Backing up footage - save as AVI?

[Fred S]

Once I have completed my editing, and having saved as MPEG in order to then create the DVD, I'm just wondering whether there would be any value in trying to save the edited footage as AVI for back-up purposes in case I want to re-edit later. Any views on this? I realise hard disk space is the big disadvantage.

If I do this what are the correct settings to use when saving the AVI, and will I still be able to retain the timecode and split scene information?

[heinz-oz]

Since a one hour DV-AVI file takes up about 13 GB it becomes a disk space hog. If you want to edit again later, it's best to keep the footage in the form of DV-AVI for obvious quality reasons. You can also render your projects back to MiniDV tape as long as your camcorder has the proper IEEE1394 port.

I keep my originals als archive. If ever I want to re-edit this, chances are I have a completely different idea about it and a previously edited tape might not be the best source to start from. Also, backing up to tape by rendering the project to DV-AVI still applies a slight compression again. doing this often enough may become apparent by loss in quality.

[sjj1805]

There are several previous posts on this.
Click here - Search and then enter the word archive as the search factor.

[Fred S]

I have read lots of these and am still undecided.

My projects so far are fairly straightforward - from a 1 hour DV tape I simply edit out what amounts to a few minutes of crappy bits and put in some simple fades between scenes. So far I have been saving this edited footage as MPEG (call this version 1), then adding some titles and saving this again as MPEG (version 2), from which I make the DVD (I also have an equivalent version 1 and version 2 project file).

Now, my question is, if I want to make up new DVDs later that have (say) different bits from the different version 1s, can I do this without losing quality from the MPEGs, or should I be redoing from the original captured AVIs?

If I should be using AVIs I would rather take my version 1 projects and save as AVI so that I don't have to re-edit later. So my original question was how do I do this in VS10 i.e. what settings should I use e.g. should I use SmartRender, and will I retain the timecode info? Alternatively, would it be an option to record back to DV tape and then re-capture? If so will I retain timecode information with this method?

As far as the actual archiving is concerned I have Acronis TrueImage and will probably use that.

[skier-hughes]

Also, backing up to tape by rendering the project to DV-AVI still applies a slight compression again. doing this often enough may become apparent by loss in quality.

If you save as dv-avi no further compression is applied to normal video.

A slight amount is done to areas of change, like at transitions, but it is miniscule and it'd take many saves of changes to make a difference.


Fred S.

When you do your editing you want to reman as dv-avi until you have toatally finished editing and then make your mpeg2 for authoring your dvd.
Mpeg is a lossy format and continually saving after changes will make a slight diference.

[Fred S]

When you do your editing you want to reman as dv-avi until you have toatally finished editing and then make your mpeg2 for authoring your dvd.
Mpeg is a lossy format and continually saving after changes will make a slight diference.

That is what I am doing. I am finishing my editing apart from titles then saving an MPEG file. Then I am taking a copy of this project, adding my titles, then saving as MPEG with titles. So I end up with two MPEG files, both created from the AVI files. I am not using the first MPEG to create the second.

[etech6355]

Since a one hour DV-AVI file takes up about 13 GB it becomes a disk space hog. If you want to edit again later, it's best to keep the footage in the form of DV-AVI for obvious quality reasons. You can also render your projects back to MiniDV tape as long as your camcorder has the proper IEEE1394 port.

I've found my dv.avi files have alot more information in them that you can't normally see unless you zoom in on the pixels. I've also found that playing back the dv.avi files which are approx 25000kbs - 30000kbs video_bit_rate, on a HDTV does make a quality difference on the bigger TV displays after the picture is blown up to a big screen.
The mpeg2 file looks OK but the DV.avi file looks the best on the big screen.

I keep the dv.avi files around on harddisk or tape, someday 13gigs won't be considered to large.

[Fred S]

I keep the dv.avi files around on harddisk or tape, someday 13gigs won't be considered to large.

Yes, I've pretty much decided I want to keep the dv.avi files - the question is what is the best way to keep them so that I won't need to re-edit later i.e. how do I save edited versions of them?

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi Fred

I capture to Dv-Avi (13Gb per hour)
Edit the project
Render the project to Dv-Avi, using same as first clip option.

I export the edited rendered Avi back to my camcorder to Mini-DV tape. One Hour.
(Share¡XDV Recording) You need a camera that has DV-IN option.

If I wish I can capture this video at a later date, knowing that it is the edited version there should be minimum editing.

Using a new project, I then render the new Avi to Dvd to create a Mpeg used to burn the Disc.

Delete the original captured footage to save on disc space.

The new Avi could also be saved on your hard drive, 13Gb worth.


Hope this Helps

Trevor

[Fred S]

I capture to Dv-Avi (13Gb per hour)
Edit the project
Render the project to Dv-Avi, using same as first clip option.

Thanks. I've been doing some experimenting, and using the same as first video clip or defaulted custom options produces a file that won't play properly in Media Player Classic and causes Windows Media Player to crash. If I save as PAL DV it does play in MPC albeit with a warning that the "AVI file was not prepared for sequential reading".

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi Fred

The option to use Same as First Clip, should use the same settings as the capture properties. (Dv-Avi)
The render should be relatively quick as the source and new file use the same settings. (Smart Render)

If you captured using firewire to DV then you would have copied/transferred the video, no re-coding.

Did you capture using Firewire to DV.??
Does the captured file, before editing play in Media Player. ??

Trevor

[Fred S]

Did you capture using Firewire to DV.??
Does the captured file, before editing play in Media Player. ??

Yes I did capture with Firewire and the captured files play fine in WMP and MPC.

[sjj1805]

Rather than saving back to tape you could consider getting a few external hard drives or removable hard drives. For the amount of storage space they now provide it might be considered a cost effective option.

They are more robust than tape which could stretch, crinkle or break in two. I think that in a few years time we will probably be using Blue Ray Discs for storage as they hold 25GB per disc. (However when we reach that time we will also be dealing with video formats much larger than the present 13GB per hour.)

When Blue Ray is affordable you could then transfer what you have now saved onto hard drive(s) to those discs and re-use the hard drives for some other purpose.

[Fred S]

Rather than saving back to tape you could consider getting a few external hard drives or removable hard drives. For the amount of storage space they now provide it might be considered a cost effective option.

Yes, in fact I am in the process of getting an additional external hard disk.

I still cannot understand, though, why my attempts to save an edited AVI file are giving such bad results. Anyone any ideas?

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi Fred

It is strange that you are not producing a file with similar quality.

If the original plays ok on Windows Media Player then the rendered should be no different.

What are the properties of the original captured video file?
And the properties of the rendered file? They should be identical, but what are they?

Regards

Trevor