Quick Question On Capture or, am I doing this properly?

[railroadguy]

I have my new Canopus 300 hooked up. I have read the FAQ's here and "still" have a problem.

In VS10+ when I click on Capture Video The source shows as Unknown MSDV. OK, I get that it down no know just what a Canopus is, but knows there is something out there.

But then we have the Format selection. It defaults to DVD. I want to capture 8mm tapes for later editing. So I thought I should set this for MPEG as that was what I se all the preferences for as told in the FAQ's.

In Options, I set the bit rate for 8000 and MPEG-2. When I am finished recording, it says Finish flushing transcode buffer, which I assume is finishing the disk writing.

So, is this it? It looks good but again I want to capture the raw tape for later editing, and just want some confirmation that I am on the right track.

[Ken Berry]

No, I most definitely DON'T believe you are doing the right thing with that particular device...

The very point of having spent the money to buy a Canopus ADVC 300 is to use its capacity to capture to high quality DV format. (I am not sure whether you had a typo when you said it defaults to DVD as the capture format -- I think it defaults to DV.) Why buy a relatively expensive device which specialises in capturing from analogue sources direct to DV and then try to get it to capture to another format?

Capturing DV creates much larger files -- yes. But the quality normally is excellent. You can then do the editing in Video Studio in DV format, and when that is finished you can convert it to DVD-compatible mpeg-2 by going to Share > Create Video File > DVD. Coming from a DV format project, there is far less likelihood of out of sync video and audio or other problems using this workflow than there would be if you capture in mpeg format, edit in that format, then re-encode into that format...

The 'flush transcode buffer' by the way, has nothing to do finishing writing the disc. It is normally shown when, as you are, you are trying to capturing direct to mpeg format.

If your computer is not powerful or fast enough, the incoming signal -- which is converting the incoming DV signal which the Canopus device is built to send to mpeg-2 on the fly -- is sending too much data for your computer to be able to handle. So the data begins to back up in what is called the transcode buffer (i.e. DV data waiting to be transcoded to mpeg-2). The capture will actually pause until the buffer is flushed, making room for more data to be sent and processed from the Canopus.

You simply won't have this problem is you do what the device is meant to do and capture to DV!

[GeorgeW]

Some people do capture from dv-to-mpeg, and also edit their captured mpeg files successfully.

However, I would recommend changing the FORMAT to DV -- this will capture DV .avi files to your computer. You then edit DV .avi, and then encode to mpeg as the final step for Authoring to DVD.

Keep in mind the DV .avi's will require more hard drive space than capturing mpeg (dv .avi is about 13gb per hour).

The nice thing is you don't have to worry about the "Flushing transcode buffer..." message (depends on your computer horsepower and optimizations for video editing). If you see that message during a capture to mpeg, you will miss capturing any analog video that is playing into the Canopus unit while it is "flushing..." the buffer.

Regards,
George


EDIT -- ooops, Ken already posted while I was typing

[railroadguy]

OK, first, thank you all both for responding. So, I set to DV.

In the project properties I set:

Non-square to on

Lower Field first

Compression DV encoder type 1

I can't see anywhere with these setting to set the bit rate although that may be preset by the DV option?

And the video is poor. The MEPG looked better on the screen and after burning to a test DVD. I am missing something here and am not sure what it is. The resulting AVI is "grainy" compared to the MPEG capture.

[Ken Berry]

I can't for the life of me think why your captured DV should look worse than captured mpeg-2. Normally, it should appear better.

Can you right click on one of the captured DV files within and copy down its properties here, please.

I am assuming you have the Canopus connected via firewire to the computer...?

[railroadguy]

OK, for the properties go to: http://ribbonrail.com/Videos/vs-1.gif

For a screen shot go to: http://ribbonrail.com/Videos/vs-2.jpg

Never having worked with raw video, I am guessing the distortion of the image is because I am capturing for NTSC so the computer monitor will not be as clear as the final product for TV?

Yes, new firewire card and no dropped frames.

[Ken Berry]

OK. You are using the type 2 DV Encoder which is set by default on installation of VS. But it often causes people problems.

In the Capture > Capture Video page and with DV set as the capture format, click on the Options cogwheel icon. Change the encoder type to Type 1.

Capture again and let us know how that looks.

