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a PSP guide to loving ASP

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a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby B4b5 » Thu Feb 09, 2012 3:04 am

If you're a long time PSP user you might be here because ASP has you stymied. This might help...

After talking with a few other PSP-ers, I think the problem is that ASP appears counter intuitive to new users.
It seems to produces unexpected results and appears to be illogical in its response to settings...

If you are anything like me (I'll bet you are) you don't initially spend much time with documentation; you press buttons until you see how things work.
We all know that documentation is a good thing but it probably won't help much before you understand the program - Learned by pressing buttons.

I can tell you that the button pressing route to education works very well with ASP - But only if the program is prepared to react in an understandable way.

To this end I see some small problems that when encountered in combination, will conspire to thwart early attempts at working the program.

----------EDIT-----------------
--- The Keyboard Shortcuts I complained about here were not broken. Problem resolved locally to my keyboard - now fixed.

--- The smaller problems are that a few controls like Ctl+R Ctl+Shift+R Ctl+Shift+C do something slightly different from what their descriptions imply,
--- and with slight differences between the Keyboard Shortcut and just clicking on the Control. If you are working with metadata these differences can be quite confusing.
--- It's not critical but until you get familiar with what these controls do & don't do, try to avoid the Keyboard Shortcut while you're learning.
--- The Keyboard Shortcuts I complained about here were not broken. Problem resolved locally to my keyboard - now fixed.
----------EDIT-----------------


The larger of these problems is that the documentation and the UI make it seem trivial to click on several very critical settings:
Settings>Save as Raw Default
Settings>Save as Rendered Default
Settings>Save as Camera Default
As a general rule these 3 should never be touched by an ASP novice. In fact most experienced users will get mixed-up playing with them.
Except for special cases and very small default things such as Noise Ninja On; do not put anything into these files unless you really
understand and want the results you're going to get.

If ASP is new to you; think back, if you changed any of these 2 or 3 default files put them back to their original state as supplied by Corel.
All of these default.xmp files live in--> C:\Users\Your User Name\AppData\Local\Corel\AfterShot Pro\defaults
Unless you are positive that you need a Camera default file, get rid of it. delete any .xmp file directly associated with your camera. You can do this in the file system.
The other two defaults (RAW & Rendered) can be reset from within the program; File->Preferences->Default Settings then select the default and the reset button.

With default files back to those two simple ones supplied by Corel, the only other thing to do before you start having fun - pressing buttons is to
create one Preset that you can click on to return from your experimental edits back to the pristine state that your image & metadata had before you started playing. Call it the Virgin rendering.

Unfortunately the Bibble/ASP prepackaged "ResetEverything" isn't setup very well. Using it will yield baffling results - so you'll need to make your own Preset.
Luckily it's easy to make and for those who like to do things themselves I've given full instructions in this Post-> viewtopic.php?f=90&t=45276&p=239972#p239972
The post also gives some clues as to why I put the word "Almost in the Preset name-> B4b5_ResetAlmostEverything.xmp

If you just want to see it work without building it, you can get it in my zip file here-> download/file.php?id=2377

All in all just a few simple changes to get ASP under your control. So here below are my 5 steps to the PSP users - ASP Nirvana:


1. Get DefaultRaw.xmp & DefaultRendered.xmp back to their original condition as supplied by Corel.

2. Get a Preset that reliably gets you all the way back to that Virgin rendering of your Initial settings - Even across any number of sessions.

3. Make sure B4b5_ResetAlmostEverything.xmp (or whatever you rename it) is in your user Presets directory, so you can find it inside ASP... Restart ASP.

4. Render a new TEST.RAW image from scratch.

5. HERE COMES THE FUN! - Start playing with any and all settings that you're curious about.

If you create a really bad looking image and can't figure out what to change to make nicer results, and can't imagine how to fix it
just click on B4b5_ResetAlmostEverything.xmp and prest-o change-o you're back to your Virgin rendering of your Initial settings.

