Greetings,
I'm deaf and consequently, I require either subtitles or CCing to get any use of broadcast TV or DVDs.
I hoped to be able to use MovieFactory to let me clean up some of my TV recordings but immediately found that the CCing was stripped from the dvd file I would get in output. A little research explained why and I've been messing around with trying to extract the CCing and then add it back in with various other programs.
No luck so far. And the effort is time-consuming as well, requiring a lot of clean up of the .srt file before I could possibly use it.
Is there ANY way to transfer the CCing from a DVD recording when I run it throgh MovieFactory? I'm kind of stumped right now on what would be the best method to try.
Browning>>>
USA Broadcast Recording & Closed Captioning
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tg_browning
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The only way you can edit a mpeg file and a subtitle file at the sametime is loading them both in an editor and locking the tracks together (grouping).
When you trim the file the timing are different, shorter, so all the timestamps in the srt file have to be updated.
Editing a srt subtitle file isn't hard, it's just very tedious trying to make all those changes. That's a heck of alot of words.
Question:
When you import a dvd do the sub-titles import along with it?
How are you importing the media into MF6+?
Can you get any Sub-Titles at all into MF6+ that were recorded by your recorder?
When you trim the file the timing are different, shorter, so all the timestamps in the srt file have to be updated.
Editing a srt subtitle file isn't hard, it's just very tedious trying to make all those changes. That's a heck of alot of words.
Question:
When you import a dvd do the sub-titles import along with it?
How are you importing the media into MF6+?
Can you get any Sub-Titles at all into MF6+ that were recorded by your recorder?
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tg_browning
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:26 am
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Question:
When you import a dvd do the sub-titles import along with it?
How are you importing the media into MF6+?
Can you get any Sub-Titles at all into MF6+ that were recorded by your recorder?[/quote]
Have to check -- I don't have a lot of experience with MovieFactory and don't know. I don't recall seeing them, to be honest. And keep in mind, what the recorder did capture was the CCing, not true subtitles. Line 21 stuff. I'll get back to you as soon as I get a chance and thanks for the reply. Frustrating endeavor but kind of important to me.
It appears that I'm going to have to write a filter program to get rid of garbage from the extraction. Broadcast CCing seems to have quite a bit of extraneous junk in it.
Browning>>>
When you import a dvd do the sub-titles import along with it?
How are you importing the media into MF6+?
Can you get any Sub-Titles at all into MF6+ that were recorded by your recorder?[/quote]
Have to check -- I don't have a lot of experience with MovieFactory and don't know. I don't recall seeing them, to be honest. And keep in mind, what the recorder did capture was the CCing, not true subtitles. Line 21 stuff. I'll get back to you as soon as I get a chance and thanks for the reply. Frustrating endeavor but kind of important to me.
It appears that I'm going to have to write a filter program to get rid of garbage from the extraction. Broadcast CCing seems to have quite a bit of extraneous junk in it.
Browning>>>
Yes, you can open up the SRT files in any text editor and see how they are constructed. Not that hard to figure out but editing a whole session would require alot of work.
Well, maybe not. I have a feeling that maybe using VS11+ with ripple editing enabled, possilbly when you trim the video and remove commercials it will sync the subtitle tracks. Then you can export the sub-titles out to a new SRT file.
I will have to experiment will VS11+ to see if it can do this. First I'll have to see if I can actually capture the sub-titles from my dvd recorder. If not I'll have to make up my own.
I don't know what type of program your using but if capturing to a true mpeg file then another file should be captured as the sub-titles. Some programs though write the final file as a VOB container, which then includes the sub-titles. The mpg container is different from the VOB container, the VOB container can include the sub-titles. Then some of the programs may just rename the VOB to mpg. When software reads the mpg file it knows it's container is VOB and picks up on the sub-titles track.
Sorry not to be that much help. Haven't done that much with sub-titles until recently. I need to learn more about sub-titling.
Well, maybe not. I have a feeling that maybe using VS11+ with ripple editing enabled, possilbly when you trim the video and remove commercials it will sync the subtitle tracks. Then you can export the sub-titles out to a new SRT file.
I will have to experiment will VS11+ to see if it can do this. First I'll have to see if I can actually capture the sub-titles from my dvd recorder. If not I'll have to make up my own.
