Is bigger overall file size better?

happydog500 · Post by **happydog500** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:31 am

When I use VideoStudio 7 to Create a disc, if everything is set the same, a 1 hour video at 6000fps is 3.3GB. At 8000fps it drops to 2.6GB (No, I didn't get the two mixed up). Since the 6000 is a bigger file size, is 6000fps better then the smaller 8000fps?

heinz-oz · Post by **heinz-oz** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:44 am

You have got to have something wrong here. You are talking about 6000/8000 fps (frames per second)?? I'm sure you were refering to kbps instead. The file size is a direct function of kbps x duration. A 1 hour video (3600 sec x 6000 kbps) = 21,600,000 kb. At 8000 kbps = 28,800,000 kb.

The 8000 kbps file must be larger than the 6000 kbps one. If your results are true file sizes, you are looking at different durations or you recoded the 6000 kbps file again with 8000 kbps resulting in a much more compressed file.

The larger the kbps the better the quality (within reason), the quality will never be better than the original.

Trevor Andrew · Post by **Trevor Andrew** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 7:21 am

Hi

Just to add to what Heinz has said.

Right click the clip and select properties, do this for both clips.
Are the properties the same. Frame rate, duration audio etc.

Look at the audio settings, Mpeg audio uses a lot less memory than Lpcm.

Have a look at the links below for 'Bit Rates & File Sizes':-

Trevor

http://uk.geocities.com/trevor.andrew@b ... -size.html

GeorgeW · Post by **GeorgeW** » Thu Jun 01, 2006 11:07 am

Are these ACTUAL sizes (i.e. you generated the DVD Folders or disc, and can see the ACTUAL amount of space needed)

Or are these estimated sizes? in which case are you looking at the same estimate (i.e. there are estimates for disc space, work space, etc...)?

Was one with CBR, and the other VBR?

If everything else is the same (source clips and duration, both CBR, same audio type, etc...), then the 8000kbps should result in a larger file size...

Regards,
George

happydog500 · Post by **happydog500** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 6:11 pm

Thanks for the replys.

Here is what I do. I record from my TV Tuner card. One Hour at 8000, I have a file size of 3.48GB.

When I open VS7 to put it on a disc, it shows a default of 6000 and has the little bar at the bottom showing 3.3GB. If I go to the bottom left and set it to "High Quality", 8000 1 hour, the bar at the bottom drops to 2.6.

Hope I explaned this so you understand what's going on. Chris.

sjj1805 · Post by **sjj1805** » Fri Jun 02, 2006 6:26 pm

May I suggest:
http://www.ulead.co.uk/tech/phasedout.htm

happydog500 · Post by **happydog500** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 7:59 pm

heinz-oz wrote:
The 8000 kbps file must be larger than the 6000 kbps one.

The larger the kbps the better the quality (within reason), the quality will never be better than the original.

It's not.
From what I read in this postings, the 6000 kbs 3.3GB is better then the 8000 kbs 2.6GB?
Chris.

sjj1805 · Post by **sjj1805** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 11:58 pm

happydog500 wrote:Thanks for the replys.

Here is what I do. I record from my TV Tuner card. One Hour at 8000, I have a file size of 3.48GB.

When I open VS7 to put it on a disc, it shows a default of 6000 and has the little bar at the bottom showing 3.3GB. If I go to the bottom left and set it to "High Quality", 8000 1 hour, the bar at the bottom drops to 2.6.

Hope I explaned this so you understand what's going on. Chris.

No we don't!
1. Please complete your system specifications on your profile page.
2. Please identify your TV Tuner Card
3. Please detail how you are recording from the TV Tuner Card.
4. Please read: http://phpbb.ulead.com.tw/EN/viewtopic.php?t=8959
and then
5. Please read http://phpbb.ulead.com.tw/EN/viewtopic.php?t=27

happydog500 · Post by **happydog500** » Tue Jun 06, 2006 5:31 am

I updated my system profile.
I record from Cable TV, hooked into the TV Card, using ComproPVR 2. It's software I got with my Video Mate TV Gold + Card.

If it's late night or I'm not home, I usually program it to start my computer and record, then shut off the computer. I'll have it leave it on if I'll be back not to long after.
I have the settings for the higher bit-rate;
MPEG 2
640 x 480
8000 kbps
audio 224 kbps

When I record at the 8000 kbps, I have a file on my HD that's 3.48GB. When I put that file on a disc in VS7 using the 8000 kbps setting, It shows a size of 2.6GB. If I use the setting of 6000 kbps, It shows 3.3GB.

