What is wrong with VS 11 Plus???

MRG · Post by **MRG** » Sun May 06, 2007 9:01 pm

OK, here we go....

CLIPS IN HI-DEF 16:9 RATIO SETTINGS, WHICH ALL TURNED OUT TO BE 4:3

1 - HD DVD (*.mpg) came out as 1440 / 1088 (not 1080), which stops on my WinMediaPlayer at 1 second (after many-many tests all the same...) - Right Click - Save to Download

2 - HDV for PC (*.mpg) came out as 1440 / 1088 (not 1080) and 4:3 instead of 16:9 - Right Click - Save to Download

3 - WMV (*.wmv) came out as 1440 / 1080 and 4:3 instead of 16:9 - Right Click - Save to Download

4 - DivX (*.avi) came out as 1440 / 1080 and 4:3 instead of 16:9 - Right Click - Save to Download

CLIPS IN STANDARD DEF 16:9 RATIO SETTINGS, WHICH TURNED OUT TO BE 16:9

5 - DV (*.avi) came out as 720 / 480 - Right Click - Save to Download
- actually this one says that "4:3 actual, 16:9 displayed"... whatever that means...

6 - Mpeg-4 (*.mp4) came out as 720 / 480 - Right Click - Save to Download
- this one says 16:9, but this is only a regular clip, not Hi-Def!

FINAL CLIP MADE AS A 'HI-DEF 16:9 IMITATION', BECAUSE THE TOP/BOTTM EDGES HAVE BEEN CUT-OFF DURING RENDERING WIDH DIV-X TO MAKE IT LOOK LIKE A WIDESCREEN HI-DEF 16:9 CLIP.

7 - DivX (*.avi) 1440 / 810 - 16:9 "look-alike" - Right Click - Save to Download

Well, this is it, I've tried them all, none came out as they were supposed to under 'normal' operation...

The original clip was shot with Sony HDR-SR1 Hi-Def camera, 1440/1080 resolution, 16:9 ratio, in *.m2ts format which was converted to *.m2t, and then edited with VS-11-Plus in 16:9 environment to create Hi-Def 16:9 Widescreen (edge-to-edge) clips, but the stupid program just wouldn't do that, it kept working as in a 4:3 environment.

I hope Ulead can provide me with a working software soon that can actually handle both the *.m2ts format, as well as the 16:9 output....

Please download the clips as soon as possible, because I can't keep them over there for ever...

GeorgeW · Post by **GeorgeW** » Sun May 06, 2007 9:21 pm

ok, thanks, I got the files.

The 1st two appear to be 16:9 -- as listed in File/Properties in WMP. They do have the 1088 (not sure why the extra "8"). But WMP does play them all the way through (so I'm not sure why they stop playing after 1 second for you).

Regards,
George

Bignosetw · Post by **Bignosetw** » Mon May 07, 2007 7:51 am

Hi there

I have forwarded the link to this conversation to our tech support dept. But here's the thing: I played your test clip here on my PC on WinDVD 8, and it plays 100% correctly (beautiful shot, by the way) all teh way through in 16:9, and WinDVD reports it to be 1440x1080 - so am sure you are missing a setting somewhere, perhaps in your player? I produce HD video from both HDV and AVCHD in UVS 11 with no problems outputting it correctly.

I'll let you know as soon as they get back to me.

Best regards

Tobie Openshaw
Manager: MarCom Dept
Corel Digital Media

Phil S · Post by **Phil S** » Mon May 07, 2007 10:31 am

Tried your HD-DVD clip. Stops on 1 second with WMP11 and GSpot. Lack of HD codecs on my machine perhaps?? Format looks 16:9.

However Gspot reports it as 1080 and 16:9 as does VS11+ where it also plays properly right through and at 16:9.

Edit: Have just tried it on SUPER where it also reports 1080, 16:9 and plays properly right through.

MRG · Post by **MRG** » Mon May 07, 2007 3:29 pm

Many people confuse these test clips as "looks 16:9" just because they are widescreen, but in fact, if you move your WMP's corner handle to resize them on your screen to smaller one, you would see that both on top and bottom the "4:3 format" tv stripes are there (except for the DVD format clips and the very last DivX 16:9 imitation/look-alike which I indicated to be 16:9) and the properties panel properly indicates that they are, in fact, 4:3 ratio clips.

In case of the real 16:9 clips, such as the DVD size/format ones above, when you resize your WMP, will stretch from edge to edge with no top/bottom Tv stripes, and the Properties panel will also indicate the proper ratio of 16:9.

