Best DVD Capture Software?

[riw]

I notice that when I capture off DVDs recorded on my camcorder, the resulting mpg doesn't look nearly as nice as the original, playing directly off the DVD. What's the best process for capturing stuff so it actually turns out with good quality. Space isn't really an issue, but when I burn a project with home videos on it, I want to be as close to original quality as I can.

I don't see any setting for the quality of the capture when I choose "import...." Is there any other software folks are using to get a good import?

Thanks!

Russ

[Ken Berry]

As far as I was aware, the import from DVD feature in Video Studio is a direct digital transfer of the video in exactly the same format and quality as it is in on the DVD itself.

If you are talking about it looking poor in the Video Studio preview screen, then just remember that the screen is not supposed to be anything more than a rough and ready guide to what is in the video. In other words, it never gives high quality playback (even when set to that!) Have you tried playing the imported video back in a proper software DVD player package like WinDVD or PowerDVD?

If you are talking about imported video which you have subsequently edited and re-converted back into another DVD and used different properties from the original, then you will have suffered at least one generation's loss of quality since you are dealing with lossy mpeg-2 files.

[riw]

As far as I was aware, the import from DVD feature in Video Studio is a direct digital transfer of the video in exactly the same format and quality as it is in on the DVD itself.

When you import from a DVD, it converts the video to mpg format, I think mpeg2, but there aren't any options, so I'm not certain.

If you are talking about it looking poor in the Video Studio preview screen, then just remember that the screen is not supposed to be anything more than a rough and ready guide to what is in the video. In other words, it never gives high quality playback (even when set to that!) Have you tried playing the imported video back in a proper software DVD player package like WinDVD or PowerDVD?

What I did was to import using VideoStudio, and then play the files directly from jetaudio and windows media player, then compared it to playing the VOB files directly. The mpg looks much grainier, and the colors aren't as clear. Once I've taken these imported mpg's and pushed them to a dvd, I'm certain they won't look as nice as the originals.

I don't see any way for VideoStudio to open the recorded VOB directly? I wish I could figure out how to trim the VOB directly, then I would post a small part of the VOB, and the imported VideoStudio files, so you could see the difference. I did try a couple of other converters, with the same results--I think the mpg algorithm is just very lossy, and I'm also wondering what's the "least lossy" type of file VideoStudio can read directly and insert into projects....



Russ

[Ken Berry]

When you import from a DVD, it converts the video to mpg format, I think mpeg2

You miss the point that the .vob files that you are importing are, in fact, mpeg-2 files just with a different extension. In that sense, there is no 'conversion' in the sense of a rendering which causes loss of quality. When I import from a DVD, I get the same quality as on the DVD, and I have done this quite a few times with no special settings. The only thing I make sure of is that, in re-using those files in a new project, I main all their properties. They can thus be SmartRendered with the only loss of quality being the edited parts.

You don't say which version of Video Studio you are using. VS10 is the only one which allowed direct insertion of .vob files into the timeline for editing. For some silly reason, this was not continued in VS11.

[riw]

When you import from a DVD, it converts the video to mpg format, I think mpeg2

You miss the point that the .vob files that you are importing are, in fact, mpeg-2 files just with a different extension.

Hmmm... This is what I'm doing:

1. Take mini-dv out of my camcorder (Sony DVD508).
2. Put it in my dvd drive.
3. Play it on WMP and/or Jetaudio.
4. Go into VS.
5. Select "capture," then "import," then select the DVD.
6. Select the chapter I want to grab.
7. Import.
8. Dump out of VS.
9. Play the imported video in either JA or WMP, to see how it came out.

And the results are grainy--they look much worse than the original dvd out of the camcorder.

Take a look at:

http://www.riw.us/temp/uvs070817_173916~0.mpg

This doesn't look nearly as good as copying the .vob file to my hard drive directly and playing it with WMP, or JA, or just playing it from the DVD itself.

