Voice Synchronisation

[TAMc]

Has anyone found a reason & solution for voice sync being thrown out when editing a project by adding transitions and adjusting brightness? Re-recording from source & re-importing cures but the problem recurs. Replaying the editing clips without any effects added or adjustments made is fine.

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi

More info needed

Are you using VS 9 or the trial VS 11, it shouldn¡¦t make a difference to the problem but its nice to know.

What are the properties of the captured video? Including the audio properties.

How did you capture? if its via your disc recorder, try a firewire capture to DV-Avi

During editing did you apply ¡¥split audio¡¦?

Can we assume that audio sync¡¦ was ok before adding the transitions?

Project playback.

The problem may be only with ¡¥project¡¦ playback. You do not get the best quality when playing clips with several effects added.

Have you tried ¡¥High quality¡¦ playback or render the project and play the resultant file.

[TAMc]

I'm staying with VS9 for all mainstream work, just tinkering with 11+ now & again to see what it offers & whether the upgrade is worth the extra cost.

The clip I'm wanting to add to an earlier project is MPEG-2 Upper Field First 24 bits, 720 x 576 x 4:3, Dolby Digital Audio 48,000Hz,2/0 (L/R) 384kbps bit rate. I notice the original project - although filmed & captured in apparently the same way with same equipment, has audio properties of MPEG Audio Layer 2 files 48,000Hz 16 bit stereo.

Sadly I don't have firewire & no prospect of it just yet. The original Digital 8 footage was recorded directly onto DVD & imported into the library.

I'm not into the audio side of things at all yet, & unless I've done something unwittingly I've not used audio split.

The images & voices were & are fine on the original medium & in all sequences until the adjustments were made.

I've not tried rendering yet, but will try that & see.

Thanks Trevor.

[TAMc]

Just tried rendering but 'out of sync' remains

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi Trevor

Thanks for the info,

Does the OOS (out of sync¡¦) occur with the one video file or is it apparent with all video files.
If its just the one file then suspect a corrupt file, very difficult to prove.

If its all files then its probably a program problem.
I would suggest a ¡¥clean install¡¦ of VS 9.

When you installed VS 9 did you also install the VS 9 full patch.?

[Ken Berry]

Sadly I don't have firewire & no prospect of it just yet.

Sorry to sound harsh, because I don't really intend to be so. But you are talking about $20 for a firewire card and, if you have a free PCI slot, 2 minutes work installing it, if that...

In the meantime, you are capturing from a Digital 8 camera (and I have one which I use regularly - a Sony DCR TRV-480E) and to get the best out of it, or the best out of a mini DV camera, there is simply no -- I repeat no -- reasonable alternative to capturing via Firewire if you want to retain quality and ease of editing.

Instead, you are using a USB connection (I assume) to a DVD recorder, which will record in mpeg-2 format, which is often difficult to edit cleanly and correctly, the most common fault being out of sync audio and video. Yet now you ask us to help with exactly that problem and tell us you don't have $20 to install a firewire card? Come on!!

Adding transitions has in the past been a cause of out of sync for added audio because people don't realise that adding transitions to clips, (when background audio has already been added) because it reduces the overall time of individual clips, rather than inreasinging it. It often also interferes with sync of the original audio for no obvious reason that any of us is aware of. (Doesn't happen with DV.) But one known solution is to ensure that SmartRender is not enabled in any further renders of the project.

The problem, though, with mpeg-2 files is that re-rendering in full (i.e not using SmartRender) of mpeg files means some loss of quality which quickly becomes apparent if multiple re-renders are done.

Adding filters which change the colour or brightness balance are also known to create problems in at least the Clip or even sometimes Project mode playback, though will often not be repeated in the final render or burn to disc.

But I am afraid you need to provide more information than you have...

[TAMc]

Thanks Trevor. So far it just seems to be that one clip, which I've reloaded from source but the problem recurs. Replaying just the clip on the timeline within the project is fine, but when replayed in project the voice sync slips. I did a clean reinstall of VS9 a week ago after the new HDD was fitted but, no I didn't do the patch. I'll look into that right now.

Thanks Ken, too; I don't want to labour the explanation but it's not that simple. If - as I seem to have found out over just the past couple of days - firewire is that critrical I will do what I can to progress it. But I have my computer through a central government Home Computer Initiative & I won't own it until the end of the year. Viglen have had to take up the spare slot for a second network card due to a common fault with this motherboard & the only other space is in place of the dial-up modem; but that will need a hacksaw taking to the chassis as the bars aren't wide enough apart to plug in! Ho-hum. But what's strange to me is that these problems have come along now after a couple of years of apparently ok operating albeit with my superficial understanding of what's going on.

Thanks again, guys, & sorry to take up so much of your time.

Trevor M

[TAMc]

Well, guys, in advance of me sorting out my absence of firewire as soon as I can, having spent a lot of time trying all sorts of things I'm at a loss now to understand how it can be that a clip imported all on its own into a brand new .vsp project is fine when played as a clip, but voice sync is thrown out when played in project mode. Rendering & burning onto a disc retains the error. Happy days!

[skier-hughes]

All pci slots have the same size opening, there should be no need to get a hacksaw to the case.

I'm afraid what youa re experiencing is the "joys" of trying to edit a video file designed for viewing only.
Have you tried the same clip in the VS11 trial? Being more up to date it may handle the mpeg file better.

[TAMc]

Thanks Graham. Sadly, no different in VS11+. I'm going to try a further clean install of VS9. I know what you mean about the slots & I'm aware that some cards have horizontal ports. But the SafeCom one I got through E-buyer has a series of vertical firewire & USB2 ports & - believe me - the chassis struts physically obstruct them from being plugged into. I need to look more closely at different options.

Best wishes, Trevor

[skier-hughes]

Just looked at one, yep too big. I'd not recommend a dual usb2 / firewire card, I'd get just a firewire card.

[TAMc]

Thanks Graham. Over these past few days I've certainly been learning the truth behind the statement "you live & learn"!

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi TrevorM

Can you render the problem file again, but disable ¡¥Smart Render¡¦
Render times will be longer.

There have been similar problems in the past, and rendering without smart render has worked, although I realise that you say the OOS is apparent in the VSP stage and not just after render.

[TAMc]

Thanks Trevor, & I will try that as it would be good to get to the bottom of this. Interestingly, though, even though I need to spend more time on it & understand better, after more failed attempts last night in VS9, I did a further run through with the very same raw material on VS11+ & that time it worked. No hiccups of any nature and voice sync fine. I'm finding this all very strange but, hopefully, I'll get through this and have a better working understanding of the process. Best wishes.