VS9 - DV capture split by scene not working...

[su_A_ve]

So far I've worked with analog, but now I'm ready to start working with some home videos on my new mini-DV camcorder.

The hookup is via firewire, and I can control my camera from withing VS. I'm capturing to AVI, DV Type 1.

From what I read in the tutorials, I opted to go by capturing the whole tape, since I will be be selecting scenes later.

So, when I go to do a 'split by scene' it already has selected the scenes but they are over 200 scenes, many with just a few seconds. The option to use DV Timecode is checked - I tried also doing a new scan, but it produced the same ammount of scenes.

The video shot has a few scenes but not more than 15-20. I did shoot it brand new tapes, not formated (didn't know I had to do that).

It seems that VS is trying to do a detection (I remember that when I tried to use it with analog video - it never worked as I wanted anyway).

Any ideas ?

I could try to recapture the video and do a Quick Scan prior to it - would that help ?

TIA...

[sjj1805]

The way 'split by scene' works is that every time you stopped/started your camcorder it is treated as a new scene.

[su_A_ve]

The way 'split by scene' works is that every time you stopped/started your camcorder it is treated as a new scene.

Right. This is what I was expecting. But on a one 10 minute scene, I get about 30 scenes being detected. I remember at some point I had tried the analog scene detection when I was doing analog transfers, but never worked as it was way over sensitive so never used it. But I made sure I had the DV TimeCode option selected.

Could it be an issue of the timecode resetting itself to zero ? Or is the timecode continious even though I press stop/start ? Is there a way of looking at the actual timecode in the video itself to see if there are many breaks or it is continious ?

I mean I though timecode is not the same as date/time, so if you stop/start, wouldn't the timecode continue from the previous point, and then how would you notice of a scene change ?

TIA...

[heinz-oz]

No, the time code is just that, a coded time information. Does your camcorder, by any chance, lose it's settings frequently (empty internal battery)?

What make and model is your camcorder?

What are your camcorder settings. Do you record the time code? Have you set up the time and date on it?

[su_A_ve]

No, the time code is just that, a coded time information. Does your camcorder, by any chance, lose it's settings frequently (empty internal battery)?

What make and model is your camcorder?

What are your camcorder settings. Do you record the time code? Have you set up the time and date on it?

It's a JVC GR-D93US - It is recording the time code, and date/time are correct (was never lost).

A couple of things interesting, specially after I noticed that I was capturing to my USB 2.0 external drive instead of my local one...

a) Tried DV Quick Scan. Only tested it searching at full spead. It capture correctly most of the scenes, except a few that split them in a couple of pieces (timecode shows like it skiped some frames), though most of the scenes were off by a few frames up to a couple of seconds (most of them had a 'fade to black transition' on them).

b) Tried to capture again, making sure I'm capturing to my internal drive after defraging it. But still, on just a 1.5 minutes it noticed 4 scene changes, pretty much consitent with the original capture.

c) Captured using the Split-by-scene checked. It made no difference and scenes got marked as in b)

e) Tried a Dv Quick Scan. Had it searched at 1x speed. It produced the same results as a)

Options I had were:

Source: JVC-MSDV
Format: DV
Options: DV-Type 1
Video: 720x480 DV-Type 1, NTSC
Audio: DV-Audio

I have about 10 tapes to go thru which I might end up just manually splitting (did about 20 analog already doing it the searches by hand) - From now on I'll preformat a tape.

I know a few times I might have rewinded the tape for playing and/or removed tapes. I understand now that it can cause problems with the time code going back to zero, but don't understand why scenes are getting detected. Thee are zero dropped frames, but it seems as if the time code skips, and therefore a new scene is marked.

Thought about upgrading to 10+ but...

TIA...

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi

Use the Video Editor to capture.
Select Dv as the capture format.

Create a new library page to store your captured clips/thumbnails.

If you have the Split by Scene unchecked, capture should create one file.
Although the counter lower right will indicate the individual scenes.


With this file in the library or timeline select split by scene from the left hand properties panel.
The pop up window ‘Scenes’ shows the sections.
Pressing the ‘Scan’ button will start the process.
Scanning could take some time.
The original captured file remains unchanged, the split by scene creating links/thumbnails of the main file.

The individual thumbnails will be inserted to the library or timeline.
Splitting by scene from the timeline will work with Mpeg 2 files

Ok
Capture using Split by Scene.

