MF3 general questions. Need assistance.

[protocol_droid]

GW-

I'm doing everything from within MF3, sorry I didn't state that. So the second clip, I did fade to black within the single clip, not briding two clips together with fade to black. That is when I noticed mf3 convert what was an avi file to mpeg format?? I also just tried adding some text and it too converted to mpeg. This is without outputting at the end step. Just enhancement and then right click properties, vois la mpeg?

[protocol_droid]

Maddrummer-

Yeah, I did notice that I didn't change the audio from lpcm to dolby. So the vbr of 3600 was because video quality degraded to afford higher audio quality, right, hence the lower number?

Also, the vbr of the original avi was within spec at ~3600? That's normal?

So I take it that I can't really edit from within mf3 without this avi to mpeg change happening...that's why people use mf3 for authoring alone?

What is the purpose of the template. Would this be used only in the event of doing all transferring of dv, editing in another program and importing it into mf3's 'template' to keep everything the way I want it?

[GeorgeW]

Hi MD,

I don't have the Ulead software on this computer, but if I recall, when you select LPCM audio, it put a ceiling on the video bitrate (VBR and CBR -- and it was the same number -- "8264" because 9800-1536). This indicates to me that the 8264 is the VIDEO bitrate only, and then the audio bitrate is added on top of that (VBR or CBR)

Keep in mind that even though you specify 8264 VBR bitrate, depending on the video source length, subject matter and quality, the encoder won't necessarily encode at that bitrate -- it would leave room and use less bits for what it thought was "easy" to encode so that it had more bits for the "harder" to encode scenes.

[GeorgeW]

GW-

I'm doing everything from within MF3, sorry I didn't state that. So the second clip, I did fade to black within the single clip, not briding two clips together with fade to black. That is when I noticed mf3 convert what was an avi file to mpeg format?? I also just tried adding some text and it too converted to mpeg. This is without outputting at the end step. Just enhancement and then right click properties, vois la mpeg?

MF3 will create mpeg videos because it is an "Authoring" application. It won't output dv .avi's with your changes (assuming your source videos are dv .avi's).

The converted videos will go into a temp folder for your project.

[protocol_droid]

So it is probably better to do the editing in another program while still in dv.avi file type to keep quality before "authoring"/encoding to mpeg. So Ulead's video studio will allow you to do that,i.e. edit/enhance dv.avi and keep them as such. Then I can import them into mf3 and encode/author? Any other good editing programs out there that will keep my files in avi while 'enhancing', or is allowing the mpeg conversion while enhancing in mf3 just fine in your opinion assuming my vbr's are good from the get go?

[thecoalman]

So it is probably better to do the editing in another program while still in dv.avi file type to keep quality before "authoring"/encoding to mpeg. So Ulead's video studio will allow you to do that,i.e. edit/enhance dv.avi and keep them as such. Then I can import them into mf3 and encode/author? Any other good editing programs out there that will keep my files in avi while 'enhancing', or is allowing the mpeg conversion just fine in your opinion assuming my vbr's are good from the get go?

Using MF should be fine, if it's converting it's only converting it to whatever you have set in your project settings. I'm not familiar with it but I'd guess it's creating temporary files. It's not actually doing anything to your source file but creating a new one according to whatever template you have chosen.

Again I'm not familiar with it but most Ulead video editors use a smart render feature which can speed up the conversio to mpeg process. Any video that you preview gets cached so it doesn't have to be encoded again when you get to the final create disc menu.

There is probably a option for turning that off, there is at least on MSP. There really is no need though unless you want to speed up previewing. Turning it off though won't give you the final result in the preview since it was never converted.

[protocol_droid]

Ahh, that makes more sense to me,i.e. it's just converting it to my parameters for mpeg encoding. I thought it did this in the output stage after all editing and menu making was done. I assumed since the program said that it needs to render, i was assuming the encoding would be happening during this process too, but perhaps it's just doing it earlier when I make enhancements. I'll try some more test runs.

