[VS 11+] MPEG2 vs. PAL DVD or MPEG2 as file format

[turtle]

Hello, I've a problem in VS 11+ (German) creating a file with MPEG2 as the file format. Every time I want to make such a file a file with the file format PAL DVD is the result

1. Source:
Program: VideoStudio 11 Plus (GERMAN)
Source File: Movie as MPEG2-File (recorded with PCI-TV-card)
Video:
File format: MPEG2
Video type: MPEG2, Upper field first
Video size: 4:3 - 720 x 576 (PAL-Standard)
Frame rate: 25.00 frames / sec
Data rate: Variable (Max. 4038kbps)
Audio:
Audio type: MPEG2 Audio
Properties: 48000Hz, 16 Bit, Stereo
Bit rate: 192 kbps

2. Project-settings:
MPEG-Files
I manually set the project-settings to be the same as the source:
Video:
File format: MPEG2
Video type: MPEG2, Upper field first
Video size: 4:3 - 720 x 576 (PAL-Standard)
Frame rate: 25.00 frames / sec
Data rate: Variable (Max. 4038kbps)
Audio:
Audio type: MPEG2 Audio
Properties: 48000Hz, 16 Bit, Stereo
Bit rate: 192 kbps

3. Creating a MPEG-2 File (NOT PAL DVD)
I tried every possible share settings (file format: MPEG2) to create a file that is like the source file (File format: MPEG2 - NOT PAL DVD):
Tested share settings:
- Same as project-settings (result: PAL DVD)
- Same as first video (result: PAL DVD)
- MPEG-Optimizer (result: PAL DVD)
- PAL MPEG2 (result: PAL DVD)
- Custom (with same settings as source) (result: PAL DVD)

So, it seems to me that's only possible to create a file with the following properties:
file format: PAL DVD
video type: MPEG2

Creating a file with
file format: MPEG2 and
video type: MPEG2
seems to be NOT POSSIBLE.

I hope that someone can help me with this problem.
Otherwise I will go back to VideoStudio 9 or 10

[Ken Berry]

I am not sure what your problem is. I realise you want the new file you create to be called PAL MPEG2 by VS11. But why does it matters so much?

In reality, the original video file/format you captured, and the project properties you used, ARE in fact PAL DVD compliant, and that is something you cannot change. As far as I was aware, the program would only call a file PAL MPEG-2 if it were not fully DVD compliant. In that sense, it is rather like connecting a mini DV camera to your computer by firewire, and trying to set the capture format to AVI instead of DV (which is a variety of AVI). The program automatically resets itself to 'DV' as the capture format.

And at the end of the day, I have to ask: why does it matter. If you are going to burn it to DVD, then you need a PAL DVD-compliant file, and you have it.

If you are going to do something else with it, it is largely irrelevant what the program calls your file. If you are, for instance, going to produce an SVCD from it, it will need to be converted to a PAL SVCD compliant file before you can do so.

If you only intend to play it on your computer, then it does not matter at all whether the program calls it PAL DVD or PAL MPEG-2...

But maybe I have missed something...???

You also don't need to manually set the project properties to match the captured video properties. This can be done automatically. In File > Preferences > General, check the box beside 'Show message when inserting first video in timeline' (or its German equivalent). Then, when you next insert a new video in the timeline, a box will appear asking if you want to have the project properties match those of the first video. Select OK.

