DVD-VR and standalone player

[andyk]

Hi,
Does anyone know if there is a difference between the DVD-VR format produced by the Ulead DVD MF 5 Plus program and that used by the Pioneer DVR-533 DVD recorders. The pioneer can play the discs but cannot high speed copy them to it's hard disc. Just says "cannot complete copy".

The DVD-VR file contains videos that originated on the pioneer and were finalized, then processed by DVD MF on the PC (VOB files to DVD-VR). The specs for the files all match - video and Dolby AC-3 audio.

Does the DVD drive on the PC make a difference? I have a Toshiba laptop A100 with a Matshita DV-RAM UJ-841S.

Any help appreciated.

Andy..

[maddrummer3301]

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[andyk]

When you create the -VR disk it should be a DVD-RW dvd formatted as UDF 2.0
You can format the dvd-rw disk in the pioneer recorder and if Data-Add is active on your dvd writer it will use the existing format (should be UDF 2.0)
This way when MF writes to the dvd in -vr mode it's writing it as packet writing.

What version of MF and have you applied all the updates to it?
Make sure the videos are in the -VR format.
The dvd-rw disk should have this directory structure if E_Drive is your dvd drive:

Code: Select all

 
E:\DVD_RTAV____
               |__  VR_MANGR.BUP
               |__  VR_MANGR.IFO
               |__ VR_MOVIE.VRO  (Main Movie File) 

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Thanks for the reply.

That's the directory structure I have. XP reports the disc is UDF 2.0. The disc structure looks identical to a -VR disc from the Pioneer recorder.

I'm running MF 5.30.0107.0 Plus - no updates available. I have DLA from Sonic active on the computer and I selected no CD recording in the XP drive properties to enable DVD-RAM.

I tried starting with a DVD-RW disc from the Pioneer formatted as -VR but the result was unchanged.

I'm importing a VOB file from another disc written by the pioneer recorder. This one was finalized on the Pioneer in Video mode (not VR). I suspect that the actual video is not being converted back to VR by the import, but how can I tell?

Andy....

[maddrummer3301]

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[andyk]

I would try this as an experiment. Format a dvd in the recorder as -VR mode (probably have to use a dvd-rw dvd). Then copy a 20 minute (SD /2 hour mode) video to it (small one) from the dvd recorders harddisk. This way you are starting with a -VR disk from the dvd recorder.
Put the dvd-rw (-VR) disk into the laptop and in MF select "Edit Disk". Trim about 5 minutes from the video and write that back to the dvd-rw disk. Then put that dvd back into the recorder & see if you can fast copy back to the harddisk. This way your starting/editing/finalizing all in the -VR mode.
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On the computer, I edited a disc from the standalone Pioneer recorder as suggested. The result was able to be high speed copied back on the Pioneer 533.

I also created a -VR disc from scratch on the computer. The Pioneer was able to edit it but could not high speed copy before or after the edit. So there is quite a bit of compatibility outside of the HS copy.

A couple of clarifications.

I have been importing chapters from a previously saved DVD. Not copying the VOBs directly.

The reference to DVD-RAM was not for the Pioneer but rather an option in XP for the computer's drive. I haven't actually written anything but DVD-RWs and one DVD+RW(+VR) on the computer.

I tried disabling DLA and nothing really changed except XP couldn't see the disc. DVD MF worked the same as before.

Thanks for all the information.

[andyk]

Hi,
Does anyone know if there is a difference between the DVD-VR format produced by the Ulead DVD MF 5 Plus program and that used by the Pioneer DVR-533 DVD recorders. The pioneer can play the discs but cannot high speed copy them to it's hard disc. Just says "cannot complete copy".

I found a difference in the 2 formats over the weekend. The Pioneer DVD-VR has slightly different data in its videos. The Mpeg headers contain a user data segment which is not present in the DVD-VRs produced by Movie Factory.

The user segments in the Pioneer -VR Video are still present in the headers after being edited on the computer by Movie Factory, which probably explains why they can still be high speed copied after editing.


I used an old copy of the program bbInfo to display the file structure of the VROs.

The data for the Pioneer 533 recorder DVD-VR was as follows:

File C:\vrmovie1.vro is an MPEG-2 Program Stream

PACK #0, pack_start_code = 000001BA, SCR = 0.000000 ms
system_header_start_code = 000001BB
stream_id = BF Private Stream 2

PACK #1, pack_start_code = 000001BA, SCR = 1.625407 ms
packet #0
stream_id = E0 Video Stream 0, PTS = 287.488889 ms, DTS = 187.388889 ms
0 - sequence_header_code
76 - extension_start_code
86 - extension_start_code
95 - group_of_pictures header
103 - user_data_start_code <-------------------------
202 - picture_start_code
210 - extension_start_code


PACK #2, pack_start_code = 000001BA, SCR = 3.250815 ms
packet #1
stream_id = E0 Video Stream 0,
.
.
.
.
.
PACK #4497, pack_start_code = 000001BA, SCR = 19519.488889 ms
stream_id = BD Private Stream 1,
stream_id = BE Padding Stream,

Summary:

MPEG Packs = 4498
System headers = 39
Private Stream 1 packets = 342, total bytes = 621912
Padding Stream packets = 78, total bytes = 107599
Private Stream 2 packets = 39, total bytes = 78156
Video stream 0 packets = 4117, total bytes = 8293772


The data for the for the same video after copy, finalize and conversion back to DVD-VR by Ulead Movie Factory was:

File C:\vrmovie2.vro is an MPEG-2 Program Stream

PACK #0, pack_start_code = 000001BA, SCR = 0.000000 ms
system_header_start_code = 000001BB
stream_id = BF Private Stream 2

PACK #1, pack_start_code = 000001BA, SCR = 1.626037 ms
packet #0
stream_id = E0 Video Stream 0, PTS = 246.733333 ms, DTS = 146.633333 ms
0 - sequence_header_code
76 - extension_start_code
86 - extension_start_code
95 - group_of_pictures header
103 - picture_start_code
111 - extension_start_code


PACK #2, pack_start_code = 000001BA, SCR = 3.252037 ms
packet #1
stream_id = E0 Video Stream 0,
.
.
.
.
.
.
PACK #4260, pack_start_code = 000001BA, SCR = 18915.447185 ms
stream_id = BD Private Stream 1,
stream_id = BE Padding Stream,

Summary:

MPEG Packs = 4261
System headers = 38
Private Stream 1 packets = 313, total bytes = 602340
Padding Stream packets = 76, total bytes = 65166
Private Stream 2 packets = 38, total bytes = 76152
Video stream 0 packets = 3910, total bytes = 7877954

[maddrummer3301]

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[andyk]

Interesting that your test worked. But I can't make the Pioneer HS Copy anything that originated on the computer. No editing involved.

Anyway, my real wish was to transfer a few Finalized videos back to the hard disk without loss of quality, and that is more complicated again.

I think I'll just have to let it go for now.

Thanks for your help.