Oh yeah, so the 3600 vbr in my original dv.avi before enhancements is about normal? Thanks everyone for the great information. I"ve learned more here in the last two days than a full week researching myself.

[thecoalman]

Oh yeah, so the 3600 vbr in my original dv.avi before enhancements is about normal? Thanks everyone for the great information. I"ve learned more here in the last two days than a full week researching myself.

If using bits it will be a lowercase b-(kbps) if it's bytes it will be a uppercase B-kBps. I've seen the K capitilized in both instances so just pay attention to the k.

8 bits to a byte but to further the confusion there's actually 10.

[GeorgeW]

8 bits to a kilobyte but to further the confusion there's actually 10.

yikes

[thecoalman]

8 bits to a kilobyte but to further the confusion there's actually 10.

yikes

Someting a little beyond my knowledge but there's a bit before and after each 8 bit sequence.... something like that.

[GeorgeW]

I meant the 8 bits to a kilobyte comment...

[thecoalman]

I meant the 8 bits to a kilobyte comment...

a typo, since edited. Thx for pointing that out.

[protocol_droid]

Okay, so I pulled in some more dv.avi files from the dv cam and then I added some text wtihin mf3 and again it converted the dv.avi file to mpeg. I noticed though, that the properties of my clip show 7000kpbs and 256kpbs audio dolby. However, in my project settings>change mpeg settings>custom>compression settings, I have it set to 8000? So howcome the properties for the clip only show 7000? This would imply I"m falling slightly short (7000-256k)of the total 7000kpbs minimum(for high quality) I would need for 720X480 DVD playback in mpeg. Why doesn't it say 8000, so I should have 8000-256 after all is said and done?Any comments. Thanks.

[thecoalman]

The trouble is I don't have MF But 7000kbps is more than adequate for a consumer grade digtital cam. The only place you *might* see a difference is if you have high motion scenes. Generally for footage shot with say a Sony digital 8 I use 6000VBR.

Sorry I couldn't be of more help , personally I would look around in the options menu and see if you can turn off the conversion as you insert and have it do it when your project is finished...

[maddrummer3301]

Hi,

There are 8 bits to a Byte. Other bits are used for parity checking
but when the data is stored it is in BYTE format each BYTE=8 bits.
A 16 bit audio sample takes 2 bytes in memory to represent 1-16 bit sample.
I can byte that.....

George,
VBR isn't as I posted using VS8. Yea, I screwed up.
Had total_bit_rate stuck in the brain cells.
You are very correct . The audio is layered on top if the setting one
chooses in the VS8 template screen.

Different from VideoStudio 7. In VS7 with Advanced Settings activated
if you set the video_bit_rate to 8000 and looked in adv settings it
displayed:
Max_Bit_Rate = 8000kbs
Video_Bit_Rate = 7200
minimum_bit_rate = 5xxxkbs
In VS7 the video_bit_rate seems to be set .9 times lower than
the setting in the template.

The video encoder in VS8 is slightly modified from VS7.
In other realtime encoders I can set the MAX and Target bit rates.

All my notes at the time concluded to record at constant bit rate
making calculations easier.




MD

Formula: (Note* Inside parenthesis are done first)
Expressions are in kilo bytes/bits

Total_Average_Bit_Rate = ((file_size / time_in_minutes) / 60seconds) * 8bits
Example: 1 hour video on a 4.2gig dvd.
4,200,000 / 60 = 70,000 (Convert to minutes - That would be 1 minute of video, 70 megs)
70000 / 60 = 1166.67 (Convert to seconds. This is 1 second of video on the harddisk in byte format)
1166.67 * 8 = 9333.36 kbs (Convert bytes to bits)
9334kbs ( Total Bit Rate ).
Determine Video_Bit_Rate: 9334 - 1536 = 7798
Video_Bit_Rate = 7798kbs
Audio_Bit_Rate = 1536kbs (2 channel sound)
Total_Bit_Rate = 9334kbs