The individual captured scenes are separate Avi files.
The counter lower right will show the individual scenes.
When capture is finished, all individual clips will be inserted into the library and timeline.

Hope this Helps

Trevor

[sjj1805]

It is also described with a few pictures about half way down this article:
From Camcorder to DVD with VideoStudio (The capture Stage)

[su_A_ve]

Thanks for the help, but I'm aware of how it works (both during splitting at time of capture or later on).

What I'm saying is that it's not looking at the time code but it seems to be looking at scene changes or something. Like I said, on a 1hr tape I have about 10 scenes.

When I capture, it detects about 400 scenes. If I select split-by-scene, I get 400 files. If I do it after the capture, it still finds 400 scenes...

The 'best' so far has been DV Quick Scan, which acutally produced about 30 scenes (some scenes split in half) and it marked it between .5 and 2 seconds off. But because of this offset, it's not useful either...

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi

Afaik Split by Scene does look at scene changes. In particular it will recognise every time the camera is switched to record.
400 splits in one hour seems excessive, averaging one every 9 seconds.

Does this happen with all your tapes or is it just the one?
Does the video have rapid changes? for instance strobe lighting may affect the scene detection.(just a thought)
You mentioned something about Fade to Black???????????

The easiest way may be to quickly scan your dv tape within the camera, noting the time code. Each scene being about ten minutes long. You now have a list of 10 mins 24 seconds , 6 mins 44 seconds 3 mins 10 seconds etc.

Enter the time in the duration window and VS will capture the first period, repeat with the rest of the scenes.

I have a Panasonic camera and have a problem with stopping the camera after capture.
The camera keeps playing until the clips have been inserted to the timeline. This is a bit annoying when capturing specific lengths.
I have to watch the capture to stop manually.
My old Canon worked ok so it must be the camera software? That’s another problem.

Trevor

[su_A_ve]

Hi

Afaik Split by Scene does look at scene changes. In particular it will recognise every time the camera is switched to record.
400 splits in one hour seems excessive, averaging one every 9 seconds.

Does this happen with all your tapes or is it just the one?
Does the video have rapid changes? for instance strobe lighting may affect the scene detection.(just a thought)
You mentioned something about Fade to Black???????????


Trevor

I just started to do a complete uninstall and will try again. In any case, it's behaving as it would be looking at scene changes instead of noting the time-code changes. So, yes, many scenes are fast paced and have lighting changes. But it was a continous shot (no camera on/off) So no idea as to why would it be detected as such.

I have access to another system and will try there a sample of the tapes to rule out any of my hardware, and see if it's the camera that somehow it's skipping when recording ? Again, none of the tapes were preformated before (ie never thought of this)...

No idea - might try also installing VS10 trial on the other system to see if it makes a difference.

[Trevor Andrew]

Hi su_A_ve

Reformatting the Dv tape,
Recording the tape from end to end with the lens covered was recommended by my canon camera manual.
But if you use a new tape and do not preview the captured video then the time-code should be complete, even though you stop and start recording.

If you record say 10 minutes and preview the recorded video then you may start recording again on a section of tape with no time-code.
Now the time-code will start from zero. This may cause problems when capturing.

My old Canon camera could rewind slowly, frame by frame to locate the recorded time-code prior to re-recording again. The following recording continues the time-code.

You can soon see if you have got it wrong, the time-code at the end of the tape should indicate one hour or there abouts. if it indicates less then the code has restarted.

If that makes sense

Trevor

[su_A_ve]

Yup - My camera also recommends formating the tape.

But in this case I have a tape that's 60+ minutes (full tape) at the end of the time code.

Further, I see scene changes in the middle of a scene. Looking closely it seems that when I captured on the PC (or in the tape - not sure yet) it skipped a couple of frames, therefore, UVS thought it was a scene change (i'm more inclined to think it's a caputre/transfer issue)

Cause, if the timecode would reset (say you would watch something and advance till the end to a non-timed area of the new tape) the scene would actually be different than the previous one... I had this problem on a scene of a steady shot (outdoors).

I brought home a new firewire card and cable - But also I'll be reinstalling VS9 from scratch. If nothing works, I'll try it at work (new 3.0 Dual core box) in case my old P4 1.8 can't keep up... I also cleaned and defraged the capture drive...