When I first open VS7, it's set to VCD, When I change it to DVD, the bar on the bottom goes to 3.3GB. (it's set at 6000 kbps). I then switch it to High Quality, 8000 kbps and the bar goes down to 2.6GB.

happydog500 · Post by **happydog500** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 5:45 am

sjj1805 wrote:
happydog500 wrote:Thanks for the replys.

Here is what I do. I record from my TV Tuner card. One Hour at 8000, I have a file size of 3.48GB.

When I open VS7 to put it on a disc, it shows a default of 6000 and has the little bar at the bottom showing 3.3GB. If I go to the bottom left and set it to "High Quality", 8000 1 hour, the bar at the bottom drops to 2.6.

Hope I explaned this so you understand what's going on. Chris.
No we don't!
1. Please complete your system specifications on your profile page.
2. Please identify your TV Tuner Card
3. Please detail how you are recording from the TV Tuner Card.
4. Please read: http://phpbb.ulead.com.tw/EN/viewtopic.php?t=8959
and then
5. Please read http://phpbb.ulead.com.tw/EN/viewtopic.php?t=27

I read the links. Good information, thanks! I didn't see anywhere why 6000kbps is bigger then 8000kbps tho.

sjj1805 · Post by **sjj1805** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 7:50 am

happydog500 wrote:I updated my system profile.
I record from Cable TV, hooked into the TV Card, using ComproPVR 2. It's software I got with my Video Mate TV Gold + Card.

If it's late night or I'm not home, I usually program it to start my computer and record, then shut off the computer. I'll have it leave it on if I'll be back not to long after.
I have the settings for the higher bit-rate;
MPEG 2
640 x 480
8000 kbps
audio 224 kbps

When I record at the 8000 kbps, I have a file on my HD that's 3.48GB. When I put that file on a disc in VS7 using the 8000 kbps setting, It shows a size of 2.6GB. If I use the setting of 6000 kbps, It shows 3.3GB.

When I first open VS7, it's set to VCD, When I change it to DVD, the bar on the bottom goes to 3.3GB. (it's set at 6000 kbps). I then switch it to High Quality, 8000 kbps and the bar goes down to 2.6GB.

Your recording the wrong screen size. When Videostudio is converting it then it is being converted to the correct screen size which is larger and so you end up with a larger file.

happydog500 · Post by **happydog500** » Thu Jun 15, 2006 11:16 pm

I checked in VideoStudio and both 6000kbps and 8000kbps where set to 720x480 so that can't be the problem.
Thanks for replying tho.
Chris.

heinz-oz · Post by **heinz-oz** » Fri Jun 16, 2006 12:32 am

I know, I'm repeating myself here but here it goes again:

If your file has the same duration and is encoded with 8000 kbps, it has to be bigger than the same source file encoded with 6000 kbps. If it is not, then something else must have changed also. It cannot be the same source file or encoding parameters have changed.

We cannot tell you from afar what has changed but something surely must have. In case you didn't understand my first reply, it's plain physics/mathematics, if you add 8000 kbps (kilo bits per second) to your new file for a set duration, lets say 10 sec's = 80000 kb, right? If you do the same at 6000 kbps, you will have a file 60000 kb. I know this is simplified but should clarify the situation sufficiently.

You still have not confirmed if we are talking estimated file sizes or actually rendered file sizes.

happydog500 · Post by **happydog500** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 10:35 pm

Thanks for the replies.
Sorry I'm not able to make clear what I'm trying to say.
I know the more kbps the bigger the file size. In VS7 it's not. That's the reason I posted because it's not what it's supposed to be.

Is there a way to post a screen shoot of what I'm talking about? I gave instructions on where it is happening at so people could see what happens if they did it on there machine.

In my VS7 user manual on page 94, it shows the page where this takes place (On other versions it may be on a different page but may still be under Creating a Disc).

Under "Creating a Disc" it shows the page with a yellow bar at the bottom showing 1.2GB. It also shows the "Project Settings" where to set the kbps. With mine set at 6 by default, when I set it to 8000kbps the bar goes smaller. I don't think I've done anything to the file at this point, it's what VS is telling me it will be (I think).

If you can, try what I'm talking about on your computer. It only takes a minute, you don't have to go through with it, just get to the point before it starts the processes etc....

Maybe I could email the screen shots if they can't be posted here?

Thanks again for helping, sorry I'm not clear. Chris.

THoff · Post by **THoff** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:21 pm

Please be aware that the templates that Ulead provides can change not just the bitrate of your current project, but also the encoding method (VBR vs CBR) and audio encoding. Don't go by just the name of the template, check out the properties to make sure you get what you are looking for.

If you had 6000Kbps CBR encoding with LPCM audio and then switch to a template that uses 8000Kbps (peak) VBR with 256Kbps AC-3 audio, the resulting file could in fact be smaller.