[GeorgeW]

I would be surprised if DV Type-2 is the issue -- as it was reported that there were no dropped frames. And the computer looks plenty powerful enough (I used to capture DV Type-2 on a P-III 400 machine many years ago). I don't think Type-2 dv capture is that stressful on a machine -- only those poorly optimized machines (or "borderline" optimized for dv capture) will have a problem with Type-2 capture (imho).

What were the encoding bitrates that were used when creating the DVD from the DV .avi capture? You have to make sure you use the same bitrates, and also the same "quality/speed" setting (compare apples to apples).

One thing to try (if your computer is near a TV) -- the Canopus device should allow you to "export" a DV video (so you can see what it will look like from computer to TV). I'm not sure of the settings on that device, buy check the manuals to see how you can send a dv .avi to the Canopus, and then the Canopus to your TV.

Regards,
George

[railroadguy]

I will try the Type 1 / 2 in the morning.

As to bit rate, when using DV there is no place that allows me to set the bit rate. And when I go into Project Properties / AVI / Advanced Options, it defaults to Custom under Target Playback Device. Now I can set Check data rate to 8000 kbps but when then going to Create Video / NTSC DVD / there is no selection for bit rate.

Should I be going to Custom / MPEG / Compression and set the data rate to Constant 8000 and not use the preset NTCS DVD ?

There is also a quality slider there preset to 70, can I move that higher? Since I don't know what the presets are for the NTCS DVD selection, I am not sure what it is doing.

[2Dogs]

I will try the Type 1 / 2 in the morning.

Just use Type 1 - even though, as George said, it's unlikely to be the source of your problem, Type 1 is the preferred sort for normal VS use.

As to bit rate, when using DV there is no place that allows me to set the bit rate.

I don't think there should be any options. For NTSC land, you will be capturing to 720x480, upper field first (since the source is analogue) DV Type 1.

And when I go into Project Properties / AVI / Advanced Options, it defaults to Custom under Target Playback Device. Now I can set Check data rate to 8000 kbps but when then going to Create Video / NTSC DVD / there is no selection for bit rate.

You should set the project properties to MPEG-2 - don't mess with the avi settings in the way you describe!

Instead, open the "Project Properties" dialogue box and choose "MPEG files" in the Edit file format: box, and hit the "Edit" button. Then hit the "General" tab in the resulting window, and select "Upper Field first" in the Frame type: box. Then go back to the Project Properties dialogue box and hit the "Edit" button again, and this time click on the "Compression" button. You can leave the slider set to it's default setting of 70 if you like. I used to think that you got better image quality if you moved it all the way over to 100, but in fact I believe it's to do with motion search - so it's always a compromise between fast moving scenes and scenes with little movement. Experiment if you like - setting it to Zero gives poor results!

Then you can set the bitrate. By default, the Video Studio NTSC DVD template uses 8000 kbps variable bitrate - and that should be fine.

You can use constant bitrate if you like, but it will make the file size bigger with no noticeable gain in picture quality. If you want to squeeze the maximum possible picture quality out of your project, use a compressed audio format (eg MPEG audio) and then you'll be able to raise the video bitrate up to 9500 kbps. Anecdotally, posters report problems with playback on standalone DVD players with bitrates over 8000 or 8500 kbps, but I've never expreienced any such problems. Bear in mind that commercial pressed DVD movies often use up to 9500 kbps.

Your final picture quality will ultimately be dependent on your source material. If that is not high, you'll be "wasting" high bitrate on it - it's like putting lipstick on a pig!

Hope that helps.

Good luck!

[GeorgeW]

I don't think there should be any options. For NTSC land, you will be capturing to 720x480, upper field first (since the source is analogue) DV Type 1.

Since the analog source is being converted to DV by the Canopus, it should be captured as LOWER FIELD first, and further encoding to mpeg2 for DVD should also be LOWER FIELD first...

Regards,
George

[railroadguy]

Spent all day Saturday playing with this. First off, thanks for all the suggestions.

Things seem to be working well now. It's just a learning curve and thank God for DVD+RW

The Canopus comes with enhancement software. I find that ones needs to be carful how this is used. Apparently "someone" had set sharpness to max when I did my first few tests. I blamed my dog who then looked at my cat who then called me an idiot

So it's back to practice, practice, practice.