Playback problem with certain players

kamik · Post by **kamik** » Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:22 pm

Got some great tips for burning my first DVD earlier and successfully completed the disc. It played perfectly in the portable Panasonic player I had at work but when I tried on my home player, the playback was totally jerky and not watchable. I tried the player in my bedroom and it played fine until it reached a point where it stopped and would not resume. As a matter of fact, at that point it would not pause, forward or reverse or respond to any buttons. I had to stop or eject and start all over again where it would stop again pretty much about the same spot. Funny thing is that I burned 4 copies and tried a couple of others and they did the same thing but stopped near the same scene but not at exactly the same spot and would never stop at exactly the same spot, about 1 hour into the 90 min play. Playback on a computer DVD player gave be different bad problems which was a weird rattling sound when it was attempting to read but not start playing nor read. Tried a 3rd player and it would not even get beyond "reading". Finally tried playing it in the external HPdvd840 drive that I burned it with and it played perfectly. So...it looks like a problem with the actual burning or drive. Are there settings that could have caused the reading, jerky and stalling playback? I used a double layer +R disc and basic default settings when burning. Chose to not have chapters and no menu... Since it seems to be caused by the burner drive, how about copying from the HP drive to a different DVD burner? Would that be a drag n drop or software needed to copy a DVD?

DVDDoug · Post by **DVDDoug** » Wed Apr 25, 2007 10:38 pm

...about 1 hour into the 90 min play... I used a double layer +R disc...

It's could be an issue with the dual-layer disc. (You might be hitting the layer-change at the 1 hour point.) You should be able to fit 90 minutes on a single-layer DVD. You may have to lower your bitrate. Here's a Bitrate Calculator

Some players can't play "burned" DVDs at all. Others can play DVD-R, but not DVD+R or vice-versa. My sister's player can't play dual-layer burned discs. (All players can play commercially-stamped dual-layer discs.) In general your best odds are with single-layer DVD-R. Newer players should be able to play anything. The rumor is, that the new super-cheap players will usually play anything.

You can also try burning at slow speed (4X or less) and keep your bitrate below around 7000kbps.

You can also try a different brand or simply a different batch of blank discs... Of course, experimenting with dual-layer discs can get costly...

But, uhhhh... paragraphs are free!

Your post was a bit difficult to read.

Post by **Ken Berry** » Wed Apr 25, 2007 10:44 pm

Welcome to the wonderful world of home burned DVDs. I am afraid the title of your posts says it all. The fact of the matter is that not all stand-alone DVD players are created equal. There is a wealth of experience that suggests that the more expensive brand name players are particularly finicky when they are asked to play a home burned disc, displaying a variety of behaviour from refusing to play (or even recognise) the disc, playing it erratically with jerks, to stopping at a certain point as you have found.

Generally, the cheaper, generic players imported from China and Korea are more likely to play anything round and silver which is put into them!

There are any number of factors which influence this behaviour: the brand of the disc (or more particularly the factory it was made in and the batch it was part of -- some factories make different quality discs for different customers); the dye used on it; whether it is + or -R or even +/-RW. Some players even have difficulty with home-burned dual layer discs such as you have used. (Commercial movie DVDs are pressed, not burned.)

Another important factor is the speed you used to burn the disc. As a general rule, you should burn a video DVD at a low speed to give the laser a better chance of firmly embedding the signal into the disc. A weaker signal makes the more finicky players inclined to skate lightly over the grooves or skip them or just stop.

Generally, we recommend burning discs rated at up to 12x at no more than 4x or 6x. Higher rated discs (up to 20x these days) may not even have such low ratings, but the idea is that for whatever disc you use, then burn at a slow speed acceptable to that disc.

You will also need to check the compatibility of your players with certain brands of discs. There is a list somewhere but I have lost the URL. Hopefully someone else will jump in here and provide it.

etech6355 · Post by **etech6355** » Wed Apr 25, 2007 11:14 pm

Single layered dvd's burning using VS work for me.
All the dual-layered dvd's I've burned in VS10 fail to play correctly, using Sony's internal DRU-810 & DRU820. To get it to work I burn dvd folders and use Nero to burn the dvd disk. In nero under burner selection -> options I change the setting the Booktype to DVD-ROM and activating "Write Extended Lead-Out on dual-layered DVD's". All the options are checked ON when burning dual-layer using Nero or the dual-layers don't play correctly in my players nor the computer(s).
I also use the Verify feature in Nero when burning.