[turtle]

Thanks for your quick answer and the advice in the last part of your answer.
Okay why does it matter that much you were asking.
The answer is that VS 11+ always creates / renders the movie to a file or to a dvd in half-real time.
For example: A 90 minutes movie takes 180 minutes.
I don't know why it doesn't use the smart renderer (like in VS 9 or 10)
By the way: I tested it with same file (and settings) I've once created a mpeg2 and dvd in VS 9 and VS 10. (Since VS 7 I test the renderer, the dvd creation etc. with the same file and settings.)
I could hit myself that I forget to test it in the trial of VS 11
In VS 9 and VS 10 it was using the smart renderer and it took not hours to create the movie. And because of the fact that my job eats up most of my time and my hard drive is full of movies (about 400GB) I need a quick and reliable program / renderer.
And how ever I found out that if I add a movie with file format: PAL DVD to the dvd creation it uses the smart renderer when the dvd is created.
But the problem is that the preview window doesn't show me anything.
If I play the video or not doesn't matter. It doesn't show me anything.
And the settings are on preview window!
(and NOT on the default: dual head device)
But If I add an uncut (with advertisement) movie file with the file format mpeg2 I can see anything (and create chapters for the dvd).
I don't know what causes this strange behaviors.
Before I installed VS 11+, I've installed a clean windows (after 18 month the old windows installation had some strange bugs) about a few days ago.
Hope you now understand why it matters.
And I think I will remove VS 11+, clean up the hard disk from any VS 11 files, use a registry cleaner for removing VS 11+ entries, bring it back to the store I bought it and switch then back to VS 9 or 10.
VS 9 and 10 had some bugs too, but with these bugs I could live.
With the bugs (or strange behaviors) in VS 11+ I can't live.

[turtle]

-> I solved my problem.
And how did i solve it ?
With DVD MovieFactory 6 (and VideoStudio 11+).
With a combination of DVD MovieFactory 6 (current a trial - but only until I'm going to leave the store tomorrow ) and my already bought VideoStudio 11 (I gave the program a second chance ) it's now possible for me to create a dvd as quick as with VS 10 or VS 9.
First I create a PAL DVD file with VS 11+.
Sometimes I've to quit and restart VS 11+ several times that it's using the smart renderer when I want to create a PAL DVD file (I know that this is a really strange behavior).
Then I open the file with DVD MovieFactory 6 (add chapters etc.) and burn it (create a dvd folder). The great thing is that DVD MF 6 is using the smart renderer and it shows me anything .
But I still don't know what causes the strange behaviors in VS 11+
But anyhow I found a way now to create a movie with the best and newest "easiest to handle" products on the market

[etech6355]

Turtle,
You said that VS11+ was taking longer to render.

The answer is that VS 11+ always creates / renders the movie to a file or to a dvd in half-real time. For example: A 90 minutes movie takes 180 minutes.

I don't understand, how is MF6+ helping when your still using VS11+ to create a new video file that you said takes about 3 times longer to create.

Unless your speaking about the "Project Dvd Burning Module" in VS11+ for creating the dvd, and that module it re-render your video file. Which is normal if your are carry the project file in VS11+ into the Burning Module.

[Ken Berry]

etech -- that was exactly my thought too. It seemed to me that something must have gone wrong with his workflow in VS11.

Turtle: can you tell us if you did the following in VS11 --

1) You did your editing of the video

2) You went to Share > Create Video File > DVD (or did you select mpeg-2?)

3) You saved your project. Then went to File > New Project. This would open a new timeline with nothing in it.

4) Then did you select Share > Create Disc? The burning module opens with a clean timeline.

5) Then you manually insert the file created in step 2 above?

6) Check that Do Not convert compliant mpeg files is checked in the Options cogwheel icon in the bottom left of the burning screen.

If you did not follow these steps, then VS was inserting your project file (NOT a video file) into the burning module, and conversion would take place during the burning process.

But if the file you produced in step 2 was 'DVD' and you followed the other steps, NO conversion should take place during the burning process in VS11 or other versions of Video Studio either.

If the video file produced in Step 2 was 'mpeg-2' and not 'DVD', then it is highly likely that it may not have been DVD-compliant. So even if you followed the rest of the steps outlined above, the burning module would still convert it during the burning process.

