Duplicate Frames at Cut Point

[Bernie]

I am editing MPG home movie files captured from a VHS video recorder with project properties as follows.

PAL (25 fps)
MPEG files
24 Bits, 720 x 576, 25 fps
Lower Field First
(DVD-PAL), 4:3
Video data rate: Variable (Max. 6000 kbps)
Audio data rate: 224 kbps
MPEG audio layer 2, 48 KHz, Stereo

I like to break the video into individual scenes before I start editing to make the process of editing out dud clips easier. This can result in up to 200 scenes. Whenever I make a cut point in a clip I get the last frame at the cut point duplicated at the begining of the next resulting clip. This means that every time I make a cut I have to move the mark in point one frame forward at the next clip. Is there any way to avoid getting this duplicate frame at the next clip after a cut point?

[Ron P.]

Hi Bernie, welcome to the forums..

What I do for frame accuracy in cutting is press the tab key. This activates the playhead arrow located in the Navigation Panel, above the blue bar. You should see the blue center of the playhead flashing. Now use your left and right arrow keys to advance. Once I get close to where I want to make the cut, I use single presses on the arrow keys, which advance it one frame at a time. If I go too far, I can go back. Make sure the frame that you want to be starting the next clip is visable in the preview window. Make your cut, and that should do it.

You can also zoom in on your timeline to 1 frame, by right-clicking on the timeline and a menu will open up. Then select Zoom to, another menu will open, and you can choose 1 Frame. Now by using the above method you can see on your timeline that every time you press your arrow key, it moves 1 frame. You can also verify this by looking at the duration box (it has the numbers in this format, 00:00:00:00, which is HH:MM:SS:FF, Hours, Minutes, Seconds, Frames).

Hope that helps..

Ron P.

[Bernie]

Thanks for your reply vidoman. However, this is not quite the answer to my question. When I make a cut I get the same frame at the end and begining of resulting clips either side of the the cut point. Is there some setting that prevents these duplicate frames?

I forgot to note that I am using VideoStudio 8.01.1000.

[Ron P.]

It's been a while since I've used VS8, so I just launched it and tried what I suggested above. The methods are the same, except instead of an arrow, the blue jog bar below will flash when you tap the tab key.

On the timeline, I zoomed in to 1 frame. Then I went to a section of video where the scene changes. Advanced 1 frame at time using my keyboard, and when the image changed to the next scene, used the scissors and cut. It didn't produce a duplicate.

Where you are experiencing this duplication, is it at a gradual change in scene, or abrupt?

Ron P.

[Bernie]

Hello vidoman.

I navigate to a cut point in a clip using the Play / Stop button and Previous / Next buttons below the jog bar then click on the split video scissor icon to the right of the jog bar. The result is two separate clips with the last frame of the first clip being exactly the same frame as the first frame on the next clip (same HH:MM:SS:FF). This is more annoying than a major problem but it would be useful to find a setting that would not produce these duplicate frames either side of a cut. This happens at every point where I split the video with the scissor icon regardless where it is in the original video.

[Ron P.]

Bernie,

I've tried again to get VS8 to reproduce what you are experiencing. I'm not getting the frame duplication. I did notice that your version appears to be different. I have version 8.00.1000. I thought I had all the patches and fixes installed for it, but I must have missed one. If that's the case, then the patch/fix may be the culprit.

You might try a reinstall to see if that cures your problem..

Ron P.

[heinz-oz]

I never edit mpeg files and may be out of my depth here, here it goes anyway: When cutting your clips, you may be within a GOP with the cut. How many P and B frames make up your GOP? Try to cut at an I frame only, that should prevent duplicate I frames. The program may duplicate the I frame when you cut inside a GOP.

[Ron P.]

Oh boy.. , I overlooked the properties, I've been constantly trying with DV-AVI, I'll fire-up VS8 once more and this time use an MPEG to see if I get the same thing... be back in a minute or two...

Thanks Heinz..

**EDIT**

Well it does have to do with editing MPEGs. I loaded an MPEG2 file onto the timeline, then proceeded to make cuts. However it doesn't appear to be that noticeable. But if I use the buttons and check the time display then the time is the same for the last and first frames of the split clips. So I think that Heinz hit it the nail on the head.

Ron P.

[2Dogs]

I loaded an MPEG2 file onto the timeline, then proceeded to make cuts. However it doesn't appear to be that noticeable.

Maybe it might not seem that noticeable, but the audio will be messed up - and with enough cuts, you'll experience the dread audio out of sync issues so commonly reported. It gets much worse when you introduce transitions, and you then have the added phenomenon of macro pixels.

All of this just goes to show that it's much better to edit in AVI, not MPEG-2.

[Ron P.]

I loaded an MPEG2 file onto the timeline, then proceeded to make cuts. However it doesn't appear to be that noticeable.

Maybe it might not seem that noticeable, but the audio will be messed up - and with enough cuts, you'll experience the dread audio out of sync issues so commonly reported. It gets much worse when you introduce transitions, and you then have the added phenomenon of macro pixels.

All of this just goes to show that it's much better to edit in AVI, not MPEG-2.

I agree 100%..., I was just trying to reproduce the OPs problem. I couldn't do it with DV-AVI files, but could with MPEG. The only time I use MPEG's is when going through tutorials like Charlie Hills books. Then they are only 15-20 sec clips.

Ron P.