I don't think it's VS that's causing this. Probably my media and burner combination. I only know what works on my machine and the "Write Extended Lead-Out on dual-layered DVD's" feature that's in Nero produces a working dual-layered dvd-video dvd.
I'd like to also mention that other burning software, not just VS/Ulead that doesn't have this advanced feature also produces bad dual-layered dvd's.
So on my setup it's not just VS.

I suggest to smart-render out about a 4gig test file and burn to a single layered dvd. If this single layer test dvd plays fine on the players then the mpeg2 encoding is good and the problem is in burning the dual-layered dvd.

kamik · Post by **kamik** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 2:07 am

Lot of factors that I did not know about...seemed a lot easier than it is turning out to be! One being that it takes hours to burn that first disc. Sure hope that it will not take that long for the 2nd time around. Thanks for all the tips and suggestions!

sjj1805 · Post by **sjj1805** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 2:27 am

Please view:
DVD burning/playback problems

etech6355 · Post by **etech6355** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 2:50 am

One being that it takes hours to burn that first disc. Sure hope that it will not take that long for the 2nd time around

It takes me about 45-50 minutes to burn a dual-layer 8gig dvd & verify. Burning at 2.4X. Hours tells me maybe VS is rendering the complete project maybe?
If you followed the tutorials for VS and Ken's often suggestion on creating a mpeg2 file of your project before burning a dvd it would be very simple to insert the mpeg2 file, trim the end and smart-render a 3-4 gig test file.

Which brings up another point of your work flow, It's usually better to render a dvd compliant mpeg2 file before going into the burning module.
Go to Share > Create Video File > DVD (your template or customize the settings) to produce a single DVD-compatible mpeg-2 of the whole project.
Then open a new project, leave the timeline empty, go directly to Share > Create Disc which brings up the burning module. Insert the new mpeg-2 file that you created in the previous project, make menu & burn. The burning process will go very fast because the mpeg2 file is already dvd compliant.

sjj1805 · Post by **sjj1805** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 3:01 am

Please view:
Suggested Workflow by sjj1805 It echoes what my friends above have said.

etech6355 · Post by **etech6355** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 4:39 am

Steve,
Do you think it would be a good idea to add the link Suggested Workflow by sjj1805 tutorial. into the "READ ME BEFORE POSTING" post. It would make it easier to answer many posts. I'm not always at the same machine or OS and have to lookup the link so bookmarks for me don't always work. Hence I type in hasty steps that aren't accurate enough (like bit-rate settings, fielding etc)

I had added a link in the MF "READ ME BEFORE POSTING" post that reminds user to make sure the latest updates were installed.

kamik · Post by **kamik** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 10:11 am

Appreciate all the guidance and tips you all have posted. I've followed the links, read all the suggestions and have tried to absorb all the info but hope you will pardon the newbie questions I still have.

I read what rendering means but my question is how do I render using video studio 9? Or do I use video studio to do the rendering?

Perhaps it would be helpful if I describe the steps I took. I realize now that I used different steps from what has been suggested but at that time all I had was the manual that came with the Video Studio. Anyway, I started by videoing a school play on my digital camera and ended up with 2 1gb SD sticks with about 13 clips. I then copied the clips using a reader to "my videos" in my Win XP and I think it got saved as an AVI file. Using Video Studio Editor I imported the clips one by one, added the title to the beginning and then the credits to the end.

Next I used "create disc" but did not make any changes to the setup other than to choose no menu. I then hit burn and this is when I found that the burn took hours and the 2 progress bars just crept along.

Not sure when the AVI files were converted to MPEG or even IF I converted so that may have been my downfall. Also not sure if my importing was a problem but I now see that you all do it different. Do you see anything that I did that was drastically wrong?

sjj1805 · Post by **sjj1805** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 11:25 am

etech6355 wrote:Steve,
Do you think it would be a good idea to add the link Suggested Workflow by sjj1805 tutorial. into the "READ ME BEFORE POSTING" post. It would make it easier to answer many posts. I'm not always at the same machine or OS and have to lookup the link so bookmarks for me don't always work. Hence I type in hasty steps that aren't accurate enough (like bit-rate settings, fielding etc)

I had added a link in the MF "READ ME BEFORE POSTING" post that reminds user to make sure the latest updates were installed.

John,
Thank you for the suggestion. I have placed the link in that post, plus a link to our list of frequently asked questions.

Post by **Ken Berry** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:37 pm

If your source video came from a digital still camera using .avi as its extension once it was captured, then it is highly likely (99.9% certain) that is one of the highly compressed mpeg-4 formats or else the older .mjpeg format. Right click on one of the captured files within Video Studio and copy down ALL of its properties here, please.

