ram and vista 32. Very frustating. Trying to edit one clip takes me 4 restarts of the program. I'm about ready to return for a refund. Any ideas?

[rickasaurus]

Does anyone know if UVS 11.5 Plus specifically has support for Panasonic version of AVCHD?

I note that Sony Vegas specifically states that the latest version now includes Panasonic AVCHD support, but UVS does not mention it.

Has anyone successfully edited Panasonic AVCHD with UVS?
Rick

[sjj1805]

cplavan
Have you installed the Vista 4GB Memory patch.

[cplavan]

Yes- I have all Vista updates

[lb44]

Congratulations on a well run and informitive forum.
I too have just tried importing Panasonic SD9 AVCHD files into VS11.5 plus (with both upgrades) and can play in "clip" mode but it staggers then fails in "project" mode.
My system: ASUS P5E-V-HDMI QuadCore M/B; Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 2.4 Ghz CPU; 4Gig DDR2 Ram; WD 500Gig HD. Vista Home Premium.
As I am using on board graphics with shared memory, would this be the problem ???. Hoping someone can comment,with thanks in advance.

My previous system P4 3.0Ghz and 2 Gig Ram; Windows Xp; could not even play clips without crashing. I feel Corel should relook at their minimum requirements for non-proxy HDV editing