I don't know what type of program your using but if capturing to a true mpeg file then another file should be captured as the sub-titles. Some programs though write the final file as a VOB container, which then includes the sub-titles. The mpg container is different from the VOB container, the VOB container can include the sub-titles. Then some of the programs may just rename the VOB to mpg. When software reads the mpg file it knows it's container is VOB and picks up on the sub-titles track.
Sorry not to be that much help. Haven't done that much with sub-titles until recently. I need to learn more about sub-titling.
I don't know the answer/solution to this...
It might be easier to find a capture card/device that can record the captions as open-captions, if that's acceptable to you. If your TV has a Video Out, the captions should be present on that video... If you capture or record the composite video with captions, you will get open captions. I think my Hauppauge card can display closed captions, but I've never tried recording them. I'll give that a try this evening or weekend.
When I looked into "capturing" captions, it appeared that it would require the right hardware and some "hacker" utilities... Probably one tool for closed captions (text) and another for DVD subtitles (sub-pictures). I came to the conclusion that it would be faster & easier just to re-type the subtitles if I ever had to do it.... Assuming that I only need to do it once or twice.
I don't know what you found so-far, but there is some information that might be helpful at
VideoHelp.com. (Search the site for "captions".)
If you have contacts in the deaf community, you might ask around to see if somebody knows how to do it, or knows someone who's done it. My sister is a sign language interpreter, and I think once I asked her if she knew anybody who was capturing subtitles... I remember asking her something "technical"... but I never got an answer... I guess that means "no".
---- UPDATE ----
No luck at all with my Hauppauge card. I can't even get the captions to show-up on the screen! The user manual says your video card must have "overlay" capability, which seems to imply that the captions are only "mixed" with the video inside the video card/chip. From what I've read on the Web, there is a "hack" for capturing the captions to a text file, but out-of-the-box with the supplied software, I can't see the captions or record them as either closed or open captions... NOTHING.
While "poking around" on the Web, it looks like the ATI All-In-Wonder cards might be the best option. I'm not sure if they can record them as open or closed captions , but apparently the factory-supplied software can capture the captions and make a transcript or text file.
I played-around with my VCR to see if it could decode or record captions, but no luck with that either.
The only thing that did work was subtitles (sub-pictures) from a DVD player, captured via the Hauppauge composite (analog) input. As I expected, since these are present in the composite video-out from the DVD player, they are captured/ecorded (with the Hauppauge card) as open captions when turned-on. (The Macrovision analog copy-protection will prevent this from working with some capture cards, but apparently the Hauppauge card ingnores the Macrovision signal.)
It might be easier to find a capture card/device that can record the captions as open-captions, if that's acceptable to you. If your TV has a Video Out, the captions should be present on that video... If you capture or record the composite video with captions, you will get open captions. I think my Hauppauge card can display closed captions, but I've never tried recording them. I'll give that a try this evening or weekend.
When I looked into "capturing" captions, it appeared that it would require the right hardware and some "hacker" utilities... Probably one tool for closed captions (text) and another for DVD subtitles (sub-pictures). I came to the conclusion that it would be faster & easier just to re-type the subtitles if I ever had to do it.... Assuming that I only need to do it once or twice.
I don't know what you found so-far, but there is some information that might be helpful at
VideoHelp.com. (Search the site for "captions".)
If you have contacts in the deaf community, you might ask around to see if somebody knows how to do it, or knows someone who's done it. My sister is a sign language interpreter, and I think once I asked her if she knew anybody who was capturing subtitles... I remember asking her something "technical"... but I never got an answer... I guess that means "no".
---- UPDATE ----
No luck at all with my Hauppauge card. I can't even get the captions to show-up on the screen! The user manual says your video card must have "overlay" capability, which seems to imply that the captions are only "mixed" with the video inside the video card/chip. From what I've read on the Web, there is a "hack" for capturing the captions to a text file, but out-of-the-box with the supplied software, I can't see the captions or record them as either closed or open captions... NOTHING.
While "poking around" on the Web, it looks like the ATI All-In-Wonder cards might be the best option. I'm not sure if they can record them as open or closed captions , but apparently the factory-supplied software can capture the captions and make a transcript or text file.
