Unreliable DVD Burning

[Ulead2007]

I recently purchased a Plextor M402U video capture device, which came with Ulead VideoStudio 8 SE DVD. I have no problem capturing and editing video, but I do have a problem burning DVD's that will play reliably in a set-top Sony DVD player. The DVD's play fine on the computer, but not in the standalone player. I have found postings that recommend using the lowest possible burn speed, preferably 4x or lower. However, I am unable to lower the burn speed below 6x for some reason.

I have also downloaded trial versions of VideoStudio 10 and 11 Plus--under those versions, the DVD's I create are recognized by the DVD player (not when created in VideoStudio 8 SE), but often freeze or "crash" the player during menu transitions, when fast-forwarding, or at the beginning of clips. Sometimes, a clip will play fine once, but crash the next time. On the "Burning Options" page, I can lower the burn speed to 4x before I insert a blank, Sony DVD-R (4.7 GB, 1x-16x); after the DVD is inserted, however, the lowest setting is 6x. Would lowering the speed to 4x help? If so, why can't I?

I have tried various video and audio formats--all clips seem to play, but the same, sporadic freezes occur, suggesting a problem with the burn process. I have never had a problem with a commercially-pressed DVD in my standalone player (unless it was severely scratched). I also downloaded Pinnacle Studio 10.5, which seemed to burn a reliable DVD at 6x. VideoStudio has more features, though, and I would like to upgrade to 11 Plus if I can make it burn DVD's reliably.

I installed all available updates for VideoStudio 8, but apparently trial versions cannot be patched. (It doesn't appear that an update has been released for 11 Plus, though.) I have a Sony DRU-720A DVD-RW drive, with the latest firmware. It's not on the compatibility list, but its predecessor (DRU-710A) is. I have a Dell Dimension 2400 (Pentium 4 2.2 GHz, 1 GB of RAM) with Windows XP SP2.

I would like to be able to burn at 16x, but would accept 4x (or lower) if I could force VideoStudio to use it--just as long as the DVD's I create are reliable.

[Black Lab]

Although you provide a lot of info we still need to know your clip and project properties, as well as your workflow. For instance, did you try to burn your project straight from the timeline or did you first render to a DVD compatible MPEG-2, then go to Share > Create Disc?

[jparnold]

Are you burning direct to DVD from Videostudio?
If you are I suggest that you 'burn' to hard disk. This will create the files on your hard drive which would otherwise have been burnt to DVD. When that is finished use a DV burning programs (eg Ashampoo Burning Studio) and burn those files (it will be two folders named AUDIO_TS and VIDEO_TS and their contents so select BOTH folders) to DVD and try that in your stand alone DVD player.

[2Dogs]

Hi Ulead2007,

sorry to hear you're having trouble making playable discs. It would be helpful for you to supply the following info:

What burner do you have in your pc?

What brand of discs (and media I.D. code if you know it) are you using?

Quite often, people will say that you should burn at the lowest possible speed - but this doesn't necessarily result in a better quality burn. Sometimes it might help, but with some combinations of burner and media, it will not. I actually have 7 (!) burners myself, which I periodically swap in and out of the pc according to what discs I am burning to. Different burners work best with different media. Thus far, I've had the best results with Sony 16x DVD+R and TDK (made in Malaysia) 16x DVD+R. My best burner will not write at all to two sorts of media which some of my other burners can successfully burn to. In general, +R media seems to give better results than -R. It used to be that people would choose -R media for better compatibility with standalone DVD players, but that's not really relevent these days.

If you're using DL discs, things get even trickier, and Verbatim seem to be the only ones worth using.

With any burner, it's important to use the latest firmware - as new sorts of media become available, updated firmware is released with the best burning strategies for the new media, and quite often burning problems with some media are fixed.

[Ulead2007]

Hey, everyone. Thanks for your quick responses. I'll try to provide more info:

I've tried burning straight from an edited clip (timeline), and also from a file that I've already rendered to hard disk. What I'm doing is capturing shows from a Series 1 TiVo. I try to keep everything in the closest possible format--MPEG2 video (frame-based, VBR, 7000 Kpbs, 720x480) and MPEG audio at 224 Kbps--to minimize the amount of re-coding. I've tried multiple bit rates and audio formats, and can successfully render the projects to the hard drive. Everytime I burn a file or project to a DVD, I check the output in PowerDVD on the computer, and it always seems to play fine; but then I go to the standalone DVD player, and encounter mixed results.