Now I'm going to borrow yet another (third one) computer to 'prove myself wrong', but I am absolutely convinced at this point, that neither my eyes, nor the WMP are mistaken, and especially WMP will not make any discrimination between the clips to show one as 4:3, then another as 16:9 just to play around or just put the TV stripes there for fun....

And yes, I've tried other players as well, and they all verified the obvious, that in fact, the output in my version of VS-11Plus using the 16:9 environment with Hi-Def clips in Hi-Def output options produce 4:3 clips!

I'll be back shortly as soon as the third computer arrives and I can run a few more tests....

By the way, my VS11+ version was an upgrade version, if that matters.

jaandrade3rd · Post by **jaandrade3rd** » Mon May 07, 2007 6:41 pm

Had similar problem with wanting output in 16:9 but was getting 4:3. Turns out that the project settings must match the video settings in order to output in the same/desired format.
Compression tab - select Media Type MPEG-2, up Video data rate to 16000, Audit bit rate to 384. General tab - Frame size 1440 x 1080.
Although not exact--they are close to what the properties of the HD video produced by the Sony HDR-SR1.
Unfortunately, the video produced by the HDR-SR1 is not a truly 16:9(1920x1080) format it is 1440x1080 which creates a 1.3333 ratio vs the 1.7777 ratio. If you set your format to the equivalent ratio i.e. 704x396 you can render video without the side/top bars. This works particularly well with quicktime as no bars are displayed. Windows media player & VS11 always seems to display bars--don't beleive it knows how to display widescreen. However, I'm still working on the formatting issue myself.

On my home PC the rendered video seems to play fine but when viewing from the internet it is choppy or video stops (audio continues) but when I view it from my office pc it plays fine.

Rascal · Post by **Rascal** » Mon May 07, 2007 7:34 pm

The clips you have downloaded play perfectly for me using Classic Media Player. Here is a screen shot of the properties.

But I have problems with PowerDVD ???
They just play for a second.
Not an expert on this subject, but hope the informations helps.

MRG · Post by **MRG** » Mon May 07, 2007 8:50 pm

Hi!

I knew that some would try to put the 'fault' on the video files, but here is a very simple proof that it has nothing to do with it:

- I start a new project in 16:9 setting.
- Put a simple color in the First Track.
- Put any image, video into the Second Track.
- Save it as a Hi-Def output. (ANY!)

The result: A fine 4:3 ratio video clip!

In "standard" DVD quality settings, the output is fine (16:9) the 4:3 thing happens only in Hi-Def settings!

It is NOT about my video clips or that I didn't select proper settings because I've tried ALL combinations, MPEG, AVI, full 1440/1080, but all produced the same results! It is about the output of VS11Plus!

Simple as that!

I'm already in the process of setting up the software on a borrowed laptop, so in a short time I can run the tests on that too.

I'll be back with the results.

MRG · Post by **MRG** » Mon May 07, 2007 9:48 pm

Hi!

Please check out ALL the different clips above, not only the first "HD DVD" one!

Meanwhile I've played them on another laptop.

PLAYBACK RESULTS OF THE SAME CLIPS WITH WMP11:

1 - HD DVD : 1440/1088 (!) not 1080, 4:3 actual ratio, played as 16:9, so it also verified it as a 4:3 ratio clip, and, it also cut it off around 1 second! I set the WMP11 to loop, and it never went over that part, never played it fully, only started, stopped around1 sec, then started again!

2 - HDV for PC : 1440/1088 (!) not 1080, 4:3 actual ratio, played as 16:9, so it also verified it as a true 4:3 ratio clip!

3 - WMV : 1440/1080, 4:3 ratio, playback is very 'jerky', not smooth.

4 - DivX: 1440/1080, 4:3 ratio. This is the most obvious, since the "DIVX" sign appears/plays outside of the clip, below it, in the lower right of the "4:3 TV line" part.

5 - 6 : These "DVD Format" Standard Def. clips played fine in the first time, so there is not much surprize, they are 16:9 format, all fine, because they are NOT Hi-Def, only DVD/Standard Def.

7 - DivX Cut - Played as it was expected, fine, 16:9, but this file is only an "imitation" of a real Hi-Def file, as it was described above. After being cut with DivX, the final output was 1440/810. This is my own 'manipulation', so this is not a 'standard' Hi-Def clip as it was supposed to be created by VS11Plus.

So, the point is, that the Hi-Def clips 1 - 4, were verified on this mashine as well to be 4:3, and even though some of the clips were played back as 16:9, Property Panel verified them as 4:3 clips!

OK, now I go and render a few clips to see what happens if I run the rendering on this laptop. I can hardly wait for the results...