I played-around with my VCR to see if it could decode or record captions, but no luck with that either.
The only thing that did work was subtitles (sub-pictures) from a DVD player, captured via the Hauppauge composite (analog) input. As I expected, since these are present in the composite video-out from the DVD player, they are captured/ecorded (with the Hauppauge card) as open captions when turned-on. (The Macrovision analog copy-protection will prevent this from working with some capture cards, but apparently the Hauppauge card ingnores the Macrovision signal.)
[size=92][i]Head over heels,
No time to think.
It's like the whole world's
Out of... sync.[/i]
- Head Over Heels, The Go-Gos.[/size]
No time to think.
It's like the whole world's
Out of... sync.[/i]
- Head Over Heels, The Go-Gos.[/size]
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tg_browning
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:26 am
- Location: United States
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Actually, you've been a lot of help. I'm unfamiliar with the VOB file structure and but did know that it varies somewhat.etech6355 wrote:Yes, you can open up the SRT files in any text editor and see how they are constructed. Not that hard to figure out but editing a whole session would require alot of work.
Sorry not to be that much help. Haven't done that much with sub-titles until recently. I need to learn more about sub-titling.
I'll have to look up the unit name and manufacturer as soon as I get a chance -- but it's a cheap DVD recorder with no TV tuner. It simply accepts input and output with no control over much of anything. And I have to say it does a nice job -- I'm not bad-mouthing it.
I wish this could be a higher priority for me, but I'm in the middle of a power struggle between Microsloth Vista and myslf over who controls my spare consumer. So far, MS is winning,unfortunately.
Browning>>>
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tg_browning
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- Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 12:26 am
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I really appreciate your work -- it's given me a few avenues to pursue. I'm afraid the avenue that would probably be the best way to go (the card) isn't possible for me, however, because I don't even HAVE a desktop PC! I only have laptops (several) and don't plan on using anything other than laptops in the foreseeable future.DVDDoug wrote:I don't know the answer/solution to this...
It might be easier to find a capture card/device that can record the captions as open-captions, if that's acceptable to you. If your TV has a Video Out, the captions should be present on that video... If you capture or record the composite video with captions, you will get open captions. I think my Hauppauge card can display closed captions, but I've never tried recording them. I'll give that a try this evening or weekend.
I had some luck with an external USB Hauptage box, but no longer have it. It was a bit dicey but after some tweaking and taking to Haupage could show CCing. Might ahve to go back to it...
In any event, the switch to digital broadcasting kind of makes CCing problematic for the future. I'm not sure what the future is going to hold for it.
Thanks -- been a big help and I'll get back to you in a bit with a progress report.
Browning>>>
A while ago, I recorded a cable broadcast (that had CC), and I was able to just transfer the CC to a dvd I authored with MF. I never had to re-render the mpegs, so that probably preserved the line-21 CC.
If you are only looking to simply add menus and cut out some scenes, then it might be possible (with the help of IFOedit) to turn on the CC flag. But if you need to re-render, then you will lose them in the original mpeg files...
Regards,
George
If you are only looking to simply add menus and cut out some scenes, then it might be possible (with the help of IFOedit) to turn on the CC flag. But if you need to re-render, then you will lose them in the original mpeg files...
Regards,
George
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tg_browning
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Thanks George. Let me see if I understand you correctly. IF one doesn't mess around with editing the file (cutting out commercials and the like) but DOES add menus, one is able to keep the CCing?GeorgeW wrote:A while ago, I recorded a cable broadcast (that had CC), and I was able to just transfer the CC to a dvd I authored with MF. I never had to re-render the mpegs, so that probably preserved the line-21 CC.
If you are only looking to simply add menus and cut out some scenes, then it might be possible (with the help of IFOedit) to turn on the CC flag. But if you need to re-render, then you will lose them in the original mpeg files...
Regards,
George
That makes sense, when I think about it and I'll give it a try. And it gives me a clue to why the CCing is getting stripped as well. The timing get completely goofed up, I imagine, and becomes just too much to handle if one does a multiple edit. I'm going to give that a try and get back to you.
Thanks,
Browning>>>