Is the MPEG-4 plugin really needed for importing .asf clips?

[ICELED]

The ulead website describes the optional MPEG-4 plug-in like this:

With the MPEG-4 Plug-in for VideoStudio 9, you can easily encode your video movies to near-DVD-quality for sharing them with family and friends.

But I don't want to output stuff in MPEG 4 fromat, I just want to take movie files already encoded in MPEG-4 format, edit them together and make normal DVDs for viewing on the majority of players.

I've got a ton of MPEG-4 codecs already in my PC and Video Studio 6 (which I'm about to upgrade) already loads and plays them, although the playback is a bit buggy.

Also, I notice on the ulead.co.uk website that the plug-in is not yet available!

[thecoalman]

But I don't want to output stuff in MPEG 4 fromat, I just want to take movie files already encoded in MPEG-4 format, edit them together and make normal DVDs for viewing on the majority of players.
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How and what are you converting them too?

When you right click on the properties of the video what are they?


The trouble your going to encounter is going to a DVD format to be playable on a standalone DVD player. The video you have differs from the type used by a regular DV cam. It is framed based, very compressed and most likely has a different framerate than either NTSC or PAL which is where the major issue is going to arise.

The reason for the mpeg4 or ASF in your case is that it compresses highly which would be required for a cam that stores video on a flash card. A few frames ov NTSC/PAL DV or MPEG would fill that card to it's max. It's also used for web based video etc. I'm sorry to tell you but what you have is a cam that produces video made for the web or computer playback it's not for DVD players or TV. It can be converted but depending on the properties of the clip can be very easy or quite a pain in the ***.

[ICELED]

OK, the .asf files are described as "Windows Media Audio/Video file" but you probably knew that already. They play OK in that application as well as DivX player. They also preview in VS6.

I've tried loading them into the latest version of GSpot but it fails to fill-in many details. It doesn't even pick up the fact that it's 640x480 resolution.

All it recognises is that it's a "video/x-ms-asf" stream, and the DirectShow rendering details returned are:

Video source type: MP4S
Audio source: DVI_ADPCM (0x0011)
Video path: (S) --> Mpeg4s Decoder DMO --> (R)
Audio path: (S) --> ACM Wrapper --> (R)

I believe the framerate is 30 fps, and the video quality is really quite good compared with MPEG-2 (both viewed on an LCD monitor via DVI and on a Panasonic 42" Plasma screen via RGB) infact viewing it on these makes it all the more tantalising. Granted the artifacts become more noticable when the subject is moving, but it's no worse than watching some Sky TV channels

I appreciate that the output will need to be transcoded to MPEG-2 when the project is to be finished for DVD, but I was hoping that the movie could be assembled using the original MPEG-4 data (~50 mins video on 512mb!) simply because I can't find a batch transcoder that handles the format in the first place (and I typically take 60 or 70 clips for a movie).

[thecoalman]

Set your project properties to match the properties of the clips. Do your edits, then go to create video and pick the NTSC/PAL DVD template. If your in PAL land your going to run into some issues because PAL is 25FPS.

Make sure you adjust the properites so it's frame based. The onlty thing is your going to have to pick a resolution, 720x480 is pretty much standard but reencoding up is not good. Try 352x480 at about 4000 VBR.

Try some experimenting with different resolutions and bitrates.

Suggest you get a RW disc and experiment with a couple of short clips first.

[ICELED]

OK thanks for your help, but...

Set your project properties to match the properties of the clips.

I can't browse to the .asf files and use them as a template because I get the error "File format mismatch" As a shot in the dark I tried browsing to a DivX movie (that I know has similar properties) with a .avi extension and got "File reading error"

So if I go to tools and set up the project properties from there which should I select as the edit file format and which codec etc?

[thecoalman]

OK thanks for your help, but...

Set your project properties to match the properties of the clips.

I can't browse to the .asf files and use them as a template because I get the error "File format mismatch" As a shot in the dark I tried browsing to a DivX movie (that I know has similar properties) with a .avi extension and got "File reading error"

So if I go to tools and set up the project properties from there which should I select as the edit file format and which codec etc?

Does it work if you change the file extension to WMV? VS might be rejecting because of the file extension.

If that works right click on one of your clips to find out the properties, write tem down and create a new template using them and WMV.

[ICELED]

VS6 Doesn't want to see .wmv files either. If I force it (by selcting All files) I get "File format mismatch error"

I get the same error if I rename it .mpg

I also tried renaming it .avi and that gave "File reading error"

[thecoalman]

VS6 Doesn't want to see .wmv files either. If I force it (by selcting All files) I get "File format mismatch error"

I get the same error if I rename it .mpg

I also tried renaming it .avi and that gave "File reading error"

You can only rename it WMV, according to the MS site WMV and ASF are suposed to be interchangeable.

Do you have the latest updates for Windows Media player.

If you can post a short clip somehwhere I'll take a look at it, or PM me and I'll give you a e-mail address to send it to.besides that I don't know what to tell you.

[thecoalman]

Try this tool: http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=ASFTools

The comments below it vary as to it's effectiveness.