You will soon learn that (except for confirmed deletion) it is IMPOSSIBLE to damage your original RAW file from within ASP. Once you feel confidence in that fact you will
realize that Bibble/ASP is an extremely simple UI with a great many controls that you can turn on off or adjust, crop re-crop, all at will, and in any order; and never damage your file.

Have fun!
Last edited by B4b5 on Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby thufor » Thu Feb 09, 2012 3:19 am

Why do you use a preset to reset image settings (especially that it doesn´t reset everything) instead of Ctrl+R?
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby B4b5 » Thu Feb 09, 2012 4:32 am

thufor wrote:Why do you use a preset to reset image settings (especially that it doesn't reset everything) instead of Ctrl+R?

Mostly because Ctl+R behaves a little differently from clicking on Settings>Apply Default Settings.
Also there seems to be a difference in the way it handles basicIPTC, depending on whether the basicIPTC data was added
before or after applying other Presets, or if the rendering is more than one session old with intervening changes.
The Preset approach produces the most reliable reset even across many session. It really does reset everything,
see my other post for a few caveats which cannot be overcome until Corel makes a few changes (in code?)...
See the link above to instructions for building the Preset and you'll see the caveats there...
If you have the time to play with the variations you'll see some unexpected results.

But the short answer is - because that is what Corel was trying to do with "ResetEverything.xmp" and I know they were on the right track,
but just executed it poorly. Corel also supplied a few other "resets" built with "Presets" and they seem to work.

Without getting way down in the weed in this reply I can tell you that there are several inconsistencies between controls and their keyboard shortcuts.
Play with them; you may be surprised. Ctrl+R Ctrl+Shift+R Ctl+Shift+C Ctl+C Ctl+V Probably more but my brain is melting from looking at them. :shock:

->EDIT Sorry thufor Ctl+C Ctl+V stuff relates to copying and pasting too much (Camera & lens data) into other images...
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby thufor » Thu Feb 09, 2012 5:50 am

B4b5 wrote:
thufor wrote:Why do you use a preset to reset image settings (especially that it doesn't reset everything) instead of Ctrl+R?

Mostly because Ctl+R behaves a little differently from clicking on Settings>Apply Default Settings.


Huh?? Could you provide an example? Ctrl+R is "Settings>Apply Default Settings" so if there is any different behaviour it's a bug and should be reported. I've been using the shortcut since... forever (well, since Bibble 5 was first released ;-) and never noticed any problem.

B4b5 wrote:Also there seems to be a difference in the way it handles basicIPTC, depending on whether the basicIPTC data was added
before or after applying other Presets, or if the rendering is more than one session old with intervening changes.


The behaviour between sessions is also consistent and documented: http://product.corel.com/help/AfterShot ... index.html
The undocumented part is about metadata, which to my understanding may not be affected by Ctrl+R (can't fully swear to this since I don't do any metadata like keywords/IPTC it ASP).

B4b5 wrote: The Preset approach produces the most reliable reset even across many session. It really does reset everything,


Everything but setting things to your Raw or Rendered Defaults... Unless of course the Preset in actual equivalent to your Defaults but this you really mys configure and like you mention in your other writeups, the preset will not reset everything if you add a new plugin or a new version of plugin or ASP will add new functionality. In which case you'll have to make sure that the preset is updated to the latest changes... This is loosing battle.

=> Ctrl+R is designed to do the right thing.

B4b5 wrote:
see my other post for a few caveats which cannot be overcome until Corel makes a few changes (in code?)...
See the link above to instructions for building the Preset and you'll see the caveats there...


I would rather think that the idea behind this preset and it being shipped by default is flawed and causes confusion for new users.

B4b5 wrote:
If you have the time to play with the variations you'll see some unexpected results.


Like I said, I have been using Bibble for years and the concept behind Ctrl+R (and Ctrl+Shift+R) works correctly and is consistent.