One thing is certain: you should have, after editing, gone to Share > Create Video File > DVD, to convert the video to DVD compatible mpeg-2 before ever going to Share > Create Disc...

kamik · Post by **kamik** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 7:37 pm

Hi Ken, wasn't sure which file you needed but think you are asking about the original imported flie. I copied down both, one from the editing window and the other from the create disc window...

This what I found from the first clip when I opened with"open project" in VS; (file extension is .MOV)

File format; Quick Time Movie Files
Movie size; 320x240
Duration; 560.00
Track count; 1 video track, 1 sound track

VIDEO TRACK 1
Compression; Photo-JPEG
Attributes; 24 bits, 320X240
Total frames; 8,400 frames
Frame rate; 15 frames/second
Duration; 560 seconds
Start at; 0.00 seconds

SOUND TRACK 1
Compression; None
Attributes; 7.875khz, 8 bits Mono
Total samples; 4,410,000 samples
Duration; 560 seconds
Start at; 0.00 seconds

And these are the properties from the "project" when I opened using "create disc"; (file extension is .VSP)

PROJECT TEMPLATE PROPERTIES
NTSC drop frame (29.97 fps)
MPEG files
24 Bits, 720 x 480, 29.97 fps
Lower Field First
(DVD-NTSC), 4:3
Video data rate: Variable (Max. 8000 kbps)
LPCM Audio, 48000 Hz, Stereo

Thanks...

etech6355 · Post by **etech6355** » Thu Apr 26, 2007 8:12 pm

PROJECT TEMPLATE PROPERTIES
NTSC drop frame (29.97 fps)
MPEG files
24 Bits, 720 x 480, 29.97 fps
Lower Field First
(DVD-NTSC), 4:3
Video data rate: Variable (Max. 8000 kbps)
LPCM Audio, 48000 Hz, Stereo

Since your showing a framerate of 29.97 you must have installed VS for NTSC setup.
I would do this first, change your project properties to dvd compliant as close as possible to match the source video.
First you never complained about the audio not converting so I would stay with lpcm audio for the conversion. Many times converting the audio from these mono mov files fails. (Guess your the lucky one).

Open your project.
Goto "Project Properties" [ File -> Project Properties ]
Make the following changes to your "Project Properties"
NTSC drop frame (29.97 fps)
FrameType = Framebased
FrameSize = 352 x 240
Aspect Ratio = 4:3
Quality = 70
Video data rate: Constant 1500 kbps
LPCM Audio, 48000 Hz, Stereo
Save the Project

Render your project to a Mpeg2 Dvd compliant video file:
Goto "Share -> Create Video File" -> Same as Project Settings" and save the file to create a new mpeg2 dvd compliant file that you will use in the NEXT project to burn your Single-Layer DVD. (I doubt you will need all the space on a dual-layer dvd due to the source video are low quality compared to true dvd quality).

I would also create a "Disk Template" of these settings for future conversions. "Tools -> Make Movie Manager" Format = Mpeg, give name etc.

After you have create the video file test it by playing it back. If it looks good the start a new project as I posted before to burn a dvd of the mpeg2 dvd compliant file
Here were the instructions:

Open a new project, leave the timeline empty, go directly to Share > Create Disc which brings up the burning module. Insert the new mpeg-2 file that you created in the previous project by clicking on the top left icon, make menu & burn. The burning process will go very fast because the mpeg2 file is already dvd compliant.

This is what I would do.

kamik · Post by **kamik** » Fri Apr 27, 2007 8:29 am

Getting there! I rendered the video and now see it saved as an MPEG file. Changed the setting to the suggested values and then followed the suggested path to the burn...showed that the new rendered video would now fit the 4.7gb -R disc! Thanks to you guys! Hit burn, no menu...progress bars moving along...

Watched the progress bars as VS read the files, prepped the video for burning. Progressing until bar indicated burning disc...59% and then nothing. Stayed at 59% for about an hour. Program wouldn't respond, cancel button gray'd and would not even respond the control/alt/delete. Finally resorted to turning off the computer with VS still open and tried burnign with a new disc, again...same thing, 59% and stopped. Bought new discs, different brand and again 59%, stop... Now the DVD drive is spinning while stuck at 59% but the program seems to be frozen.

Getting a lot closer but what gives with this stalling at 59%? By the way, the DVD disc was pretty hot when I removed the disc after I manually turned the computer off. Is that normal? I did receieve NERO OEM with the external drive, can I burn the saved MPEG file using the NERO? Would I need to set some stuff up in NERO or was that just for the rendering? Thanks for all the help but I need a bit more...