As I mentioned earlier, VideoStudio 8 DVD's usually were not recognized by my player; DVD's from 10 and 11 Plus are usually recognized, but then "all heck breaks loose." I actually created one DVD using VideoStudio 10 (a simple menu and three MPEG2 clips) that works fine until you try to fast-forward through the largest clip (about 2 GB's). My Sony DVD player (about 5 years old) then goes to a "blue screen" of sorts, with a "C:13:00" error code. I'll eject the disc, re-insert it, the player will search for awhile and then either: come back normally; say "NO DISC;" or present the aforementioned error code. I thought for awhile that the audio format had something to do with it, but I've been able to play MPEG2 clips with all three sound options successfully--just not reliably. The fact that I can get through an entire clip fine, and then have trouble the next time around, suggests all the data is there but the player is just having a hard time retrieving it.

I have a Sony DRU-720A DVD-RW burner (latest firmware), and so far have been using "Sony DVD-R 4.7 GB Ver. 2.1/1x-16x" media. I thought about buying some dual-layer DVD+R's, which would force VideoStudio to write at 2.4x; but at $2-3 each, testing would get expensive. I have some 4x Sony DVD+RW's I might try, but something tells me my older DVD player might have trouble reading them.

I did try saving the project to an .ISO image, and burning with a different program, but Roxio Easy CD/DVD Creator 5 didn't know what to do with the file (it seemed to be expecting a blank CD, rather than DVD). I'm sure there are tons of programs out there which will burn rendered projects to DVD (as one reader suggested), but I would like to be able to use VideoStudio 11 Plus if I'm going to pay $59.99 for it.

Has anyone else not been able to go lower than 6x, once they insert a blank disc?

[Ulead2007]

I did a little further research and found that "C:13:00" appears on some older Sony DVD players, usually when internal components are going bad. In these cases, though, it appears no DVD's are recognizable. There apparently is a way to enter diagnostics and re-calibrate the player for single and dual-layer discs. Since most commercial DVD's (I believe) are dual-layer, and I've never had a problem with them, perhaps the player needs to be re-calibrated for single-layer. Maybe I should try a newer DVD player.

I guess I'm just confused as to the sporadic results with the discs I burn with VideoStudio, and wondering if there's something that might make them more reliable. Forcing the application to use a lower burn speed than 6x is the best lead I have at this point.

[2Dogs]

Hi Ulead2007,

I would still recommend you try some +R discs. The Sony DRU-720 had a reasonable reputation so it should work well with the right media. Unfortunately I don't think you can use it to do a disc quality scan - which most Lite-Ons, BenQ's and some Samsungs can do. That can be really helpful in assessing burn quality problems. If you happen to have a friend with one of those burners, a disc quality scan with CD-DVD Speed (small freeware program) would show if the trouble was a bad burn.

As a long shot, you could try to see if you can run CD-DVD speed on your Sony - it's possible that it's a re-badged Lite-On. Some of the more recent Sony's are rebadged Samsungs.

Here's a link to the program just in case. http://www.cdspeed2000.com/

[Ulead2007]

2Dogs, thanks.

The fact that the VideoStudio DVD's will play on the computer fine suggests that the burn process is adequate for at least some uses. My older Sony DVD player (and other commercial players) must have issues with home-generated discs. The fact that any commercial DVD will play in any standalone player (assuming the proper region code), but that there are so many problems with home-made discs, suggests that commercial encoding/media standards are not, in fact, available for public use--the "burn" process must be different. Otherwise, it would seem that, given the same media used by commercial DVD producers (is it DVD+R, DVD-R, DVD+R DL, or what?) and the same software encoding process (minus CSS encryption), PC authoring software should be able to produce equally reliable DVD's at home. There should be no "question marks," unless you have defective hardware.

I'll do some more experimentation based on your suggestions. I may also try calibrating my DVD player for single-layer discs (since it seems to have no trouble with dual-layer, commercial discs). In the meantime, I would appreciate it if someone could tell me how to force VideoStudio to burn at less than 6x. I saw at least one post here, in which someone was able to fix playback issues by reducing the burn rate to 2.4x; I can't seem to do that, however. Even though the discs I'm using are rated for 1x-16x, the lowest burn setting is 6x (after the disc is inserted).

If I figure it out, I'll let everyone know.

[Ron P.]

Commercial DVDs are not burned, they are pressed. Then when they are rendered, they use special encoders, that do 20 pass encoding. The encoders are real cheap, if you're a billionaire, only about $150K. That's why the commercial DVDs can play in about any DVD player made.

What speed do you burn at? The slower burn speed of about 4x is recommended. That way the laser gets to burn the data into the disk better. Think of it like welding. If you drag your stinger across the metal real fast, how good of a weld do you expect? Dragging it slowly will give you a much better result.