B4b5 wrote:
But the short answer is - because that is what Corel was trying to do with "ResetEverything.xmp" and I know they were on the right track,
but just executed it poorly. Corel also supplied a few other "resets" built with "Presets" and they seem to work.


See above -- the idea for this preset is flawed and cannot be executed correctly... I'm rather surprised that Corel did not remove it from ASP.

B4b5 wrote:
Without getting way down in the weed in this reply I can tell you that there are several inconsistencies between controls and their keyboard shortcuts.
Play with them; you may be surprised. Ctrl+R Ctrl+Shift+R Ctl+Shift+C Ctl+C Ctl+V Probably more but my brain is melting from looking at them. :shock:

->EDIT Sorry thufor Ctl+C Ctl+V stuff relates to copying and pasting too much (Camera & lens data) into other images...


Indeed there is a bit of thinking needed to grasp it at first ;-) But really the concept does not seem complex anymore once you figure it out! The link to documentation I quoted above explains quite a bit, though few more details would certainly help. I strongly suggest reading "Bibble Survival Guide" (or whatever new title will be once it's updated to ASP).
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby B4b5 » Thu Feb 09, 2012 9:58 pm

thufor wrote:Indeed there is a bit of thinking needed to grasp it at first ;-) But really the concept does not seem complex anymore once you figure it out! The link to documentation I quoted above explains quite a bit, though few more details would certainly help. I strongly suggest reading "Bibble Survival Guide" (or whatever new title will be once it's updated to ASP).

Hi thufor;
I put my replies below in the order of your questions, thanks for asking...


Ctl+R behaves a little differently from clicking on Settings>Apply Default Settings.
#-B4b5->
See more details in the Ctrl+R heading below...


Also there seems to be a difference in the way it handles basicIPTC
#-B4b5->
I haven't seen the behavior mentioned in the documentation, but see the Ctrl+R heading below.


The Preset approach
#-B4b5->
It does (can) reset "Everything" - See next topic...
Adding new Plugins would require rebuilding the preset for absolute accuracy, but that's one of the changes Corel could make.
Corel could add a small control that can rebuild the preset at will. For example after you make changes to DefautRaw.xmp or add a plugin.


COREL's "ResetEverything.xmp"
#-B4b5->
Without a doubt using the ResetEverything.xmp supplied by Corel will blow your mind - unless you own a Canon EOS 5D Mark II and shoot everything w/105mm Focal length,
and with a color temperature of 5001 tint = 1, Plus a zillion other settings that have nothing to do with your shot.
Nothing wrong with Corel's ResetEverything.xmp concept they just forgot to take all of their testing junk out and assemble it the way I did.
The changes that I allude to is some way to relate the concept of Copy Sets or some kind of similar lock on certain controls
to make the Reset Everything concept perfectly consistent; Or, see below; a way to rerun DefaultRaw.xmp which might be the best solution - also see my caveats...


Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R work inconsistently between Control click & Keyboard Shortcut.
#-B4b5->
Better than trying to describe this differently. Try this...
Go to the Metadata panel - put some stuff into the Copyright field an hit Enter and move the cursor out of the panel.
Now try keyboard Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R; nothing happens right? Next go to Edit>Settings>Apply default settings and click - nothing happens right?
Edit>Settings>Apply initial settings settings and click - Now it's gone! For the average user this is going to be confusing.
Next go back to the Metadata panel - put some stuff into the Copyright field an hit Enter and move the cursor out of the panel. Now close ASP.
Restart ASP, go back to the Metadata panel put some new & different stuff into the Copyright field an hit Enter and move the cursor out of the panel.
Go to Edit>Settings>Apply initial settings settings and click - This only takes you back to the state when you reopened the program, but the Shortcut does nothing.
Now both Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R do nothing. There's only one or two little problems here but to the uninitiated it probably looks like something new every time they see it.
If they see it!


