VideoStudio 11 Plus: AVCHD Motion Artifacting?

[Jerry Jones]

I see the classic, fluttering double-image on objects in motion when I play the HD MPEG-2 files rendered from AVCHD .M2T files in VideoStudio 11 Plus

VideoStudio 11 Plus provides no field/frame information for these .M2T files.

Vegas claims they are "upper field first."

Why does Ulead VideoStudio 11 Plus specify "lower field first" for "HD DVD" template output?

No matter which field choice I choose, I see the motion artifacting when playing from VideoStudio 11 Plus.

In addition, when I use the Sony "Picture Motion Browser" software that ships with the HDR-UX1, I can play the clips the software captures as .M2TS and I see much better edges on objects in motion. ***Why?***

Mysteries!

Jerry Jones
http://www.jonesgroup.net

[mlai]

Myself and several others have experienced the same problem on VS11+ with AVCHD devices as you have. We are speculating that the VS11+ does not read the interlace information from the AVCHD devices (or the M2T files) correctly.

I myself has filed a problem with the Ulead support on this and has received no response so far. On the other hand, if I do the same with Nero Vision (Nero 7), everything seems to be fine and quality is currently higher than VS11+. Nero Vision, however, can only render to either MP4 AVC (which is has poor 5.1 audio) or to mpeg2 hd which only has stereo audio. So you will lose the 5.1 audio from the AVCHD devices......

But then again, VS11+ also refuses to export anything to Dolby 5.1 unless we specify NTSC/PAL DVD format, which obviously is not HD......

[markk655]

mlai,

Well worded and very succinct. I can confirm that I see similar issues with files imported from my HDC-SD1

[Jerry Jones]

Well, I need a reference file for comparison.

There's no question the transport stream files (.M2T/.M2TS) -- during playback -- seem to exhbit a cleaner look on the edges of moving objects.

But perhaps I'm just seeing normal MPEG-2 long GOP artifacting when I play back the program stream "HD DVD" MPEG-2 files that I create using the VideoStudio 11 Plus templates.

I'd like to compare program stream playback from other programs to the program stream playback that I have here.

If there's better performance by the MPEGs created in other programs, then I think I'd be more certain that this is a genuine MPEG encoding "bug."

If it is a bug, then I'm going to be upset.

Because this is the basic quality control stuff that needs to be caught prior to the release of a product and not after.

Jerry Jones
http://www.jonesgroup.net

[etech6355]

But perhaps I'm just seeing normal MPEG-2 long GOP artifacting when I play back the program stream "HD DVD" MPEG-2 files that I create using the VideoStudio 11 Plus templates.

No, normal Mpeg2 long GOP artifacting is very hard to pick out IF your playing back the hd-mpeg2 video on HD compliant hardware.
The Sony cams that record in hd-mpeg2 tape transport record great smooth motion video when played back on hd compliant video devices (external & computer videocard plus hd certified software player such as PowerDVD7_Deluxe or Ultra). If your questioning the quality of motion and resolution of the hd-mpeg2 video don't bother. When done correctly it's really excellent. Most Blu-Ray HD movies are Hd-mpeg2 variable bit rate.

My conclusion is that VS11+ isn't reading these files correctly.
VS11+ isn't reading any TS stream formatted video, either avchd or hd-mpeg2. VS10+ Does and MF5+ does and converts these files from TS to PS format for me.

As far as I can tell it doesn't matter what field you select as the output, the source is being interpreted as frame_based therefore when encoded the upper or lower fields are the same. You might as well render the video frame-based.
But in VS11+ I can't work with any TS stream format.
VS11+ write back to tape also doesn't work correctly.
VS10+ does.

I also think that if I render a avchd file to hd-mpeg2 @18000kbs VBR using 100% compression and "Disable" Smartrender the quality of the video is much better then with smartrender turned ON. Yes, the motion is still wrong but when there isn't any motion the hd-mpeg2 file looks like the original.

Also, when converting avchd to hd-mpeg2 the HD-DVD settings don't appear to be for this conversion. If your source is hd-mpeg2 then the fielding comes out correctly when using the template AND also you need to have the "Mpeg Optimizer" checked On under Perferences.

To convert your video to 5.1 audio you would do this in the "Project Burning Module". Share -> Create Disk

[Jerry Jones]

My conclusion is that VS11+ isn't reading these files correctly. Also, when converting avchd to hd-mpeg2 the HD-DVD settings don't appear to be for this conversion. If your source is hd-mpeg2 then the fielding comes out correctly when using the template AND also you need to have the "Mpeg Optimizer" checked On under Perferences.

You may be right.

Perhaps it is a rather severe product bug; I'll be doing more testing in the days ahead.

And what's with these confusing HD output templates with no documentation?

This seems to be the worst technical documentation performance I've ever seen from the Ulead team when it comes to a new software release such as this.

It's like somebody in Taipei turned out the lights and went home before this product was ready.

It's just an astonishing disappointment.

I'm thinking about writing a letter to Mr. Dobson at Corel.

Jerry Jones
http://www.jonesgroup.net

[etech6355]

Perhaps it is a rather severe product bug; I'll be doing more testing in the days ahead. And what's with these confusing HD output templates with no documentation?

I don't think this is a severe product bug, because it's a template that's changes. I think they intend for you to be using the HDV - HDV (For PC).
This template has all the correct settings and retains them.
The HDV - HDV (other one - top choice) creates a TS (transport stream) file.
The lower one (pc) creates a PS file.
When I use the HDV - (for PC) rendering and edited hd-mpeg2 PS file everything works nice. Same with the HD HD-DVD 1440 IF my source is hd-mpeg2 UFF. (the templates changes to reflect these settings).
Program stream video doesn't appear to have any issues. Only the TS format. Which happens to be a new format in VS, previous versions didn't support this format.
After they fix the fielding issue I think we will see a world of a difference in both the avchd and hd-mpeg2 conversions.

So far I've only found 1 issue which is the TS stream format. This also affects the HD writing back to tape problem.

[Jerry Jones]

I don't think this is a severe product bug

Well, I'm talking about the fields issue.

I believe that -- indeed -- may be a product bug that falls into the severe category.

Jerry Jones
http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Jerry Jones]

I think they intend for you to be using the HDV - HDV (For PC).

Well, that's nice that you "think" that.

I'm serious.

Any way you slice it, this seems to be a severe lack of documentation that does nothing but lead to confusion.

These settings desperately need further explanation in the HELP files or the manual, at the very least.

Sorry I'm angry about all of this, but I think Ulead has really dropped the ball on a number of issues with this release.

Jerry Jones
http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Jerry Jones]

After they fix the fielding issue...

Do you know if they're even aware of this issue?

Jerry Jones
http://www.jonesgroup.net