VS10 Jumpy DVD's (HDV > Std Def MPEG2 Downconvert) - Why?

[Globorover]

Hello to all,

I've been reading around in this excellent forum for a couple of months now and despite some serious searches have not found a solution to an issue I'm experiencing with VideoStudio 10 Plus with SP1.

I'm working (for nothing!....hard!!!) on a charity film (new tourist DVD) for my local cathedral and have been editing Sony HC1 & V1E PAL HDV files (mt2 I think they are) and can create really beautiful edited footage which I can view in high definition on my PC no problem, excellent definition and nice smooth action.

Whenever I downconvert the files to MPEG2 (typically 8000 kbps VBR, 2 pass encode, quality slider set to 100%) I always get a stepping/jittery movement in things like cars driving past, people walking or any kind of slow panning or zooming in the finished DVD in all the players/PC's in my house and others. However, the downconverted file (i.e. standard definition) will play beautifully on my PC, no "stepping" or jerky movements.

I've played around with different DVD encoding/burning quality settings (70 to 100%), tried 6000-9000 kbps etc. but it seems (to me) that the conversion from the file on my computer (that play just fine) to the file on my burnt DVD is where the problem is.

I've read a lot on here about HDV GOP's being long and the possibility of increasing the number of I Frames from 12 to 6 etc. in one thread by getting into the hidden advanced settings but I wondered if there is something much more simple that I'm missing.

I will add that when I downconvert Upper Field First mt2 MPEG files to the lower quality standard definition I keep the same UFF (I've also tried Frame based - no improvement.) I've also been following the excellent info in http://www.hd-video-editing.com/HDTutorial_Page1.html

If anyone can make any helpful suggestions I'd love to hear them. Right now I'm trying the silly way of solving it (well seems that way to me but hopefully it will work! ). This is again something I learnt from this excellent forum - I'm exporting my fully edited HD file back from VS10+ to my HDV Camera and then I'll re-import it from camera with iLink conversion on (HDV to DV) and with that (AVI) file I'll then go through the steps to burn a DVD and hopefully get smooth motions/actions....it's just that it takes forever.

I should add that if I do downconversion of any of our work to DV I can edit and burn excellent DVD's...but the thing is we want to produce a "stunning masterpiece" finished file in High Def for ultimate sale in the cathedral shop as a HD-DVD or BD-DVD and then simply convert that "masterpiece" to normal DVD (where I imagine the bulk of the sales/profit will come from.)

Seriously considering buying Sony Vegas 7 + DVD Architect 4 (or maybe Vegas 8 Pro) so any comments on whether or not that has a better encoder etc. would also be welcome.

Many Thanks in advance.

[etech6355]

Hi,
I found that using VS10+ to work with the video as HighDefinition it works well.
As far as downconverting to Standard Definition it's all in the software.
Sometimes after making the encoding parameters I've found they may not have taken. In the options screen when you make changes under the compression tab it may flip the fielding back to frame based.
To double check that the dvd having this problem are fielded correctly you can use the Import from DVD/-VR funcion in VS. After the file is extracted to the harddisk insert it on the timeline and check it's fielding properties & everything.

I think my conversions didn't come out well either going from 1440HD to 720SD.

Seriously considering buying Sony Vegas 7 + DVD Architect 4 (or maybe Vegas 8 Pro) so any comments on whether or not that has a better encoder etc. would also be welcome.

That will be a learning durve.

There has been a new patch for VS10+ that applies to HD-DVD burning. It's on the ulead website. You can burn harddisk folders with it now, some other features in the burning module.

[Globorover]

etech6355,

Thankyou for your reply. I made some significant progress with this on Friday night by completely removing (using tips learnt on here) and resinstalling VS 10 Plus, the HDV Plug-in and the SP1 update patch. More details in the link to a thread I had going on this in a related forum.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=105442

I think I've seen this "automatic changing" of settings, field order etc. you mention as well - and always thought it was something I was doing wrong so it's really useful to know that! (and your other suggestions.)

Thanks again for you reply - it's much appreciated!

[etech6355]

It doesn't hurt to re-install VS10+ again, patch SP1, & don't forget the other latest update for HD-DVD burning. It's also related to HDV video.

As far as field order goes I would simply import the dvd. If it's fielded upper field first then its' correct. That would mean a bad software conversion.
But the settings I was speaking about can be double checked before exporting, just go back into the option module again or project settings. It's wouldn't call this a bug, the program is just picky about making settings.

I've read a lot on here about HDV GOP's being long and the possibility of increasing the number of I Frames from 12 to 6 etc. in one thread by getting into the hidden advanced settings but I wondered if there is something much more simple that I'm missing.

Most of the HDV GOP things you read on the web is someone else's ideas or interpretations on why the software isn't converting correctly. The bottom line is if all your settings are correct to export to and the video doesn't come out right then the software you using isn't cutting the dice.
Import your dvd, if the properties of the imported mpeg2 file are correct then try it again once more, if that fails then the software isn't converting properly for you. I read your first post, can't see where you made any mistakes with the settings except maybe you didn't have your project settings equal to your source video settings. Also under "Preferences" make sure the Quality is set to BEST, the default is GOOD.

I'd like to note one thing, after you insert your hd-mpeg2 file on the timeline your "Project Settings" need to be equal to the source video. So make sure your source videos are correct and fielded as UFF (upper field first), 25MBS constant bit rate etc. Your project settings should be equal to this (the source videos settings).
Then when you "Share -> Create Video File -> Customize -> Options" you set the parameters manually, or you can make a custom template up ahead of time and then "Share -> Create Video File -> Your-Custom-Template"

I know that VS10+ works great editing & exporting HDV to HDV again, or converting to a Divx file / windows wmv file, those are still high definition files with the same frame size.
VS11+ doesn't downconvert that great either. Hopefully the next patch release will fix these issues.

[Globorover]

Hi,

Just to let everyone know the outcome on this thread. Basically, I bit the bullet and bought Sony Vegas 7 and now can edit HD (and downconvert to normal Std. Def DVD's) with ease. I'm really pleased with the software and the results.

More information on the steps I took with VS10 Plus to get to this solution in this thread for those that are interested.

Thanks again for the comments and helpful suggestions.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.p ... post769329