COREL's "ResetEverything.xmp" - GOOD CONCEPT -
#-B4b5->
Corel's Reset everything concept was absolutely correct for two good reasons:
1. (It appear that) their intention was to built the Preset on a snapshot of all the exact values produced for any image using only DefaultRaw.xmp...
2. There currently does not exist, a control that would wipe the image.xmp and force ASP to rerun the image with DefaultRaw.xmp... But there should be.


COPYING:
#-B4b5->
The documentation shows how to use "Copy Sets" and using them lets one avoid copying & pasting too much data between images.
The problem is that the documentation gives no indication that "Copy Sets" is the way to avoid copying & pasting too much data between images, or why that's important.
I don't believe any new user will grasp this right away.

Same basic problem in the documentation for "To copy selective settings"

Same basic problem in the documentation for "To copy all settings"
I don't believe any new user will understand that "copy all settings" will include "all" of the settings that they didn't touch.
Pasting a setting that the user did not change has the effect of pasting a specific value into the image where no value was specified before, and should remain unset.
What that new user really wants (expects, but has no way of knowing) is to not copy & Paste those values that they didn't change;
and that's where "Copy Sets" come into play... Without a fair amount of ASP Experience I don't believe any new user will understand that,
especially because the quick start video shows how easy it is (true) to make some adjustment - copy - then paste. Now the pasted image is the same (true)
but did you really want the Focal Length to be different from how you shot the image? No, and new users is unlikely to even spot this pasted change...


thufor;
This relates to your closing lines... "But really the concept does not seem complex anymore once you figure it out!"

I am concerned that too many PSP users who already know and love their Paint Shop might give-up on ASP before they "figure it out".

You didn't ask, but here are some observations regarding Edit>Copy selective Image Settings(select All) versus Ctrl+Shift+C.
To appreciate this inconsistency get a copy of WinMerge from PortableApps.com Choose one of your images and do a Ctrl+Shift+C
paste the results into one panel of WinMerge. Next copy the same image data with Edit>Copy selective Image Settings(select All - OK)
Hit refresh on WinMerge and see the differences.

There may be better solutions to some of what I raised. Some will undoubtedly come with whatever is the next release of ASP; but that might be a long time from now
and a long time after a bunch of PSP-ers walk away from becoming ASP True Believers.
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby Rob Greenstein » Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:17 pm

B4B5 (Henry),

I sure hope you have conveyed all of your specific findings to Corel's (and Jeff's) attention via (at least) the SurveyMonkey submission method, as opposed to only presenting them here on the User Forums.
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby Ken Berry » Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:33 pm

I think this thread contains some really valuable info for newbies such as myself, so I am going to make it a "sticky". And when Corel finally pull their collective fingers out and take a decision on sub-forums, this thread can still remain a sticky in one of them! :lol:
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby afx » Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:37 pm

B4b5 wrote:Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R work inconsistently between Control click & Keyboard Shortcut.
#-B4b5->
Better than trying to describe this differently. Try this...
Go to the Metadata panel - put some stuff into the Copyright field an hit Enter and move the cursor out of the panel.
Now try keyboard Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R; nothing happens right? Next go to Edit>Settings>Apply default settings and click - nothing happens right?
Edit>Settings>Apply initial settings settings and click - Now it's gone! For the average user this is going to be confusing.

Well, Initial != Default.
And the behavior difference between the keyboard shortcut and the context menu is something I can not reproduce here.

2. There currently does not exist, a control that would wipe the image.xmp and force ASP to rerun the image with DefaultRaw.xmp... But there should be.

This is what CTRL-R does.

The problem is that the documentation gives no indication that "Copy Sets" is the way to avoid copying & pasting too much data between images, or why that's important.

Hey, they got to leave something for the ASG ;-)

but did you really want the Focal Length to be different from how you shot the image? No, and new users is unlikely to even spot this pasted change...

That happens only when the lens correction is active. And why shouldn't the values be pasted as well? It would be quite inconsistent to not copy them.

I am concerned that too many PSP users who already know and love their Paint Shop might give-up on ASP before they "figure it out".