You don't say which version of Video Studio you are using. VS10 is the only one which allowed direct insertion of .vob files into the timeline for editing. For some silly reason, this was not continued in VS11.

VS11, with all the latest patches.



Russ

[Ken Berry]

Sorry but I couldn't play that file. It downloaded into QuickTime, but when it finished downloaded, QuickTime just displayed a big '?'.

Anyway, can you try another experiment. Just copy one of the .vob files to your hard drive using Windows, then change the extension of the file from .vob to .mpg Open that file in Video Studio and see what the quality is like that way.

[riw]

Sorry but I couldn't play that file. It downloaded into QuickTime, but when it finished downloaded, QuickTime just displayed a big '?'.

Anyway, can you try another experiment. Just copy one of the .vob files to your hard drive using Windows, then change the extension of the file from .vob to .mpg Open that file in Video Studio and see what the quality is like that way.

It looks pretty bad that way, too--but, it looks like it's interpolating it into 4:3 format, while the video is actually shot in 16:9. When I import it through VS11, I find that it's still in 16:9. How can I force WMP to show it in 16:9? I poked around for a bit, and didn't see any settings for it?

I did put a video sniffer on the two files, and the differences are:

VOB: 720x480, 9100 bitrate
VS11 File: 720x288, 600 bitrate

I think the differences in pixel sizes are probably because of the 16:9 processing (?)... What's the correct 16:9 size? When I convert in Axara, it wants 720x400, so I don't know what the real size should be. I know that if you change it from the original, it's going to cause a lot of artifact..... I assume going from a 9100 bitrate to a 600 bitrate would also introduce a lot of artifacts, while making the file a lot smaller?

Is there any way to change the bitrate VS11 uses when it's importing?



Russ

[etech6355]

When you import from the dvd it's a file copy/extraction. The video isn't being re-encoded.
After you import the video from the dvd and return back to the timeline "Right_Click" on the video and select "Media Properties". The properties of the video will be displayed.
Can you post these properties back to this thread?
For NTSC they should be :
720x480, 16:9, 29.97fps
Upper Field First
Usually Dolby Audio 2/0 or 5.1
Video Bit Rate = xxxx (usually about 9100kbs or higher for HQ (high_quality) setting from your camcorder.

[riw]

When you import from the dvd it's a file copy/extraction. The video isn't being re-encoded.
For NTSC they should be :
720x480, 16:9, 29.97fps
Upper Field First
Usually Dolby Audio 2/0 or 5.1
Video Bit Rate = xxxx (usually about 9100kbs or higher for HQ (high_quality) setting from your camcorder.

It certainly looks like it's being re-encoded. I posted the resolution and bit rate above. Both have the same frame rate, but the original has a bitrate of 9100, while the VS11 file has a bitrate of 600--a dramatic difference.



Russ

[Ron P.]

I'd say the Project Properties in VS are what you posted. VS does not just recode the video file while it is being inserted. If your project properties are different then that of your video clips, then VS will recode your clip to that of your project settings, only when you tell it to (share>create video file) .

Can you post the Video Properties please?

[riw]

I'd say the Project Properties in VS are what you posted. VS does not just recode the video file while it is being inserted. If your project properties are different then that of your video clips, then VS will recode your clip to that of your project settings, only when you tell it to (share>create video file) .

Can you post the Video Properties please?

I'd say you're wrong. I looked at the two files using a third party video properties sniffer, and the one has a bit rate of 9100, while the other has a variable bit rate of 600-9100. I've also done another experiment: I've converted the video using VS11, and I've converted it using Axaras video converter (which takes about an hour, btw). I've put all three on screen using WMP, latest version, and there's a clear degradation in the VS11 converted file. The skin tones have the same effect as if you took a picture in Photopaint, and cut the color depth from 16 bit to 8 bit--you can see individual pixels of color, where it's trying to dither out the original color as closely as it can.