[Ulead2007]

Vidoman, thanks. I had heard that they are "pressed," but didn't know about the 20-pass encoding. That makes you wonder about the reliability of home burning.

Anyway, I would love to try 4x, but VideoStudio doesn't seem to give me that option, for some reason, after I insert a blank DVD-R. 6x is the lowest setting (even though the disc is 1x-16x). Any way to get around that, maybe through the registry or an .INI file?

[Ron P.]

I didn't add that some burners, especially the "high-speed" may not allow going slower then that.

You can try going to My Computer, then right-click on your DVD burner, and select Properties. The properties dialog opens, and you should have a tab called Recording. Click on that tab, and the bottom there may be a drop-down menu, where you can set the max burn speed.

[Ulead2007]

Vidoman, thanks. I had tried that, but it didn't help. FYI, I used VideoStudio to create an .ISO image of a DVD project that I had previously burned in VideoStudio, but which didn't work in my DVD player. I used Pinnacle Studio 10.5 (trial) to burn the VideoStudio .ISO image to disc at 6x, and it worked fine (menu transitions, fast-forwarding, etc.). It appears, for whatever reason, that Pinnacle's burn technology is more compatible with my standalone player. I like VideoStudio's editing capability, but I guess I have to go with what works for burning. Thanks for your suggestions.

[2Dogs]

I would slightly disagree with Vidoman's welding analogy, since when a DVD burner burns at lower speed, the laser power is also reduced. I'm not saying that you can't get a better burn from slower burn speeds, just that there isn't necessarily a direct relationship between burn quality and burn speed. I've tested over a dozen different sorts of media in my seven burners, and for my favourite two burners, I would use the right media burnt at 16x but sometimes 12x.

In order to improve the compatibility of burned DVD's, with many later models of DVD burner you have the option to change the "booktype". Ordinarily, a pressed (commercial) DVD, say a movie, will appear to the DVD player (or your pc) as DVD-VIDEO or DVD-ROM booktype. In the past, your own burned discs would be DVD+R, DVD-R or RW - but many burners will let you change the booktype to DVD-ROM, which is a little more compatible with set top players. It shouldn't be an issue with modern players though.

In the early days of home DVD players, most set top units had better compatibility with DVD-R discs, leading people to favour that media type when burning their own discs. It seems that most burners give better results to DVD+R media, however, so I would encourage you to try that.

You mentioned that you'd written your project to an ISO file, and then used a 3rd party program to burn it. I would suggest you try out a freeware program called IMGburn. Here's a link to a download:

http://www.afterdawn.com/software/cdr_s ... mgburn.cfm

That may allow you to try burning at less than 6x. If it doesn't, then it sounds like it's a function of your burner firmware.

Even if your Sony burner won't allow you to do a disc qualitry scan with CD_DVD Speed, you should be able to do a transfer rate test. Put your questionable DVD disc in the burner, open up CD-DVD Speed and hit the "Benchmark" tab and then hit the "Start" button. What you are looking for is a smooth graph, with no sudden dips - those would indicate reading problems, caused by a bad burn. If you're lucky, you might be able to run the disc quality check - but if your burner doesn't support it, the "Start" button will be greyed out when you hit the "Disc Quality" tab.

Good luck!

[Ulead2007]

2Dogs, thanks again! IMGBurn is exactly the kind of thing I was looking for: free and, apparently, reliable. I was able to successfully burn an .ISO image created in VS 8 SE DVD at 6x. What you're saying about the speeds supported by my burner firmware appears to be correct; as with every other program, the available speeds (for DVD-R, I assume) in IMGBurn were 6x, 8x, 12x and 16x. I chose 6x, and IMGBurn did a good job.

I did try CD_DVD speed, which seemed to suggest a higher "PI Error" rate for the disc burned from VS. It may be that VS works better with DVD+R media, but I had found a Ulead support article suggesting DVD-R.

In any event, I now have all the tools I need to capture, edit and burn from my TiVo for $49.99 (the Plextor M402U capture device, VS 8 and IMGBurn). Using .ISO images may be the best way to go, anyway, for portability, re-usability, compatibility, etc.

Thanks again for the help. I hope other VS users who are having burn problems find this post helpful.

[2Dogs]

Glad it worked for you!

The fact that you were able to run a CD-DVD speed disc quality scan with your burner suggests to me that it is a re-badged Lite-On.

With regards to DVD+R media - I didn't mean that the VS burn module worked better with it - the DVD burner itself will probably give better results to DVD+R than to DVD-R. Since VS 8 is a few years old, it's possible that set top players of that time did have better compatibility with DVD-R disks, but it should not be a factor in the 21st century!

Happy burning, but do try some Sony 16x DVD+R some time.