Efficient and newbie friendly rarely go together....

cheers
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby B4b5 » Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:25 am

afx wrote:Efficient and newbie friendly rarely go together....

Hi afx;
Below I've answered in the same order as your comments/question...

The post above -> viewtopic.php?f=90&t=45373&p=240263#p240259
Might have gotten a little convoluted in the Paragraph titled: "Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R work inconsistently between Control click & Keyboard Shortcut."

So here below is as simplified as I can get it. Try this on your machine (I'm using Windows7 Home Premium)...
Go to the Metadata panel - put some stuff into the Copyright field and hit Enter, then move the cursor out of the panel. Now close ASP.
Restart ASP, go back to the Metadata panel put some new & different stuff into the Copyright field an hit Enter and move the cursor out of the panel.
Go to Edit>Settings>Apply initial settings and click: Don't use the shortcut - This only takes you back to the state (initial) when you reopened the program.
but now the Keyboard Shortcut does nothing; and now both Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R (Keyboard Shortcuts) do nothing (to this metastuff).
Can you reproduce this?

Ctrl+R seems not to "rerun" or "recreate" the initial image.xmp as initially produced by ASP using only DefaultRaw. If it did the following exercise would produce no differences; but it does:
Start with a fresh TEST.RAW image and before doing anything else, use ASP to ->Edit->XMP->Write Aftershot.xmp. This is the truest initial output that I can get.
Close ASP and in the file system rename the TEST.RAW.xmp so that ASP can't find it.
Reopen ASP - it will make a new TEST.RAW.xmp. Use one of your Presets to change a few things and put in some creator & copyright BasicIPTC stuff - Close ASP.
Reopen ASP now apply some more preset stuff and change the creator & copyright BasicIPTC stuff. You're done!
Try Edit->Settings->Apply initial settings; Do not use the Keyboard Shortcut. Next use Keyboard Shortcut Ctrl+Shift+R then use Keyboard Shortcut Ctrl+R,
and finally Edit->Settings->Apply default settings; Don't use the Keyboard Shortcut:
Close ASP and load your renamedTEST.RAW.xmp & your new Ctrl+R "recreated" TEST.RAW into WinMerge.
On my machine I see the following differences - Truly Original vs. Ctrl+R:
bopt:ltint="-41" vs. bopt:ltint="0"
bopt:ctint="-41" vs. bopt:ctint="0"
bopt:creator="" vs. bopt:creator="Good dog"
bopt:rights="" vs. bopt:rights="x-default|Good dog"

So although I don't know what ASP is doing, it seems clear that it's not "rerunning" or "recreating" TEST.RAW.xmp, using only DefaultRaw.xmp.

OK, a little effort won't hurt anyone :wink: but;
Seriously, better education on the "Copy Set" topic could go a long way especially for the newly initiated users. I think with Corel's large user base that could be important.

I tried to give a more fulsome comment about "Copy & Paste in a "Wishlist Post" here-> viewtopic.php?f=90&t=44903&p=240267#p240267

With regard to PSP, Corel, or other newbies and the not overly technically minded :shock: - As long as it doesn't hurt the ASP; newbie friendly should be good for all of us.

On that last point, I will always be with you to defend all of the good stuff that has made ASP the best that anyone can get. Now if everyone could just understand it!
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby thufor » Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:31 am

afx wrote:
B4b5 wrote:Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R work inconsistently between Control click & Keyboard Shortcut.
#-B4b5->
Better than trying to describe this differently. Try this...
Go to the Metadata panel - put some stuff into the Copyright field an hit Enter and move the cursor out of the panel.
Now try keyboard Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R; nothing happens right? Next go to Edit>Settings>Apply default settings and click - nothing happens right?
Edit>Settings>Apply initial settings settings and click - Now it's gone! For the average user this is going to be confusing.

Well, Initial != Default.
And the behavior difference between the keyboard shortcut and the context menu is something I can not reproduce here.