Further, the file sizes are dramatically different--about 1GB for both the original VOB, and the filed converted in Axaras, and about 200MB for the file converted in VS11. I know the quality difference is enough that my wife walked by while I was watching the video in WMP, and said it looks horrible--she didn't want that video included in the family video for this year. I showed her the others, and she said: "Let's go buy another camera, that one stinks."

Now, since no-one believes there is a major quality difference, I suppose I should just drop this part of the question.

At any rate, I have two more questions perhaps someone here _can_ answer:

1. If you select specific chapters to be imported, rather than the entire video, will it import differently? IE, if I select the entire disk to be imported, will it do something different than if I select some chapters, and not others?

2. Why will VS11 not take the video out of a folder on my HD? Why do I need to burn it to a DVD-R before it will see the VOB and import it? I've tried selecting the folder with the vob in it in the import process, but the "import" button stays greyed out.

Thanks.

Russ

[Ron P.]

2. Why will VS11 not take the video out of a folder on my HD? Why do I need to burn it to a DVD-R before it will see the VOB and import it? I've tried selecting the folder with the vob in it in the import process, but the "import" button stays greyed out.

You need to place a check in the box beside the title or chapter, located in the left pane. Placing a check in the Title will also select all the chapters within that title.

I'd say you're wrong. I looked at the two files using a third party video properties sniffer

What "third party properties sniffer" are you using?

[riw]

I'd say the Project Properties in VS are what you posted. VS does not just recode the video file while it is being inserted. If your project properties are different then that of your video clips, then VS will recode your clip to that of your project settings, only when you tell it to (share>create video file) .

Can you post the Video Properties please?

BTW, I have a suspicion as to the problem, but I'm not certain. What I think is that VS11 doesn't know how to handle 16:9 non-HD content off the video camera well. What appears to be happening is that VS11 is recoding the content to 4:3, and then back to 16:9, or some such. The effect I'm seeing is the same as the one I see when I simply rename the file to .mpg and play it--when I do this, it always plays in 4:3, and it looks horrible. I've told VS11 the project is a 16:9, but it apparently thinks the input is 4:3, so it's trying to recode it.

I think this is also the reason the resolution appears to be messed up--the original is 720x480, but the imported VS11 file is 720x288. I don't know what the actual resolution for 16:9 is, but I don't think 720x288 is it.

Russ

[riw]

2. Why will VS11 not take the video out of a folder on my HD? Why do I need to burn it to a DVD-R before it will see the VOB and import it? I've tried selecting the folder with the vob in it in the import process, but the "import" button stays greyed out.

You need to place a check in the box beside the title or chapter, located in the left pane. Placing a check in the Title will also select all the chapters within that title.

The import button is greyed out, so there's no check boxes to check. In other words, when you go to import, there's a dialog box. I select "import folder" (I can't remember exactly what the words are there), which launches a file browser. I select the folder the VOB is in, and the import button stays grey. It won't let me see what's inside the folders, nor will it let me open the folder for import.

When I burn the folder to a DVD-R, it recognizes the DVD as a video, and opens the screen with the checkboxes for each chapter on the video.

What "third party properties sniffer" are you using?

Various. At this point, I'm using the info from Axara Video Converter.

Russ

[lazael]

Hmmm... This is what I'm doing:
1. Take mini-dv out of my camcorder (Sony DVD508).
2. Put it in my dvd drive.
3. Play it on WMP and/or Jetaudio.
4. Go into VS.
5. Select "capture," then "import," then select the DVD.
6. Select the chapter I want to grab.
7. Import.
8. Dump out of VS.
9. Play the imported video in either JA or WMP, to see how it came out.

And the results are grainy--they look much worse than the original dvd out of the camcorder.
VS11, with all the latest patches.

How about rather doing this in VS11 directly :
1. Movie Wizard
2. Insert DVD/DVD-R to add video from disc or hard-drive.