[turtle]

The way how I did it (and have always done it)

1. I did the editing of the video.

2. I went to Share > Create Video File:

2a) I created one file with the MPEG Optimizer

Share > Create Video File > MPEG Optimizer

2b) I created one file as normal DVD too

Share > Create Video File > DVD/VCD/SVCD/MPEG > PAL DVD (4:3)

The strange thing is that it didn't use the smart renderer directly at the first try. So I saved the project, closed VS 11+, open it again and (after several times I closed and opened it) it suddenly was using the smart renderer.


3. I saved the project. Went to File > New project. It opened a new project with an empty timeline.

4. I select Share > Create Disc >

4a) I add the file from step 2a)

4b) I add the file from step 2b) (Beginning from Step 3)

5. "Do Not convert compliant mpeg files" was / is checked

6. It wanted to convert both: 2a) and 2b)

7. I aborted the conversion after 5min (~ 2%)

I am doing it that way since VS 9 (normally it was using smart renderer)
I did not add the project file.
I tried to close and reopen the project like I had to do it in step 2a) / 2b).
But here it didn't have any effect on the conversion


How I "solved" the strange problem (or how I find a way to create the dvd):

8. Installed DVDMF6 trial

9. Opened DVDMF 6 > New project > Video Disc:

9a) Added file of step 2a)

9b) Added file of step 2b) (Beginning from Step 9)

10. While adding I checked "YES" that the project settings (properties) are equal to the video settings (properties)

11. It converted both using the smart renderer and it took at least 10 minutes (for both conversion together!)


I don't know why VS 11+ isn't doing it the way it always had done

Another strange behavior is:
Sometimes the preview window doesn't show me anything in both programs: VS 11+ and DVD MF 6.
After logging off and on (several times) suddenly it behaves like it should and shows me the preview of the movie
And I always checked / make sure that the preview settings are on "preview window" and not on DV, DV and preview window or dual head device!
I don't know what the cause for this behaviors is.

I specially installed a fresh copy of my windows because my old installation was about 18 month old and had several bugs.

If I will have the time to do it, I will install another copy of windows on a smart partition of my hard drive and check if the behavior occur too.

[turtle]

Hello, thanks for any of your help, but I solved all problems (and this topic can be closed)

I tested many things and found a way to solve the problems:

1. The conversion / smart renderer problem:
Part 1:
I read through the board and found a link to a tool named Codec Detective 2.0. After downloading I started it and found out that there was a problem with the ulead (intervideo) codec and some open source mpeg2 codec I use for my TV card. So I decided to remove the open source mpeg2 codec. I restarted my computer, but VS11+ was still using the long way of conversion. And then I got an idea, that worked:
Part 2:
- I created a new user account and
- started VS 11+ and closed it directly after it was loaded
- then I opened up the registry and
- exported any settings of Ulead and Ulead systems
- I switched back to my normal user account
- Then I imported / added the file to the registry and
- started VS11+ and closed it directly after it was loaded
- Finally I restart my computer and run VS11+
Now VS 11+ behaves normal and takes the smart renderer

2. "The preview window doesn't display anything"-problem:
I remembered that I had these problems the last time under windows 98 (long long long ... time ago) with a video player program. The problem with the black (preview) screen is depending on the video card settings of my NVIDIA video card. I remembered that I solved the problem by reducing / turning off the hardware acceleration of the video card.
The How-To:
1. Right-Click on Desktop > Properties
(Or Start > System Settings > Display)

2. Go to the last tab (named "Settings")

3. Click on the right button (named "Advanced" or "Enhanced")

4. A window will pop up.

5. In this window go to the tap named "Problem treatment".

6. I tested out what the maximum level is, at which I can see anything in the preview window and left it on that level.
By the way, the description of the level I left it:
De-Activates all DirectDraw, Direct3D etc. settings.
Use this settings only if you got problems with DirectX-Applications.

7. I clicked on "Apply" and "Ok" and again on "Apply" and "Ok" and it was done.

Now there's light in the preview window

I am happy that I gave VS 11+ a second chance instead of bringing it back to the store.