As afx says, Initial is not the same as Default -> ASP manual page I linked to explains the difference.
I can't reproduce the issue you described either. Tested in filesystem mode. Henry, are you working in filesystem or in catalog mode?

2. There currently does not exist, a control that would wipe the image.xmp and force ASP to rerun the image with DefaultRaw.xmp... But there should be.

This is what CTRL-R does.


Not quite: metadata is not wiped out, e.g. keywords, color label, star rating, etc. survive Ctrl+R.
Implementation of "wipe everything out and apply Default.xml" could be useful.

afx wrote:
The problem is that the documentation gives no indication that "Copy Sets" is the way to avoid copying & pasting too much data between images, or why that's important.

Hey, they got to leave something for the ASG ;-)


Where ASG = ASP Survival Guide ;-) Nevertheless, some information could be improved in the manual, like a note that "Set to Default Setting" doesn't clear keywords, etc.

but did you really want the Focal Length to be different from how you shot the image? No, and new users is unlikely to even spot this pasted change...

That happens only when the lens correction is active. And why shouldn't the values be pasted as well? It would be quite inconsistent to not copy them.


I agree with Henry that pasting lens name and focal length to an image by default makes no sense... This should only be possible by explicit request using selective copy.

I am concerned that too many PSP users who already know and love their Paint Shop might give-up on ASP before they "figure it out".

Efficient and newbie friendly rarely go together....


Still, some concepts that are challenging to understand at first should probably be documented with clear examples explaining them in very simple ways. That would go a long way to help newbies.

Henry,

I agree with Rob that this is very valuable input from you that should be communicated to Corel. That way they will get a very good view of some ASP features and documentation shortcomings from a point of view of a new user. This should give them a chance to improve things for new users (for example by improving docs).

Cheers,
thufor
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby B4b5 » Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:53 am

thufor wrote:That way they will get a very good view of some ASP features and documentation shortcomings from a point of view of a new user. This should give them a chance to improve things for new users (for example by improving docs).

Cheers,
thufor

Hi thufor; I'm not responding to your whole post because I think you missed my previous reply to afx - just above.
-----EDIT-----> I'm in file system...

I'll comment on your last statement about new users.

Did you you think I'm a new user - I've been using Bibble/ASP for about six years; that's probably why I love it so much! :D
Last edited by B4b5 on Fri Feb 10, 2012 3:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby B4b5 » Fri Feb 10, 2012 2:48 am

Ken Berry wrote:I think this thread contains some really valuable info for newbies such as myself, so I am going to make it a "sticky". And when Corel finally pull their collective fingers out and take a decision on sub-forums, this thread can still remain a sticky in one of them! :lol:

Thank you Ken;

I'm hoping it also inspires a PSP expert to adopt ASP so fully that one of them tries to figure out how to get a PaintShop newbie like me up to speed.

I think it's going to be great when a bunch of us learn how to wring the last drop of juice out of both programs used in combination... ASP first, naturally! :wink:
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby DocBrown » Fri Feb 10, 2012 9:29 pm

You know guys, I've been a Bibble user since Adobe bought Pixmantec in 2006. I've tried and used nearly every RAW conversion tool and photo editor on the market (free and paid for). This thread, though well intentioned, is nothing short of extremely hard to follow. And I'm fairly experienced with Bibble 5/ASP. If this was a thread on how an ASP user could get to love PSP, I'd be uninstalling PSP right now. Its really not as complex as this thread makes it out to be.

The best part of your post Henry is right here:

B4b5 wrote:So here below are my 5 steps to the PSP users - ASP Nirvana:

1. Get DefaultRaw.xmp & DefaultRendered.xmp back to their original condition as supplied by Corel.

2. Get a Preset that reliably gets you all the way back to that Virgin rendering of your Initial settings - Even across any number of sessions.

3. Make sure B4b5_ResetAlmostEverything.xmp (or whatever you rename it) is in your user Presets directory, so you can find it inside ASP... Restart ASP.