Post by **Ken Berry** » Mon May 07, 2007 10:56 pm

I am reluctant to jump in at this late stage of the thread, but I have just looked back over earlier posts, and I cannot see confirmation of one thing.

MRG: when your version of VS11 starts up, do you get a splash screen which gives you the choice of Video Studio Editor, Movie Wizard and DV-to-DVD Wizard? If so, have you checked the little box down in the bottom left corner of that splash screen that says '16:9' and thus prepares the program to process in 16:9 format?

Similarly, in the burning module, have you adjusted the third icon in the bottom left of the burning screen? That by default is set to 4:3...

MRG · Post by **MRG** » Mon May 07, 2007 11:04 pm

Hi!

- Yes, the Splash Screens shows up,
- Yes I selected 16:9,
- Yes, I've been using VS for quite some time and know how to use it,
- Yes, I've checked/double/triple/quadruple/etc... checked everything,
- If the settings were off, then in Standard Def settings the clips would also turn out to be 4:3, which they are not, they are, as indicated, are all fine, 16:9, the output problem is only with the Hi-Def options,
- I don't burn the results on DVD, I save the files on HardDrive,
- Before starting the rendering, the Info panel clearly indicates that they will be 16:9 format Hi-Def clips, but the output is always 4:3 with Hi-Def files...

... I'm almost done with the rendering on the other machine, so I can post the results in minutes...

It is clear by now, however, that this is most definitely a software issue!

MRG · Post by **MRG** » Mon May 07, 2007 11:06 pm

OK, I've finished up with the rendering, here are the results:

RENDERING ON THE OTHER LAPTOP WITH VS11PLUS:

1 - HD DVD: Exactly the same! 1440 / 1088 (!) not 1080, 4:3 actual, played back as 16:9, being cut-off around 1 second! This is not a mistake but a software error, it should be obvious by now!

2 - HDV for PC: Exactly the same! 1440 / 1088 (!) not 1080, 4:3 actual, played back as 16:9. So, this is actually 4:3!

3 - WMV: This is funny... This clip, instead of rendering to 1440/1080, the final clip is 208 / 160 with 13:10 ratio... A tiny little nothing instead of a Hi-Def clip.... (I've rendered it twice, just to make sure...)

4 - DivX: Exactly the same! 1440 / 1080, 4:3 ratio! The DivX sign appears the same place, right lower corner below the clip, in the "black 4:3 TV stripe".

The others were fine, so are here, so in Standard Def, MPEG-4, DV and "manipulated" DivX all produced normal 16:9 clips.

So, now what? Should I go and get yet another computer to prove my point????

I live in NY, so if Ulead has Reps here, they are welcome to come over and check out the problem on the spot! (instead of pointing fingers at video files, settings and other nonsense excuses...)

MRG · Post by **MRG** » Mon May 07, 2007 11:15 pm

I am pretty sure that it is either a software problem, or a software problem with my version.

Three computers don't re-produce the same exact errors and problems, nor do they playback the same results by accident...

THIS IS A SOFTWARE BUG/ERROR/PROBLEM/ISSUE....

Ps: I downloaded the software again, "just in case", removed and installed it again, all the same....

Post by **Ken Berry** » Tue May 08, 2007 12:50 am

For what it is worth, I have now downloaded all four of Hi Def samples above.

Apart from Field Order and size, both HD_DVD and HD_for_PC's Properties in VS11 are shown as being 16:9 and 1440x1080. Both play perfectly.

WMV_Hi-Def is shown as having a frame size also of 1440x1080 and an aspect ratio of 1.33:1.00 though the VS11 Properties does not say whether it is supposed to be 16:9 or 4:3. Curiously, while it plays perfectly, in the VS preview window, it appears as a very reduced image, probably less than half the screen, though with correct aspect.

DivX_-_HI-DEF also shows as 1440x1080 and plays perfectly, though again Properties does not show whether it is 16:9 or 4:3.

Given your experiments on a number of other computers, yet given the results a number of us have which conflict with yours, then I would have to agree that for some unknown reason your version of the software is causing this anomaly. Good luck in finding a cure...

In the meantime, though, I will save all four as useful samples which I can use if future questions about HD arise.

MRG · Post by **MRG** » Tue May 08, 2007 1:26 am

Hi!

Well, at this point I'm beyond frustration....

Tomorrow I will have yet another computer and I am going to take the time to run some tests on that too, but I'm pretty sure of the outcome already....

Maybe I'll ask Ulead to give me another version, if there is any difference at all between my Upgrade and a New/Full version. I don't know...

I spent who knows how many fruitless hours with this software, so I'm just tired at this point....