[ICELED]

Thanks for the link, I tried that ASF tool but it would not 'repair' the files or do anything else useful. It would Re-encode the files, but not convert to .avi

Here is a typical file (~700Kb) incase you or anyone else is kind enough to take a look at it for me:

http://www.iceled.co.uk/images/mip/foru ... AG0077.ASF

It would be a great help if someone with VS9 and the MPEG-4 plugin could try using it on this before I buy the upgrade.

[thecoalman]

I don't know what your doing or what the problem is. I suspect you either don't have the latest version of the Windows codecs or something along those lines, if you don't have the latest update for windows media player get it. You may also want to install the windows media encoder.... I think I suggested both before either here or in the other thread. Anyhow I had no trouble importing the video into VS7 SE and creating a MPEG2 with it... Complete with 3 clips and transitions.

I did nothing special, I opened up VS dragged the video onto the timeline in three spots, dropped some transitions between them and used the NTSC DVD template. I may have changed the frame type to frame but that wouldn't make a difference anyway in being able to create it...I forget.

http://www.nepadigital.com/temp/test.mpg 9MB

BTW it appears your video is 10 fps 640x480 and about 1500kbps. The video above is DVD compliant, how well thw audio is synced is another story.

Edit: I just tried the DL an it appears the audio is FUBAR'd. Not sure why could have sworn it worked the first time.

[ICELED]

I don't know what your doing or what the problem is. I suspect you either don't have the latest version of the Windows codecs or something along those lines, if you don't have the latest update for windows media player get it. You may also want to install the windows media encoder.... I think I suggested both before either here or in the other thread.

I ran windows update again, and installed media encoder without any joy.

Anyhow I had no trouble importing the video into VS7 SE and creating a MPEG2 with it... Complete with 3 clips and transitions.

Thanks for trying it. I assume you couldn't get VS to use the .asf file as a template for the project properties?

I did nothing special, I opened up VS dragged the video onto the timeline in three spots, dropped some transitions between them and used the NTSC DVD template. I may have changed the frame type to frame but that wouldn't make a difference anyway in being able to create it...I forget.

I can drag the files to the timeline and play them individually, but if I attempt to perform a high quality preview or save the movie in any format I get a still image for the duration of each clip (and distorted sound).

I've been examining the codecs installed on my PC using a handy little program called MMCompView and it's scary how many codecs show up (around 250). The program allows them to be selectively disabled, so out of curiosity I disabled them all and tried opening a .asf file in Windows Media player. It complained that it couldn't find an audio codec, so by trial and error I finally re-enabled just one (Microsoft IMA APCM Codec for MSACM) and tried again expecting it to complain that there wasn't a video codec... but it played the clip instead! So Ive got just one audio codec enabled, but Windows media player plays the audio and the video OK

I've aslo tried using AsfTools to convert/join/repair the files, but it fails to perform any of the operations successfully. I've run out of tools (even Gspot is at a loss to analyse the files). Given the number of Mustek DV x0000 series video cameras that must be out there, surely I can't be the only one facing this brick-wall?

One obvious question is -- do you have the MPEG-4 plugin for your copy of VS7SE? I'm guessing you don't. Do you feel confident that it would solve the problems I face if I were to buy it?

[thecoalman]

Thanks for trying it. I assume you couldn't get VS to use the .asf file as a template for the project properties?

Nope all I did was use a regular template, and is obviuosly destroying the audio. It just puts three frames in a row to create a 30fps video. Apparently it's not stretching or not converting it properly.

One obvious question is -- do you have the MPEG-4 plugin for your copy of VS7SE? I'm guessing you don't. Do you feel confident that it would solve the problems I face if I were to buy it?

No I don't but I don't think that will make a difference.

One question?

If you connect the cam and open up VS does it recognize it as a capture device? If so maybe you can capture the footage as opposed to copying it. Perhaps my initial advice was wrong (which goes against everthing I know) and you need to stream the video to VS to capture it.

Makes no sense since you would be in affect copying the footage to VS but converting it on the fly....but perhaps it might work.

You may want to try asking your question over at www.videohelp.com There is a much larger member base there and I wouldn't doubt that there is numerous people there with some knowledge about this.

[ICELED]

A quick update on this problem. I've found that "Windows Movie Maker" (part of XP) flawlessly accepts and edits the .ASF MPEG-4 files produced by my videocamera

I suppose that this is the OS the camera equipment manufacturers are aiming at. Whatever logic lies behind it ought to apply to the developers of alternative editing software like Pinnacle and Ulead as well.

I'm still waiting for the demo version to be available for download, but even then without the MPEG-4 upgrade I probably won't know if it will all work out. For £55 I might as well buy XP and dual-boot it on my W2K machine. It'll be frustrating though because I hate M$ with a passion.

[thecoalman]

A quick update on this problem. I've found that "Windows Movie Maker" (part of XP) flawlessly accepts and edits the .ASF MPEG-4 files produced by my videocamera

Well tht makes sense, asf is a MS format. Have you tried exporting it from MM into another format to edit in VS?