4. Render a new TEST.RAW image from scratch.

5. HERE COMES THE FUN! - Start playing with any and all settings that you're curious about.



Though I don't entirely agree with some of your findings, this list is concise and gets to the root of what an aspiring ASP user should be doing to get started. I would only add that a new ASP user keep in mind that a RAW convertor at its heart is to not replace photo editors like PSP or Photoshop, but to gain greater control over what was captured by the camera. And you are correct when you stated "learn how to wring the last drop of juice out of both programs used in combination... ASP first, naturally!". I said in a previous thread that I think PSP users aren't really sure how ASP fits into their work flow.
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Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby B4b5 » Fri Feb 10, 2012 9:56 pm

DocBrown wrote:You know guys, I've been a Bibble user since Adobe bought Pixmantec in 2006. I've tried and used nearly every RAW conversion tool and photo editor on the market (free and paid for). This thread, though well intentioned, is nothing short of extremely hard to follow. And I'm fairly experienced with Bibble 5/ASP. If this was a thread on how an ASP user could get to love PSP, I'd be uninstalling PSP right now. Its really not as complex as this thread makes it out to be.

The best part of your post Henry is right here:

B4b5 wrote:So here below are my 5 steps to the PSP users - ASP Nirvana:

1. Get DefaultRaw.xmp & DefaultRendered.xmp back to their original condition as supplied by Corel.

2. Get a Preset that reliably gets you all the way back to that Virgin rendering of your Initial settings - Even across any number of sessions.

3. Make sure B4b5_ResetAlmostEverything.xmp (or whatever you rename it) is in your user Presets directory, so you can find it inside ASP... Restart ASP.

4. Render a new TEST.RAW image from scratch.

5. HERE COMES THE FUN! - Start playing with any and all settings that you're curious about.



Though I don't entirely agree with some of your findings, this list is concise and gets to the root of what an aspiring ASP user should be doing to get started. I would only add that a new ASP user keep in mind that a RAW convertor at its heart is to not replace photo editors like PSP or Photoshop, but to gain greater control over what was captured by the camera. And you are correct when you stated "learn how to wring the last drop of juice out of both programs used in combination... ASP first, naturally!". I said in a previous thread that I think PSP users aren't really sure how ASP fits into their work flow.

Hi and thanks DocBrown;

Yeah, I might have wandered pretty far into the woods. Just trying to catch the newb's and drag them back out before they set & readjust defaults so much that ASP seems worthless to them.

All in all you have it just right.
B4b5
 

Re: a PSP guide to loving ASP

Postby afx » Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:18 am

B4b5 wrote:Go to Edit>Settings>Apply initial settings and click: Don't use the shortcut - This only takes you back to the state (initial) when you reopened the program.
but now the Keyboard Shortcut does nothing; and now both Ctrl+R and Ctrl+Shift+R (Keyboard Shortcuts) do nothing (to this metastuff).

Can you reproduce this?

As usual, the keyboard shortcut and the menu entry work identical.
As I wrote elsewhere, your box is hosed if that is not identical.

The reset to defaults will not clear metadata, it will only set metadata when there is some meta set in the defaults, but if the defaults for meta are empty, your metadata is not cleared.

bopt:ltint="-41" vs. bopt:ltint="0"
bopt:ctint="-41" vs. bopt:ctint="0"

This looks some rubbish from improperly initialized variables which shows up in the initial raw file.
The data is irrelevant though.


bopt:creator="" vs. bopt:creator="Good dog"
bopt:rights="" vs. bopt:rights="x-default|Good dog"

Works as desigend.
AS will not delete your metadata when you reset to defaults, it would only overwrite if you had meta set in the defaults.
Otherwise, my camera set copyright would be be deleted by an empty copyright in the defaults...

cheers
afx
Send bugs to the Monkey // AfterShot Kickstart Guide // sRGB clipping sucks and Adobe RGB is just as bad
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